This is a rush transcript from "The Kelly File," December 7, 2016. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
MARTHA MACCALLUM, GUEST HOST: Breaking tonight, President-elect Trump stuns critics and supporters alike as he appears to soften his stance on a key promise to strike down one of President Obama's most controversial executive orders.
Welcome to "The Kelly File" everybody, I'm Martha MacCallum in tonight for Megyn Kelly. So, the President-elect who once said the so-called dreamers brought here illegally as children would all quote, "have to go." But in a wide ranging interview with Time magazine, after they announced him as their quote, "person of the year," Mr. Trump now says that he will kill President Obama's executive order but he tells Time magazine, quote, "We're going to work something out that's going to make people proud and happy." So, what does that mean? It's a far cry perhaps from some of the tougher language that he had back on the campaign trail. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ED HENRY, FOX NEWS CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Martha, we continue to see what you might call the great pivot. Last night at that thank you rally in North Carolina --
PRESIDENT-ELECT DONALD TRUMP: We will immediately terminate President Obama's two illegal executive amnesties in which he defied federal law and the constitution to give amnesty to approximately five million illegal immigrants. Five million. For those here illegal today who are seeking legal status, they will have one route and one route only. To return home and apply for reentry like everybody else, we will break the cycle of amnesty and illegal immigration. We will break the cycle. There will be no amnesty.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: No amnesty, he said. We begin tonight with our chief national correspondent, now we go to Ed Henry who is reporting from the Trump International Hotel in Washington.
HENRY: Martha, we continue to see what you might call the great pivot. Last night at that thank you rally in North Carolina. A lot less dark and stormy rhetoric. A lot more mourning in America. The President-elect Donald Trump even at one point calming down his supporters when they started a chant attacking the mainstream media. Tonight it's Mr. Trump in the pages of "Time" magazine in the story revealing that he is the mag's person of the year sounding almost warm and fuzzy about dreamers.
Those are the kids who were brought to this country by their parents illegally and then given work visas to stay here by President Obama via executive order. Mr. Trump saying he still wants to overturn that executive action but raising eyebrows among conservatives by saying he wants to do it in a way that makes everyone quote, "happy and proud," adding they got brought here at a very young age.
They've worked here. They've gone to school here. Some were good students. Some have wonderful jobs. And they are in never neverland because they don't know what's going to happen. That sounds a lot more like President Obama during the 2012 campaign than Mr. Trump during some of those tough talk days in the 2016 campaign.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRES. BARACK OBAMA: Effective immediately the Department of Homeland Security is taking steps to lift the shadow of deportation from these young people. Giving a degree of relief and hope to talented driven patriotic young people.
TRUMP: There's no legalization, there is no amnesty and if somebody wants to go legalization route, what they will do is they'll go leave the country, hopefully come back in and then we can talk.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: To his critics, this is a President-elect who is not living up to major campaign promises, hard-line promises, like locking up Hillary Clinton for example while his supporters note that this is a person who for all of the talk about how he did not have the temperament to be president, he is proving to be a pragmatic leader, not getting hung up on the details, and trying to find common ground on these major issues -- Martha.
MACCALLUM: All right. Let's see what the reaction to this is. Charles Hurt, political columnist for the Washington Times. Javier Palomarez is the president of the United States Hispanic Chamber of Commerce. And Corey Stewart is the candidate for Virginia governor, he's been a long time Trump supporter.
Corey, I want to start with you tonight. Thank you all of you for being here. But I know that, you know, you have been very sort of firm in your adherence to Mr. Trump's campaign-style rhetoric. So, are you disappointed in this?
COREY STEWART, R-CANDIDATE FOR VIRGINIA GOVERNOR: Well, we have to see what he does. Because when he asked me to be the chairman of his campaign of Virginia, I answered it, yes because it is such an important issue. You know, look, I mean, we talk about these dreamers, 57 percent of them are adults and in Prince William County, one of these so-called dreamers was released by the Obama administration and killed a nun. These aren't just a bunch of innocent people, a bunch of innocent kids that came out and want to make a better life for themselves. A lot of these are adults, they're engaged in criminal activity. They need to be -- and Mr. Trump needs to keep his promise. Sixty three million people took him at his word when he made the promise to rescind this illegal executive order.
