This is a rush transcript from "The Story," March 1, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
MARTHA MACCALLUM, FOX NEWS CHANNEL HOST: Hey there, Bret. Good to see you. Breaking tonight, President Trump defiant about trade and royaling the market. New insight tonight into why, as we watch a tale of two presidencies and two White Houses. One is a White House under siege, the other plowing through an aggressive agenda. So, while Veteran Reporter, Carl Bernstein and others, paint a picture of a White House in chaos.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CARL BERNSTEIN, VETERAN REPORTER: There is now a subtext that people in the White House will say to you, it is unclear to them whether Donald Trump can effectively govern, whether is he capable of it in terms of his own abilities, conduct, and whether or not things have gotten to the point that wheels are coming off of this presidency.
BOB WOODWARD, ASSOCIATE EDITOR, THE WASHINGTON POST: It's not clear who has authority or what authority.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: Woodward and Bernstein, but there's also this side of the coin which is rooted more on the policy side. Senator Joe Manchin was asked if the way that this president is doing things is leading to a more productive White House.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOE MANCHIN, D--WEST VIRGINIA: I think it's -- the more transparency the more openness. You can see a person who's willing to engage and talk about it. He's not afraid to say, hey, maybe the people who've supported me before might not like my position, but I think it's where we should go as a country. That's your leadership. That's what you are supposed to do.
And that's what he's showing right now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: So, which is it and can they co-exist as the president fends off the Russia investigation and simultaneously begins planning his re- election campaign. In moments, we'll talk to Bill Bennett, but first on another day of huge developments, let's analyze what's going on with Marc Thiessen, who worked in the George W. Bush White House and is a Fox News Contributor; and Philippe Reines, a Former Advisor to Hillary Clinton.
Good to see you both tonight.
MARC THIESSEN, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR AND FORMER SPEECH WRITER FOR PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH: Good to see you, Martha.
MACCALLUM: Very different situations portrayed. I mean, you can flip around dial, and you think that you're living basically on two completely different planets, Marc.
THIESSEN: Yes, absolutely, and look, both things can be true; there can be chaos in the White House and the president can be racking up incredible accomplishments. In fact, I think, it's demonstrably true that both things are true. If you look at his first year of accomplishments, it really is quite remarkable -- first comprehensive tax reform in 30 years, the biggest regulatory roll back in American history, the economy booming, you've got foreign policy, he's driven ISIS out of its caliphate. He has reversed Obama's withdrawal from Afghanistan, he enforced Obama's red line in Syria -- it was something he wouldn't do. He got Gorsuch on the Supreme Court. I mean, the accomplishments are there. But at the same time, I think it's also obvious that there's chaos in the White House. We're going to be on our fourth White House communications director in one year. And we may be on our third National Security adviser in one year. So, if he is doing this much, with this much chaos, imagine if there was no chaos how much he would accomplish.
MACCALLUM: So, Philippe, I guess that, you know, it raises a question, you know, which really matters more? I mean, some people work in a chaotic environment barely well. I think the one person who doesn't seem all that ruffled by any of it is the president.
PHILIPPE REINES, POLITICAL CONSULTANT AND FORMER SENIOR ADVISOR TO HILLARY
CLINTON: Well, first of all, Marc wins the spin award for that last comment. I think.
MACCALLUM: Congratulations, Marc.
THIESSEN: Thank you.
REINES: I think it's both right in the sense that, Martha, you would ask whether or not they can co-exist. And I don't think they can, and I think while jokes aside, Marc is saying that imagine if he got his act together, there's no indication they would be. I mean, Marc himself worked the beginning of the Bush administration, it is not uncommon for the first year of a White House or for an administration to have growing pains. That's not what this is. And this is also not governing by chaos, this is unintended chaos. And I don't think that that is serving the president or the American people well.
MACCALLUM: But then why, so, how do you explain the fact that he's working through his agenda in a way that the people who elected him seem to be pretty happy with?
REINES: Well, look, I mean, I think you both know that I had the privilege of playing Donald Trump when Secretary Clinton practiced her debates. And the thing I said over and over again that drove her and everyone crazy was that on day one, I was going to pull us out of NAFTA, I was going to repeal ObamaCare, it was something really beautiful. And we're going to have just an absolute wall. And I know that there are numbers from heritage and from the White House itself, but he has gone 0 for three on the things that he promised the American people he would do on the very first day.
MACCALLUM: I don't know if that's true. Marc? Mark, go ahead.
REINES: I think that's a factual matter.
THIESSEN: I give you back the spin award. I give you back the spin award you just gave me. I mean, look, it's clear that he didn't get ObamaCare done. But, you know, one of the reasons why we don't have a wall --
MACCALLUM: But they did repeal the individual mandate as part of the tax bill, which had a huge impact on it.
THIESSEN: Nobody gets everything they wanted.
REINES: ObamaCare is the law of the land.
THIESSEN: As I recall, Barack Obama's promise was that he was going to pass comprehensive immigration reform in the first year, and didn't get that done.
REINES: So, we agree. A failure is a failure.
THIESSEN: In his case, he didn't try. So, I mean, look, I think it's very clear, the spin aside, that Donald Trump has accomplished a lot in his first year. But he's undermining -- I agree with Philippe that he's undermining it. I mean, you know, you've got -- there's so much leaking going on. I think the only people who haven't leaked from this White House are Barron and Melania.
REINES: And I'm not even sure that I could vouch for them.
MACCALLUM: That's funny.
THIESSEN: He sets that tone. He sets the tone.
MACCALLUM: Let me ask -- I want to ask Philippe a question about, for instance, the gun issue where the president has gone to the left of his constituency on this.
MACCALLUM: And you know, you heard Joe Manchin talking about he's probably the only Republican who could kind of get away with finding some middle ground on this issue. So, if you live in an environment where you want to see change on that front, is that something that you are pleased with in this presidency?
REINES: The problem is he's not going to get away with it, and the Democrats aren't the problem. You know, if you watch the faces in the room yesterday, at while I'll admit was an extraordinary event where the president said many things that I think Americans on the whole want to see in terms of gun control, they won't happen because the Republican Party, his own party.
MACCALLUM: The Republicans are saying, if there's anybody who can make it happen, it's this president.
REINES: Well, someone hasn't told the NRA that, and someone hasn't told John Cornyn that, and someone hasn't told John Thune that. Look, I'd like to be sitting here in a month and of all the things I'm wrong about to say that the president actually achieved gun control measures that he's talked about. I think that's a very, very tall order. And I think, you know, you saying who do we trust on these numbers. I think we have to trust our own eyes. And there's another element here. There's an element of not just what you are doing, but how you are doing it. And I think, you know, most Americans, including most Republicans don't like seeing the president acting out on Twitter every day. Most Americans, including most Republicans, don't like that his children and that his in-laws work in the White House. And, again, I think he's his worst -- he's his own worst enemy, and that's not a style of governing. And I think if you look at it.
THIESSEN: Hillary Clinton worked in the White House in her husband's administration, so there's a precedent there.
MACCALLUM: Good point. You're both very good. I got to leave it there, though, guys. Thank you very much. Good to see you both tonight.
So, coming in now to join us, Bill Bennett who worked for both the Reagan Administration and also George H.W. Bush's administration, he's the Host of 'The Bill Bennett' podcast and a Fox News Contributor. So, Bill, you heard the conversation and really, it's like there are parallel universes going on. And people in the White House will admit that, you know, there are folks who work there who are burnt out. I don't think that's completely unusual that there is a lot of turnover. But I don't think that anybody anticipated that a Donald Trump White House was going to a sort of, you know, calm environment, you know, given what we know about the way he works.
BILL BENNETT, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR AND HOST OF THE BILL BENNETT PODCAST: Yes, well up until the time of the campaign, the most famous utterance of Donald Trump was you're fired. So, we're seeing a fair amount of that going on. You know, there are subtleties here. The poet E.E. Cummings says, a great order can be a disorder -- think of that smooth, friendly, elegant, charming Obama Administration for eight years not getting a lot done and getting a lot of negativity done in the country. Meanwhile, Cummings says, a disorder can create an order. As you pointed out, Martha, as you suggested maybe there's some, you know, some point to this -- if not chaos, to this conflict. And it's -- it has a creative aspect to it. But, we need to take it seriously. He can't have all the people who are most loyal to him leaving. But, there is no question. I love the line from The Wall Street Journal today that said: we disagree with Donald Trump in many things, except for policy. Well, that's a pretty big deal when you're a president.
MACCALLUM: It's a fascinating sort of dynamic. And I think you hear it -- I heard Ben Sasse -- Bret was interviewing Ben Sasse. Bret went down a list of all these things and said, do you agree with this, do you agree with that, and yes, I do, I do, I do. But I don't like the way that he does things. When you talk about the people who have left the White House, Anthony Scaramucci who was one of the -- you know, one of the group who served as communications director, he was there for a very short time, lashing out. We're seeing a lot of lashing out from people who are no longer getting the access that they wanted. Just watch this. I want to get your reaction to this as someone who's worked in the White House twice.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANTHONY SCARAMUCCI, FORMER WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: I see the fact that John has denied access to the White House of the president's strongest loyalist. There's a fear, culture of fear, culture of intimidation, people afraid to talk to each other.