MACCALLUM: Javier, I would imagine that you are happy with the sort of tempered language here.
JAVIER PALOMAREZ, PRESIDENT, UNITED STATES HISPANIC CHAMBER OF COMMERCE: Well, I think he is illustrating a level of compassionate conservatism that this country needs. Certainly to deport some 11 million people is a burden on American taxpayers. These predominantly are young people who have come here trying to build a life. Many of them have great educations. And they want to contribute to the greatness of this country. I think that for Donald Trump to begin to illustrate that he comprehends the difference between the rhetoric of a campaign and the reality of being president of the greatest nation in the world, illustrate real leadership and I for one am very encouraged by what I've heard.
MACCALLUM: So, Charlie, I think back on some of the promises of President Obama, he said he was going to close Gitmo. He said if you liked your doctor, you can keep your doctor. And he is been criticized for not sticking to his word. So, do you criticize Donald Trump for doing the same?
CHARLES HURT, POLITICAL COLUMNIST, THE WASHINGTON TIMES: Well, I mean, certainly what we heard today is a different tone about immigration. But honestly Martha, I don't see any substantive difference between what he said during the campaign and what he is saying now. He is still talking about tearing up the executive order that President Obama signed regarding the dreamers. Not only because it is a terrible policy but because it is unconstitutional. And so that -- he is still going to do that. The question of what to do with the people that are here has been something that, you know, lawmakers have grappled with for 10, 15 ever since 1986, the last time they promised to fix this problem.
The real thing that matters most of all is, are you going to fix the problem going forward? And obviously part of that means that you do deport people who are here illegally especially those people who are here illegally and breaking laws in addition to being here illegally.
HURT: But I think there is wiggle room for negotiation after that.
MACCALLUM: You have to prioritize. And I think that's what he's talked about quite a bit. So, Corey, I want to go back to you on this. Because he said, basically you want to build a wall. So you want to, you know, put a stopper in the opening of that is allowing people to flow through. Then you want to get rid of the criminals first, he said. So, that's going to take a while to achieve those two goals. And then and only then do you move on to the next category of people, right, Corey?
STEWART: Well, I would agree with that prioritization. And it certainly makes sense, you know, secure the border, go after the criminals first. I'm completely, you know, that's what we did in Prince William County to great effect. But you know, one of the things that has to be done here, is we have to establish law and order in our immigration system. If we don't enforce the law, the law that Congress and the President created, not the President alone, then what's the point of even reforming the law if we're not going to enforce it?
STEWART: And that the first thing that Trump needs to make good on the promise. That's the most important thing. He needs do what Reagan did when, you know, by firing the air traffic controllers 35 years ago. He needs to establish that he is serious, he is going to keep his promises and that, you know, if you dealt that, he is going to make it very clear at very beginning of his administration that instead of breaking promises, he is going to keep them.
MACCALLUM: You know, Javier, it seems that Donald Trump as many presidents do, they've sort of start with the pendulum all the wait to one side. They want to make a very clear point during the campaign. And they want to make it clear to people that they are serious about it. Then they have to start to move towards the ability to actually take action on it. But, you know, in terms of Corey's point, we have laws in this country. You are not allowed to be here illegally. And it does seems sometimes like there are different laws for certain immigrants crossing the border and different laws for others who seemed to get kicked out and have to stay away for years and work their way back in. So, why isn't the same for everyone?
PALOMAREZ: Listen, what I can tell you is that in my conversations with the Trump team, I have witnessed them illustrate a real willingness to comprehend the issue in its broadest context. We have tried to insure that they understand the important economic and commercial implications to this thorny and often emotional issue called immigration reform. At the end of the day, these people are predominantly employed, predominantly working in this country to deport them in a mass fashion would cost anywhere from 300 to $400 billion to the American economy.
And I'm glad that the issue was brought up about Ronald Reagan. Because you will recall that Ronald Reagan basically pardoned millions of people at the time that he was president and that he illustrated that we are a country of broad shoulders and big hearts. It is time that Donald Trump did that. I'm very encouraged by the fact that he is willing to at least stop and pump the brakes just a little bit and look at this thing for what it truly is.