CHRIS CUOMO, CNN: Coming from the president? They are afraid of the president.
SCARAMUCCI: No, I think it's the chief of staff.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: A lot of people want to push out John Kelly, Bill. What do you think?
BENNETT: Yes. Well, I think John Kelly fired him, didn't he?
MACCALLUM: He certainly did. And he admitted in that interview, to his credit, that that was one of the reasons he's mad.
BENNETT: Yes, and Anthony Scaramucci comes from a culture where, you know, you settle your debts, and settle your debts in public. I think what he's proud to say often is I plunge the knife into you, but I plunge it into your chest. So, you know, there's that going on, too. But, let's look at the bottom line. I think the bottom line is the accomplishments. Marc ticked them off better than I could, a lot, both domestically and foreign policy. The judges, ISIS, the economy and so on, all these regulations.
And the federal court bench is so important. But you can't isolate yourself forever, and you have to have a team. The amazing thing it seems to me, Martha, hasn't been commented on, is he's doing this under staffed.
Not only are people leaving, they don't have enough people at the White House, the cabinet departments are understaffed -- partly the fault of the Democrats. But, if as we heard earlier, you imagine what they could do with order, imagine what they could do with a full team.
MACCALLUM: Yes, you know, I mean, it is interesting when you look at governing versus campaigns, right? And there's two different kinds of teams that you need in place. And I think that some of that is the struggle that we see going on with people who were long time loyalists, you know, who are now, perhaps, you know, leaving, and people who are better for governing -- not mentioning Hope Hicks there because I think she was pretty well thought of all around. Go ahead, Bill.
BENNETT: But -- well, Hope Hicks, though, I can see there's another thing, the media thing. Let me be politically incorrect. Hope Hicks serves him very loyally. As you hear the story about Hope Hicks, they show one picture after another of Hope Hicks. It's like a model's portfolio. The woman is absolutely stunning. Absolutely gorgeous. You can't comment on that, I guess, these days, but everyone knows it to be true. Actually, your colleague Ainsley commented on it. You know, if she looked like John Sununu, she would not be getting this kind of attention in the media or me
-- I don't mean to pick on John -- or me.
MACCALLUM: No, it's not going to take away from what she has done, because as I said, she has been really admired by everybody who works with her and we worked with her, too. But I get what you're saying and I think there's merit to it?
BENNETT: I don't detract at all from her abilities. I don't detract at all from her abilities.
MACCALLUM: No, I'm not.
BENNETT: But we know what's going on here and what the game is. So, there's a lot of media hyperbole about this.
MACCALLUM: She's a fascinating character.
BENNETT: Think of the Nixon White House -- but she's OK, OK.
MACCALLUM: Thank you, Bill. Good to see you tonight. Bill Bennett, as always. My pleasure.
BENNETT: Good to see you.
MACCALLUM: So, still to come tonight, as Parkland high school students return to the school for the first time since the shooting, survivors of the 1999 columbine massacre share firsthand what they need to understand and they need to know about what comes now in the weeks and months ahead of them as they try to heal.
And Russian President Vladimir Putin says that his nukes are better than ours and they could easily destroy the United States -- he has animations to prove it. Is this just talk or are we on the verge of a second cold war? Ambassador John Bolton with his take on that and General Kelly's dire new warning about ISIS and how it is morphing and how we need to be concerned again about them here at home.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN KELLY, WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: They still have that one particular lust in life and that is to come here and do as much damage as they can.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: Developing tonight, Vladimir Putin revealing an arsenal of new weapons, including nuclear weapons that he claims renders the U.S.'s equipment basically useless. It comes just weeks ahead of the Russian presidential election, which cannot be lost in this conversation and Putin, of course, is expected to wins as he always does. So, is this more bluster than substance or are we on the verge of a new dynamic in the latest version of the cold war? Chief National Correspondent Ed Henry live in Washington tonight with the story. Hi, Ed.
ED HENRY, FOX NEWS CHANNEL CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Martha, great to see you. You properly noted the key context here which is that election just being days away so Vladimir Putin is trying to rile up his political base. But this is still deadly serious, because I've spoken to some top U.S. military officials who say he's, in fact, building up his nuclear capabilities and vowing that these weapons will be immune from interception, so there's basically no stopping them. Putin talking about closing in on development of a new and improved kind of nuclear weapon that allegedly can override American missile defenses.
Warning Russia has successfully tested out actual nuclear propulsion engines that enable under water drones paired up with nuclear missiles to travel great distances one top military analyst I spoke to said what's really happening here is Putin does not have the money to build up both conventional weapons and nuclear weapons. So, he's picking the more lethal one while also trying to exploit the fact that during the eight years of President Obama, he did not invest enough in the U.S. nuclear arsenal, something President Trump has been vowing to reverse. And in fact, U.S.
officials told our own Jennifer Griffin today that Putin is worried about the Pentagon's plans to develop two new tactical nuclear weapons. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VLADIMIR PUTIN, PRESIDENT OF THE RUSSIA: Russia was and remains a big nuclear state. But no, no one wanted to speak with us constructively. No one has listened to us. You listen to us now.
SARAH HUCKABEE SANDERS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: And now, because of the new defense budget of $700 billion, our military will be far stronger than ever. As the president's nuclear posture review made clear, America is moving forward to modernize our nuclear arsenal and ensure our capabilities are unmatched.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: Now, in other words, the White House is trying to counter Putin which runs counter, of course, to the narrative Democrats are pushing around Special Counsel Robert Mueller's probe that the president will not stand up to Putin. In fact, it was little noticed, but today as well, the Trump State Department revealed it's approving a big military arms sale to Ukraine worth $47 million. So, it can defend itself from Russia, that includes 210 javelin anti-tank missiles -- a reversal of the Obama administration's decision to not send heavy arms and only provide non- lethal aid to Ukraine. This is a big deal, Martha.
MACCALLUM: Ed, thank you very much. Here now, Ambassador John Bolton, Former U.S. Ambassador to the U.N. and Fox News Contributor. What do you make of this move today, ambassador?
JOHN BOLTON, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR AND FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO THE U.N.: Well, let's try and separate the hype from the reality. It is a fact that under Obama, American military spending declined dramatically -- 1.5 trillion less than the Bush projections if you exclude the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. This is huge. And so, the Trump budget, while it's sizeable increase doesn't come close to addressing over the long term, the gap that Obama created, that's number one. Number two, what Putin has talked about here with these new missiles, nuclear powered missile, cruise missiles that fly very low over the surface, the water and the land, and sort of pop up at the target. They're not ballistic missiles which follow ballistic missile trajectory. It's something they've been working on for a long time. So, are we.
How operational they are? I don't know. Is it a week before the Russian election? Sure. Does Vladimir Putin have the slightest doubt who's going to win that? He knows how to fix elections when he wants to. I think this is a further effort to see whether the Trump administration will push back.
And I think it needs to, I think there needs to be a strategic response to this, to help give confidence to our friends in Europe and around the world, that we're not going to but the up with this kind of Russian effort. I don't think it's a new cold war, but I do think it's Vladimir Putin trying to reassert Russian predominance in Eastern Europe, Eastern and Central Europe in the space of the former Soviet Union.
MACCALLUM: All right. I want to get your thoughts on one other subject before I let you go. This is General Kelly talking about ISIS.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: They have morphed, and they're coming. They're returning to Europe and they're not like defeated. They're just like morphing into something different, and they still have that one particular lust in life, and that is to come here and do as much damage as they can.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLTON: Sure, the defeat of the ISIS territorial caliphate is a plus, obviously. But the slow roll of the whole military effort, especially during the Obama administration allowed a lot of ISIS fighters in leadership to exfiltrate out of Syria and Iraq to go to Libya, to go to Somali, to go to Afghanistan, Pakistan. And I think the terrorist threat remains. And the Middle East, while we're on the subject is in chaos. And for example, the latest news that North Korea is selling Syria chemical weapons, it goes with the reactor North Korea built in Syria that Israel destroyed in 2007. So, if you want a projection of the future in the Middle East once North Korea gets nuclear weapons, sales to Iran, sales to any would be nuclear state. It's -- it remains a very dangerous world and a lot of due bills are coming due in the Trump administration.