MACCALLUM: Well, he's going to have to walk a fine line.
HURT: And amnesty, those three million turned into 12 million plus.
HURT: And that's why it has to be done. Border security first this time.
MACCALLUM: Great point.
STEWART: I agree.
MACCALLUM: All right. Gentlemen, thank you very much. Good to see you all tonight.
Another major announcement today for the President-elect's cabinet as we learned retired Marine General John Kelly is being tapped to run the Department of Homeland Security. There were number of people that were considered for that spot. From what we know, the President suggesting tonight that the Intel community failed to alert him about the rise of ISIS. Is that true?
Our own Oliver North claims that it is either an outright falsehood or criminal negligence. We're going to talk to veterans Carl Higbie and Larry Korb about how that could have happened and how President-elect Trump may handle things differently.
Also, Chris Stirewalt is here tonight on President-elect Trump's honeymoon period in the polls. We're going to show you the brand-new numbers, next.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: The script to what we're doing is not yet written. Remember, this has been a great, great movement. The likes of which they've never seen before.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: Breaking tonight. Another big announcement from the President- elect today, as we learned that retired Marine General John Kelly is the man who is tapped to the run the Department of Homeland Security. It is a big job. And while there is some major pressure in that post with both immigration as we just talked about. And also counterterrorism on the line, so is he the right man for the job?
Chief intelligence correspondent Catherine Herridge joins us live this evening from Washington. Catherine?
CATHERINE HERRIDGE, FOX NEWS CHIEF INTELLIGENCE CORRESPONDENT: Martha, in his last job, General Kelly's portfolio included Guantanamo Bay immigration and drug trafficking. Those close to Kelly say, that experience makes him well versed on Southern border issues. And when he retired in January, Kelly seemed to check another Trump box emphasizing his work with intelligence and Homeland Security outside the beltway.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEN. JOHN KELLY (RET.), UNITED STATES MARINE CORPS: At least it's been my experience, the further you get away from Washington the better things work. People actually talk to each other, people actually socialize with each other, they work together. There is no rice bowls.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HERRIDGE: General Kelly is widely respected and understands the human cost of war. In 2010 his son Lieutenant Robert M. Kelly was killed in Afghanistan by an IED. Kelly rarely speaks about the losses but when he does, he addresses the importance of finishing the mission for fellow Gold Star families.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: I think the one thing they would ask is that the cause for which their son or daughter fell be carried through to a successful end, whatever that means. As opposed to this is getting too costly or too much of a pain in the ass and let's just walk away from it. Because that's when they start thinking it might have been not worth it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HERRIDGE: The new secretary will take over the sprawling department of 240,000 government employees at a time the terror threat has never been broader, wider or deeper.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NICK RASMUSSEN, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL COUNTERTERRORISM DIRECTOR: There exists a greater number of potential terrorist actors who aspire to do us harm than at any point in our history since 9/11.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For eight years the Obama administration reluctantly played global whack-a-mole with Jihadists rather than leaning into the fight with decisive leadership.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HERRIDGE: Based on government data ISIS was operating in seven countries two years ago and this year that number has nearly tripled to 18 -- Martha.
MACCALLUM: Catherine, thank you.
HERRIDGE: You're welcome.
MACCALLUM: So, while ISIS represents a clear and present danger for the incoming administration, President Obama suggesting tonight in a brand new interview that his intelligence community let him down when it came to warning him accurately about the threat. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: The ability of ISIL to initiate major land offenses, that was not on my intelligence radar screen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: Really? Because here's what some of his own intelligence officials were telling Congress in the months and weeks after the first major ISIS victory in Fallujah.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Syria has become a huge magnet for extremists and we're seeing now the appearance of training complexes in Syria, to train people to go back to their countries and of course, conduct more terrorist acts. So, this is a huge concern to all of us.
JOHN BRENNAN, DIRECTOR, CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY: We are concerned about the use of Syrian territory by the al Qaeda organization to recruit individuals and develop the capability to be able to not just carry out attacks inside of Syria but also to use Syria as a launching pad.