MACCALLUM: Very dangerous world. Ambassador Bolton, thank you very much. Good to see you as always. So, coming up next here. A bombshell Fox News exclusive, raising this question tonight: would the Parkland shooting have had a very different outcome if police had acted differently in those crucial initial moments? That picture may tell the story. Broward Deputy Sheriff, Jeff Bell, breaking news here tonight. He claims that what he's going to tell us could've cost lives. And several new investigations just launched in the USA Gymnastic sexual abuse scandal, whatever happened to holding the people accountable? Olympic Gold Medalist and Victim, Jordyn Wieber, is here live with her push for change in her sport.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JORDYN WIEBER, MEMBER OF U.S. WOMEN'S GYMNASTICS TEAM: I'd even talked to my teammates, Aly Raisman and McKayla Maroney, about this treatment and how uncomfortable it made us feel. None of us really understood it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: Breaking tonight on THE STORY, a bombshell exclusive, Fox News report about Florida's police response to the Parkland shooting, and why in the crucial first moments of action, officers were apparently told to stand down and remain outside while the shooter was in the building, instead of storming that building, which is the procedure that they are supposed to follow. Take a look at these dispatch logs obtained by Fox News. At 2:32 p.m., a full 11 minutes after the shooting began, and police still didn't know where Nikolas Cruz was. They were commanded to form a perimeter, rather than go into the school. And by the time the SWAT team did decide to enter, Cruz was already a few minutes away from the building buying a drink at a Subway restaurant, as you remember he had found his way out with other students as they were exiting the building, terrified for their lives. Here now exclusively, Broward Deputy Sheriff Jeff Bell. Thank you very much Sheriff Bell for being here tonight.
JEFF BELL, BROWARD COUNTY DEPUTY SHERIFF: Thank you for having me.
MACCALLUM: The procedure says that they need to directly run into a building when there is a school shooting happening. So, why did they not do that?
BELL: Well, that's the million-dollar question on that, why weren't the first units directed to go into the building and go, go, go as we're trained to too that. The call logs that had been presented to me, and looking at those, they appear to be authentic and if those logs are correct and those commands should've been directed to get into the building, not set up the perimeter first on that.
MACCALLUM: Who made the call to stand down or to stage as it was termed in that dialogue?
BELL: Well, in the notes, your producers provided to me recognizes as 17- S-1, which would stand for 17-Sierra-1, which would be the captain of Parkland to give that command.
MACCALLUM: What do you think we need to have in terms of information to figure out what happened here? What do they need to be forthcoming with in terms of information so that everybody can figure out what happened here, so that it never happens again?
BELL: Well, I think what the union is prepared to state tonight is that we're coming out and we're going to request total transparency from the sheriff and the sheriff's office. Our deputies that are working the streets are getting attacked by public comments, are being called cowards in restaurants and coffee shops, and that has to stop. So, the only way that we're going to be able to heal as an agency and heal as a community and move forward is to be completely transparent with the public. If we did something wrong, we did something wrong. If we did not do anything wrong, then that's great, also. But we have to get past the finger pointing and the political posturing in this county right now, so that we can begin to heal and focus on the true issues that are behind this terrible tragedy which is the mental health status and this promise program in Broward County that we have.
MACCALLUM: In terms of Sheriff Israel, is he going to be forthcoming with these videotapes? I mean, I think back to the Las Vegas shooting, we still have never seen the videotapes. So who has control over these tapes? Who has control over the 911 calls so that the timeline can be absolutely, positively, locked down and everyone can understand who made these calls and why.
BELL: Well, the dispatch centers will have access to the 911 calls both at Coral Springs and the sheriff's office. We'll have that. The school board.
MACCALLUM: But who has to OK releasing it?
BELL: Oh, that's going to be from the sheriff's office itself and FDLE.
MACCALLUM: And do you believe he will?
BELL: That is a question I do not know the answer to. I can only plead with the sheriff and the sheriff's office to release this information, so that a deputies can stop being attacked in public and being called cowards, which rightfully should not be called, the actions of a few people should not taint the hard working men and women of the Broward sheriff's office and the other law enforcement officers. Because of the political posturing that we have going on right now in Broward County, we've forgotten about the real issue and we failed to give proper recognition to some of the people that risked their lives that day going into the building. For example, the Broward County SWAT team, the Broward County crime scene and the canine unit and the Coral Springs police departments that selflessly went inside not knowing if the shooter was inside or not. Those guys have been the forgotten topic in this. And Mr. Cruz is suddenly not the topic of the conversation. It's about whether or not something did or did not happen. And we need to move past that to get forward with the healing process down here.
MACCALLUM: Sheriff, thank you very much. And obviously, we will, you know, I know no one wants to hear these calls or see these tapes in many ways. But they have to be seen and they have to be heard as you point out in order to figure out where the accountability lies and to get to the stage where we can learn really valuable lessons from what happened here.
Sheriff, thank you, good to see you tonight.
BELL: Thank you.
MACCALLUM: Also tonight, the search for answers continues as Parkland students and staff bravely reenter their school for day two. My next guests know all too well what they go through. Former Columbine principal, Frank DeAngelis, and Columbine teacher, Paula Reed, have offered honest, and at times, hard-to-here insight. In a USA Today piece, D'Angelo says, quote, the smell of the food in the cafeteria can trigger memories for some students. A fire alarm sound certainly will. So might sirens or the sound of a slamming door, even camouflage clothes, or the sight of police cars can frighten kids. Frank DeAngelis and Paula Reed, join me now. Good to hear from both of you. You know too well and firsthand what this feels like. I thought that your assessment, Frank, was so potent in terms of the triggers that exist for these kids. What advice do you have for them?
FRANK DEANGELIS, FORMER COLUMBINE HIGH SCHOOL PRINCIPAL: Well, I think just being aware of it. And one of the things, you know, Paula and I were having a conversation before coming on air, and we wish that we would have had the help that we're able to give now and the people from Sandy Hook and some of the other places because, for us, it was a lot of trial and error. And I know when doors slammed or even a car back firing, and I remember the first day back over Chatfield High School because we couldn't go into Columbine, parents had put up an arch way of balloons and balloons started popping and kids started diving on the ground. Stuff that we never thought about that would re-traumatize these kids. The difficult things they're all in different places and depending on where they were that day, those triggers could be more intense or less intense for others. And it was a learning process for all of us.
MACCALLUM: Paula, you said -- or I think it was you or another teacher who was quoted in the piece said that the kids -- their brains are traumatized. And it's hard for a traumatized brain to learn. So how do you sort of have, you know, build that transition for these kids to get them back to the point where they can accept learning again in an open way?
PAULA REED, COLUMBINE HIGH SCHOOL TEACHER: Well, it's not so much an acceptance issue as it is that trauma actually does rewire the brain and actually makes changes in the brain that take a while to heal from. And so, what you kind of have to do for quite a while is you play school. You make sure it looks like school, it feels like school. But new learning is not something that can happen right away. They do have to get to the point where they feel safe again. And they can focus on their studies. And it's very possible that they won't be fully back to that place even by the end of the year, given the time of the year right now. So, it's a matter of making it feel normal again. But, for example, instead of having my students do all of their reading because your powers of concentration really get shot in trauma, I read out loud to them and they followed along.
And that way they had both, you know, the hearing and the vision and it made it go faster. It's also sort of comforting and, you know -- even in a high school level when you've gone through something like this, there's worse things than feeling, kind of, back in second grade in terms of just the emotional comfort.
MACCALLUM: I think you make an excellent point and it's good advice. Frank, you know, in terms of going forward and, you know, when they came back there were all these people there, all the police there, everybody cheering them on. They had horses there and animals and everything they could think of to make them feel comfortable. But all that goes away in time and then what do you recommend?
DEANGELIS: Well, what I told them and I have been in contact with Principle Thompson and cabinet -- superintendent cabinet, and I said it's a marathon and not a sprint. And I think the thing that's so frustrating at times is they're going to have some great days and thinking gosh, everything is getting back to where it was and then something happens. A fire alarm. There may be a threat. And all of a sudden they're re- traumatizing and they're saying, oh, my gosh, we're right back to where we were. And I said this is part of that healing process that there's going to be ups and downs and everything is going to be there. It's going to be a long time. And one of things people will ask is when is it going to get back to normal. You know, it's been a month. Why are you still concerned about this? We had to redefine what normal is. This is a lifelong process. You know, these scars they say will heal with time. But the scars that they get will be there with us forever and it will be for them.
MACCALLUM: Frank and Paula, thank you very much for being here. Good to hear from you tonight. Good advice.
REED: Thank you.
MACCALLUM: So coming up next, several new investigations have just been launched into the USA Gymnastics handling of former team doctor, Larry Nassar, and the sexual abuse allegations. And where else they're now investigating of other people who were connected to all of this. Olympic gold medalist, Jordyn Wieber, was one of the victims and she joins me next on what needs to be done to protect future athletes and future gold medal winners like her. We'll be right back.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WIEBER: Our bodies were all hanging by a thread when we were in London. Who was the doctor that USA G. sent to keep us healthy and help us get through? The doctor that was our abuser. The doctor that is a child molester.
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MACCALLUM: Some big new developments tonight in the USA Gymnastics sexual abuse investigation. We're going to talk to Olympic gold-medalist, Jordyn Wieber, exclusively in just a moment. But we begin with Trace Gallagher live in our west coast newsroom with the back story on all of this for us tonight. Hi, Trace.