BRETT MCGURK, SPECIAL PRESIDENTIAL ENVOY, GLOBAL COALITION TO COUNTER ISIL: Its current leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi is a designated global terrorist under U.S. law and we believe is currently based in Syria. His mission is clearly stated in his own statements, is to carve out his own governing territory from Baghdad through Syria to Lebanon.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I mean, the scale of what they are involved in right now, particularly the al Qaeda element in Iraq, and just the level of destruction that they are having and the level of killing that they are doing inside of that country is just -- is terrible.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: So those were in January and February of 2014. Right around the time that the President called ISIS or ISIL, the jayvee team.
Carl Higbie is a former Navy SEAL and a Trump supporter. Larry Korb is senior fellow with the Center for American Progress and a former assistant Defense Secretary. Gentlemen, thank you very much.
CARL HIGBIE, FORMER NAVY SEAL AND TRUMP SUPPORTER: Thank you.
MACCALLUM: Good to have all of you here. You know, when you look at it in that context, Carl, why would the President say in an interview that is happening now as he is about to leave office, that his intelligence people were not giving him the full picture?
HIGBIE: That's a fundamental lie. Barack Obama's foreign policy has been a complete disaster. He knows darn well that this intelligence committee told them that. And any general that told him that ISIS is going to be a problem, he fired them. That way he wouldn't have to listen to them. And all people who didn't speak out for the ones that stuck around, you know, that he didn't get rid of. So, when he says that he didn't hear about this from the intelligence community, that's malarkey. I know for a fact guys like General Flynn told him that this was going to be an issue.
MACCALLUM: Yes. General Flynn who won't be new head of the National Security Council was pretty much screaming this from the rafters, Larry, at that point and after. Because he felt that he wasn't being listened to. But he wasn't alone at all. There were plenty of intelligence officials who also said they were filing reports that they thought that were being told to sort of -- to dumb them down a bit because the message wasn't what the White House wanted to hear, Larry.
LARRY KORB, SENIOR FELLOW, CENTER FOR AMERICAN PROGRESS: I think if you go back and you just play part of General Clapper's testimony, he said in the summer of 2014 that he underestimated how strong they would get in Syria and the collapse of the Iraqi army. President Obama was already fly -- having Americans flying missions back there in 2013. And Admiral Rogers, the head of NSA who is one of the people that trump is considering to replace General Clapper, he said we underestimated them.
That's what Obama was trying to say. People knew they were there but they underestimated how quickly they would be able to get into Iraq and the Iraqi army would collapse. I think that's exactly what he's saying. And again, you know, intelligence people make mistakes. General Flynn was blaming Benghazi on Iran, which wasn't true.
MACCALLUM: Larry, they do make mistakes. But I guess, what some people will take issue is in watching this interview, is why wouldn't the President say at this point, you know what, upon reflection there were people who were speaking out very strongly on this matter, and it would have been wise to have paid attention to them. You get a lot of information incoming.
And I chose to, you know, follow some people's take on whether or not they could be contained. But this is a period during which people were being beheaded. Mass beheadings on the beach. People were being drowned in cages. And we were being told, Carl, essentially that, you know, this is just sort of an out of control group that really couldn't establish any territory that would be meaningful to anybody.
HIGBIE: Well, Martha, Barack Obama won't say any of that because he is so profoundly arrogant when it comes to his foreign policy. He has no understanding of what went wrong and he doesn't care to understand because he has his agenda. And he doesn't care too is that I was there in 2009 and I put this in my first book that this was going to be a problem. We were pulling out of Iraq.
There was power vacuums happening. The violence was escalating and they didn't want to admit that. So what they did was they stopped all American troop direct action mission. So, we weren't allowed to go kill bad guys which is what we are trained to do as soldiers. And then they claimed victory. Well, the enemy get to say whether or not the war is over and they were saying it wasn't over and we just pulled out anyway.
MACCALLUM: Larry, last word?