TRACE GALLAGHER, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Martha. There is no remedy for what 260 girls and women allege happened to them, but the federal government and two states are now demanding information and solutions so that it won't happen again. Last night, three American gymnasts, Jamie Dantzscher, Jeanette Antolin and Jordyn Wieber met with two senators on Capitol Hill and detailed the abuse they suffered at the hands of Dr. Larry Nassar. Afterwards, Republican, Jerry Moran, and Democrat, Richard Blumenthal, said, quoting, we are hopeful for renewed commitment from all Olympic organizations to eradicate all sexual abuse and other misconduct and to raise a generation of athletes who feel safe in competing in the sports they love.
The house oversight committee is also investigating and a primary focus of that congressional inquiry is the Karolyi ranch in Texas. Governor Greg Abbott has ordered the Texas rangers to investigate the sexual abuse allegations there. But so far, the rangers are not releasing details. And the Karolyi's will only say they had no knowledge of the allegation beforehand. But the Karolyi's have been named in a lawsuit brought by former national team gymnast, Maddie Larson, who says careless and neglectful adults made the ranch the perfect environment for abusers.
And this week, a bipartisan group of Michigan lawmakers unveiled a package of bills to fight sexual abuse. Remember, Larry Nassar is a former member of Michigan state sports medicine staff. The legislation includes extending the statute of limitations on abuse claims and increasing penalties for possessing child pornography. Olympic gold-medalist, Jordyn Wieber, was at the rollout. Watch.
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WIEBER: Powerful institutions of our federal and state governments, the U.S. Olympic Committee, USA Gymnastics and Michigan State University all failed to believe the victims and stop a serial child molester. This must never happen again in Michigan or anywhere else.
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GALLAGHER: Finally, U.S. Olympic Committee CEO, Scott Blackman, has resigned citing his battle with prostate cancer, but critics say his resignation is long overdue. Martha?
MACCALLUM: Trace, thank you. Here now exclusively, Jordyn Wieber, Olympic gold-medalist and a member of the famous Fierce Five team from the London 2012 summer games. We all remember, Jordyn, your incredible performance. I watched it again today. You are just a strong powerful athlete and woman. And you say that all of that, all that training and everything you did was not as hard as what you have had to do in the past months with this. Explain that to us.
JORDYN WIEBER, OLYMPIC GOLD MEDALIST: Thank you for saying that, first of all. I mean, going through something like training for the Olympics, I truly thought that would have been one of the most intense, one of the most difficult things I ever have to deal with and go through. But honestly, processing the sexual abuse that many athletes have been through and what I personally have been through over the past few months and understanding how all of these organizations, Michigan State, USOC, USA Gymnastics all failed us. It's really hard to process. That's been -- this has been even more difficult but, you know, being an advocate and fighting for these changes now here in Washington, D.C.
MACCALLUM: Good for you.
WIEBER: It's been -- it put meaning to everything.
MACCALLUM: That is wonderful. And I have spoken to some of your colleagues and other members of the Fierce Five who feel that way. And I think you guys have done such a great job of all sticking together and supporting each other because I know you went through all of this together.
In terms of culpability, you know, these other institutions that you point out, Michigan, the USOC, the Karolyi ranch, do you believe that all of these people understood that there were complaints and knew what was going on?
WIEBER: I truly believe that there are a lot of things pushed under the rug. There was a lot of different types of abuse going on, not only at the Karolyi Ranch but in many different gymnastics clubs across the country. I mean, not only sexual abuse but psychological abuse, you know, verbal abuse. All of these things were going on. And I think the Karolyis were sort of the first people that brought that to the United States and kind of made this the culture and environment of gymnastics.
MACCALLUM: Yeah. They were Romanian coaches, correct?
MACCALLUM: And then they were brought here and everyone thought, oh, this is so fantastic because now we're going to have these amazing gold medal winners because they're so tough and strong. You say that they starved gymnasts to the point where they delayed their puberty?
WIEBER: I mean, when you would go to the Karolyi ranch, you wouldn't get very much food and, quite honestly, there's a lot of pressure coming from not only the national team staff but all of our coaches to be as small as you possibly could. And so, that was a lot of pressure that we were dealing with. And so he we would restrict our calorie intake, and then we had somebody like Larry Nassar come in who would offer us snacks. And that was all part of his grooming process which I now know all about.
MACCALLUM: Perfect cocktail that was. And he was the only male who was allowed to enter the girl's gymnast dorm any time he wanted, right, any time of night.
WIEBER: Right. And if there was an emergency at the ranch, Larry was the one that we called. We didn't know who else to call.
MACCALLUM: I am curious about the Karolyi's. I know Greg Abbott, the governor in Texas who is investigating them now. Do you believe that they are guilty of anything criminal in any of this?