KORB: Wait! Wait a second. President Bush signed an agreement that said, we had to get out by the end of 2011 and we had to, in early 2009 stop our combat missions. This was not Obama who did that. And General Petraeus --
HIGBIE: But Obama didn't try to change it.
KORB: Yes. But General Petraeus said even if you had left 10,000 troops there he doesn't think it would have made any difference. Because it was malarkey the way he ran the place and he wouldn't allow our troops to stay there without a status of forces agreement.
MACCALLUM: A lot of people believe that that status of forces agreement could have been reached. And President Bush himself actually warned about leaving a vacuum in that area and he said that terrorist elements would fill that vacuum if it was left. So, you know, I guess my point is that when you have 2020 and you have the hindsight on it, what would behoove a president or any leader would be to be as clear-eyed as possible in explaining what happened so that the next president could see it in a way that might be more helpful to him instead of perhaps throwing people under the bus that don't deserve it.
So, Larry, thank you very much. Carl Higbie, very good to have you with us tonight as well.
HIGBIE: Thanks, Martha.
MACCALLUM: Thank you, gentlemen.
So coming up, Ohio could be on its way to passing one of the strictest abortion laws in this country. It is known as the heartbeat bill. And it is sitting on Governor John Kasich's desk. We will debate that bill and the fallout ahead.
Plus, a stunning new poll numbers tonight with respect to President-elect Donald Trump's popularity and how people feel about the country today.
Chris Stirewalt here to explain what is behind the Trump bump. And whether the surge can last. When we come back.
MACCALLUM: Developing tonight, a surge in polling for a President-elect Donald Trump as he rides the tailwinds of his surprising November victory. Mr. Trump appears to be experiencing a bit of an extended honeymoon phase with the American public when it comes to his popularity. A new Bloomberg poll out today shows that he is at 50 percent. Marking a 17-point jump since August. What is more the same poll found that percent of American adults who believe that the country is on the right track is now in its highest place in four years. So what's contributing to these jumps and can it last? Probably not. Most of these things go up and down. Right?
Our FOX News digital politics editor Chris Stirewalt is here to explain tonight. So, Chris, very nice move. Is this normally what we see with a President-elect?
CHRIS STIREWALT, FOX NEWS DIGITAL POLITICS EDITOR: Well, it depends on how you're rolling when you get there. In Donald Trump's case he may have squeaked over the finish line to a certain degree but he has gotten a -- the honeymoon is more pronounced for him. Barack Obama came into office popular. He went into election Day fairly popular eight years ago. This time Donald Trump was lugging what looked like overwhelming negatives. People were very down on him.
You remember a month ago, it was just a month and a day ago that we had the election. A month ago and three weeks ago people were saying should Donald Trump be normalized? Should -- and critics said should the president have even welcomed him to the White House and all this stuff. A month later, you know, we're saying, well, half the country says they feel pretty good about him. And, by the way, on his core policy sets, people are willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. So Trump definitely has changed the landscape around him.
MCCALLUM: He always said that he could be presidential. And, you know, I remember even Paul Manafort who, you know, had a short stay in the Trump campaign said, well, he, you know, let's start out on the edges then he'll kind of move his way to the middle. You've got Al Gore and Rob Emmanuel coming to meet with Donald Trump.
STIREWALT: That's right.
MACCALLUM: And, you know, Kellyanne Conway said that President Obama and Donald Trump have spent 30 hours on the phone together.
STIREWALT: That's a lot of hours.
MACCALLUM: Is that possible?
STIREWALT: That's a lot of hours.
MACCALLUM: I haven't spent 30 hours on the phone since eighth grade. So, I don't know what they're talking about, Chris, but they have a lot to talk about.
STIREWALT: And I can picture they're twisting the cord around your finger and talking to your friends. I know. I would say that what part of Donald Trump was benefiting from is that there was a caricature of him that certainly that his political opponents, Hillary Clinton and the Democrats laid out there, but also there was in the press. He's a Nazi, he's a monster. He's evil. He is going to drink the blood of the children of America, run and hide. He's the crampiest. And then he showed up and went, oh, he's kind of funny. I think I like him.
MACCALLUM: So you start there.
MACCALLUM: You can only go up.
STIREWALT: That's right. And he's being moderate, and he's making these cooing noises that liberals like, even though he's appointing people that are really conservative.
MACCALLUM: Fascinating. Chris, thank you very much.
STIREWALT: You bet.
MACCALLUM: Always good to see you, sir. Come see us in the morning. All Right.
So, let's be joined now by Republican congressman Sean Duffy, and Richard Fowler of Fox News contributor and national syndicated radio talk show host. Welcome, gentlemen. Hello, there. Good to have you all here. So, Richard, I know -- you were smiling broadly as Chris and I were talking. What do you think about all that?
RICHARD FOWLER, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Well, I think there's some truth to what Chris is saying here. I think every president gets a honeymoon phase after they win. The American people are looking for him to provide answers, and to create jobs, and to build this wall, and all these other things. And so, I think, that's what we're going to wait and see what happens. Now, I think Donald Trump has a couple of problems. I think problem number one is that as he gets into his first 100 days he's going to want to pass this trillion dollar transportation or infrastructure bill, which I think is a great idea if done correctly. And I think budget hawk like Congressman Duffy and others will be like, oh, trillion dollars, too much, we need to lower that number. And that's where you're going to see the big eruption that will be Trump taking on his own party.
MACCALLUM: Well, Representative Duffy, I thought it was interesting in the interview that Donald Trump did today, he said, I would like to be judge on my presidency starting now. Starting when I got elected because the Dow is at an all-time high, I mean the market has responded incredibly positively, so far to the Trump transition, part of this process. But if he comes forward with that bill, are you going to give him hard time about how to pay for it?
REP. SEAN DUFFY, R-WIS.: Well, it depends. If he doesn't pay for it, we'll obviously have trouble with it. But there's great pain for us, I mean, we can repatriate foreign profits back to the states, whether we charge five, eight, 10 percent interest. You can pay about 3 or $400 billion of that trillion dollar expenditure. But, listen, Martha, we're trillion dollars in debt. To think that we're going to add another trillion of unpaid spending on top of it, that's not going to happen. But what's interesting is liberals across America, like, maybe a little bit of Richard, their hair is on fire. They're pulling out. They can't believe the evil Donald Trump is actually, you know, warming up to the American people, and they kind of like him. They want to give him a shot. But what's interesting is -- just one second, only 28 percent of Americans want Democrats to oppose Donald Trump, and Republicans in congress, they actually want them to work with us to secure the border, fix healthcare, and grow the economy, which is really remarkable for Democrats to have this push on their own side and say work together and get some of these big initiatives done.
MACCALLUM: I find it fascinating. This is really what I think is the most interesting. So, Richard, tell me, you know, do you believe -- are you willing to give Donald Trump a chance? I mean, the people were sobbing and devastated after this election in, you know, half of the country, essentially, right? Are they starting to feel better or do they think this is not real?
FOWLER: Well, listen. I respect the presidency of the United States, the person in it, that's another story, depending upon who it is every four areas. But here's the thing, I think the American people they were angry, and they were frustrated. They felt the economy was rigged. I think millennials especially felt that going into November -- going into last month as Chris Stirewalt said, and now Donald Trump has to prove that he can really quote, unquote, make America great again. And like Congressman Duffy pointed out, he's going to have some trouble in his own caucus making that a reality. The same thing that he's proposing, the same thing Barack Obama proposed 8 years ago, a trillion dollars infrastructure bill, and Republicans blocked it tooth and nail, and he's just indicated they're going to do it again.
MACCALLUM: You have to come to it with a way it pay for it.
FOWLER: You have it right here.
DUFFY: Richard, remember, there was this $800 billion spending bill under Barack Obama, and they said there were shovel-ready jobs and there weren't no shovel-ready jobs.
(CROSSTALK) FOWLER: That's not true, congressman.
DUFFY: You've got nothing.
MACCALLUM: Quickly, before we go because I'm pretty much out of time, you know, what's the best way to pay for it, quickly?
DUFFY: Repatriate profits up from overseas. Best way -- but we're going to do heath care, we're going to do the border, a lot of issues that Americans have bought into. This is one issue that we'll get too.