WIEBER: You know, I can't say exactly. I think that there needs to be an investigation done. I think, first of all, this is a classic case of, you know, powerful people protecting powerful people. In this case the Karolyi's and USA Gymnastics and also, USOC. It's all these people for so many years putting reputation and money and medals over the protection of athletes. I think it's time that we take a serious look at that and maybe it starts with the decertification of USA Gymnastics. But I think there also needs to be a criminal investigation done of all of these organizations and these people to figure out how this possible could have happened.
MACCALLUM: Jordyn Wieber your country is very proud of you for a lot of reasons, your amazing performance, your gold medal, and also your courage in standing up for yourself and for your fellow athletes. Jordyn, thank you very much, good to see you tonight. Stay strong.
WIEBER: Thank you.
MACCALLUM: You bet. So coming up, one of Hollywood's biggest stars, Chris Pratt, Guardians of the Galaxy and everything else, he's under fire tonight because he had the gull to go on Twitter and say that he was praying for another actor who he admired, the director of Clerks who had a heart attack, so he's getting an enormous amount of backlash for having the gull to ask others to pray for him, too.
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KEVIN SMITH, DIRECTOR: Hey, man. It's me and I'm fine, kind of. I had a heart attack, a massive heart attack, and very nearly died the other night, Sunday night.
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MACCALLUM: Healthcare for actor-director, Kevin Smith, prompted fellow actor, Chris Pratt, to offer him these well wishes on twitter. Kevin, we don't know each other too good, but I've loved you since Clerks and I'm praying for your cause because I believe in the healing power of prayer, can you please pray with me, people. Apparently, some on social media were just appalled by that, writing things like this. Great, now I won't enjoy your films as much knowing you're a Jesus nut. Joining me now, Megan Alexander, author of Faith in the Spotlight, and a correspondent for Inside Edition. Megan, good to have you here tonight. Welcome to you.
MEGAN ALEXANDER, AUTHOR: Thanks, Martha.
MACCALLUM: Is it part of your alleged deity's master plan that Kevin have a heart attack? I mean, it's kind of incredible. I mean, Twitter, unfortunately gets people all the way from the beginning -- from the top down. A lot of desire, a lot of independence to say what they think. But some of it is just downright mean.
ALEXANDER: Yeah. I agree. And you know, Martha, this is a fascinating conversation to see play out on social media over the last couple of days.
And the different ways that people grieve, that people react, that people want to extend or express goodwill or good wishes. But I think we're forgetting that there are a lot of people in this country when they say you're in my thoughts and prayers they really mean it. I mean, you look at somebody like Chris Pratt. Faith is a big part of his life. He's been vocal about it on social media before in interviews. And Kevin Smith even agreed, hey, we shouldn't be fighting over this. I appreciate all the prayers. I want all the help and prayers that I can get. So, I think we got to remember that when somebody says I'm praying for you, they really may be doing it and faith is an important part of their life and that's a way of taking action.
MACCALLUM: And there's also just manner and respect for people and, you know, just stay out of it. Just let him say what he wants to say with regard to this. And, you know, people don't need to have these inside awful comments chiming in. It's just a bad environment in that regard.
Quick question, one the movies that is expected to be up in the running for best picture, Three Billboards, which I saw last weekend, is getting a lot of backlash. Let's just play this little quick clip, and then you can tell everybody what the controversy is.
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UNINDENTIFIED MALE: Hey you, what the hell is this?
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: Advertising, I guess.
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: I could arrest you right now if I wanted to.
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: Before do you that, how about you go have yourself a look at that first billboard over there.
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MACCALLUM: So what's the controversy surrounding that scene and that character and tell us about it.
ALEXANDER: Yeah, you know, Martha, right now, I think the conversation is this movie addresses sexism, a strong female lead, very well but not necessarily racism. And perhaps at the end of the movie a lot of people feel that it doesn't redeem culture in terms of having it being a teachable moment and how wrestling with these issues. And I think Hollywood is continuing to decide what art is. Is it an escape? Is it just entertainment? Or is it something that changes culture that effects change in culture? That is something that Hollywood has wrestled with I think for a long, long time. You know, voting fir the Oscars is over. It's just a couple of days, and so we will see on Sunday what they decide and if they're paying attention to this conversation.
MACCALLUM: Interesting controversy. He redeems himself but not enough, I guess, for some people in the end. Megan, thanks, good to have you here tonight.
MACCALLUM: More of The Story when we come right back.
MACCALLUM: So that is our story for tonight. We got it all in. We will see you back here tomorrow night at 7:00. Thanks for being with us, everybody. Tucker Carlson in D.C., coming up next. Don't go away.
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