FOWLER: Big battle with Trump and the party, Martha. Big battle.
MACCALLUM: You know what I would say? Actions speak louder than words. So we'll see what happens. And if he makes good on those promises, and then he will make good on them.
FOWLER: I hope so, Martha. I hope he does.
MACCALLUM: OK. Richard, thank you very much.
FOWLER: Thank you, Martha.
MACCALLUM: Sean Duffy, great to see you both.
So there's a controversy brewing in Ohio, as the state is on the verge of adopting one of the most strict abortion laws that would exist in this country. Lisa Booth and Nomiki Konst will discuss it. It is called the heart beat bill, coming up. Plus, today, we remember the day that lives in infamy. It has been 75 years since the attack on Pearl Harbor, our interviews with heroes who survived coming up. You don't want to miss it, very special.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: The fact I was setting up machine guns, second time I was firing at enemy planes passing by, and survived that day.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: Breaking tonight at this hour, the state of Ohio is now just a signature away from a historical prolife legislation. Governor John Kasich is now tasked with considering the adoption of one of the strictest abortion laws in the country. It is a measure that would ban abortions upon the first heart beats of the fetus, heart beats that are often measured in just six weeks into a woman's pregnancy. Fox's Shannon Bream has the details on this story for us tonight from Washington. Shannon?
SHANNON BREAM, FOX NEWS: Martha, advocates on both sides of the abortion debate are watching and waiting to see what Ohio governor and one time presidential candidate John Kasich will do with the so-called heart beat bill, just passed by lawmakers there. The bill bans anyone from performing an abortion without first checking for a fetal heartbeat, or from continuing with an abortion if a heartbeat is detected. Roughly around six weeks into a pregnancy. A doctor who breaks the law could be convicted of a felony and face up to a year in prison. The bill contains an exception if the mother's life is in danger, but there are no exceptions in cases of rape or incest. Meanwhile, Pro-choice Ohio's executive director says, quote, one in three women choose to have an abortion in their lifetime, making women from getting a medical procedure is out of touch with Ohio values and is completely unacceptable. She continues, clearly this bill's supporters are hoping that President-elect Trump will have the chance to pack the U.S. Supreme Court with justices that are poised to overturn Roe v. Wade. We must prevent that from happening to protect women's lives.
So far, no word from the governor, although, pro-life, Kasich had express concerns about the legal viability of earlier version of the bill. Similar laws have been struck down in Arkansas and North Dakota, and now the clock is ticking in Ohio. If Kasich signs the bill or does nothing within ten days, it will become law early in 2017. If he veto the measure, that is the end. And last 3/5 of the state house and senate vote to override his veto. Multiple groups including ACLU have vowed to immediately sue if the law does go into effect. Martha?
MACCALLUM: Our thanks to Shannon Bream. So, here with more, Lisa Booth is a Washington Examiner columnist and a Fox News contributor. Nomiki Konst is host of The Filter on Sirius XM Progress. Welcome to both of you. Good to have you here tonight.
UNINDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Martha.
MACCALLUM: A lot of pressure right now on John Kasich. This bill is sitting on his desk, and obviously a lot of pro-life advocates would like to see him sign it. But as Shannon pointed out in the past, Kasich has said that he's pro-life, but he believes in exceptions for rape and insist which do not exist in this bill. Nomiki, what do you think happens here? What do you think should happen?
NOMIKI KONST, THE FILTER HOST: Well, number one, I think that this bill is just flat-out unconstitutional. Similar bills have been struck down in upper courts in North Dakota and Arkansas. I think it will be bad politics for John Kasich. I think it's bad politics for Donald Trump. Donald Trump has a lot of things on his desk right now. He needs easy wins. This is a way to unify the left. Unify moderate Republicans who know that this is bad politics. And furthermore, it's just dangerous. Most women don't know they're pregnant by five or six weeks. Most women -- it doesn't stop abortions. It forces a woman to get an abortion in dangerous place and we know that. I mean, there's history to prove that. So, you know, if abortion-right activists are unified in an effort like this, I think that they have a clear path to victory. And I think John Kasich's history shows that he's even against bills like this, which do not exclude women who have experienced rape or incest.
MACCALLUM: All right, Lisa, what do you think?
LISA BOOTHE, WASHINGTON EXAMINER: Well, look, I don't think it's as controversial as the media and the left purports it to be. Columbus dispatch and Quinnipiac did polling in 2013, and found that voters were actually split 46/47 on it. So it's not as controversial as, you know, Nomiki just purported to be. But, you will agree with her notion in a sense that North Dakota did have similar legislation that was struck down on Federal court, and the Supreme Court refused the state appeal to hear it, so, ultimately, will likely meet the same fate. But I think what is important here is the movement on the pro- life community, and feeling emboldened under President-elect Donald Trump. If you look at what's happening across the street, there is more pro-life legislation pass in the state level in recent time, and they're only going to get emboldened when Republicans hold more state legislators than ever before in history. And majority of governors in the country are Republicans. And you've also have a president-elect who is committed to things like nominating pro-life Supreme Court justices. Also another important thing, real quick, Martha, is the fact that there is another bill on Governor John Kasich's desk, which he will sign which will make Ohio the 18th state to support banning abortions at 20 weeks, which is something the majority of Americans support. And something that Hillary Clinton did not support. She wants abortions at 20 weeks, which is extreme.
MACCALLUM: Yeah. Forty three states have some or all abortions after a certain point illegal. And as you point out, that other law would make Ohio the 20th state in terms of the 20-week law. And, you know, we look across the numbers Nomiki, 47 percent of the country according to gallop is pro-choice, 46percent is pro-life. I think these numbers have been changing over the course of the last several years, especially with new technology that does show things like a heartbeat at such an early stage of the game. I would expect that given President Trump's stance that he will -- President-elect Trump that he will pick pro-life judges. And this is something that we're to hear a lot more about.
KONST: Well, -- did a recent report and showed that 57 percent of Americans believe in some form of abortion, legal or outright completely banned -- being pro-choice.
MACCALLUM: We've got to go. Thank you very much, Nomiki and Lisa. We'll be right back with more on the Kelly file.
MACCALLUM: Today marks a sad and significant day in our nation's history, 75 years ago on December 7, 1941. Japanese fighter bombed the U.S. naval base in Pearl Harbor for more than two solid hours, launching our country in to World War II. More than 2,400 American lives were lost in those hours, another 1,100 were injured. Today, a moving tribute to the site that remembers our heroes. Watch. Trace Gallagher, live tonight at Pearl Harbor in Hawaii, with more. Good evening, Trace.
TRACE GALLAGHER, FOX NEWS: Hi, Martha. You know, the ceremonies are still under way here in Pearl Harbor, including directly behind me at the USS Arizona Memorial, which of course is the grave site to some 1,177 sailors and marines. Other Arizona survivors who died later are also in toured there, but today two more sailors on the Arizona, who died this year will have their ashes placed inside the wreckage. In essence, they'll be joining their band of brothers. And for one of them, who will actually join his real brother because his twin was also on board the Arizona, 75 years ago, and was killed by the Japanese. So now, there are five survivors left of the U.S. Arizona, and four of them were at Pearl Harbor today. They were all asked how it is they were able to get off the burning ship. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: And they say abandon ship, the ones on deck, both taken around the tern stern of the Arizona. That's all got. I got off the ship.
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: Rope, hand over hand into the mess room.
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: We've got a hold of a sailor on board the vessel, and he threw us a hinge line which is a heavy line. And he tied the heavy line and we pulled out across, and proceed to go hand over hand across the vessel about 70 or 80 feet. I don't know how I made it, but I'm here.
GALLAGHER: So they fled the attack, but they came back to fight the fight. And during his keynote speech today, Admiral Harry Harris, who is the top U.S. commander of the Pacific fleet made it very clear that those men were in fact heroes. And the admiral also took a swipe at today's climate. Listen to what he said directly after the national anthem. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HARRY HARRIS, U.S. COMMANDER OF THE PACIFIC FLEET: You can bet that the men and women that we honor today, and those who died that faithful morning, 75 years ago, never took a knee and never failed to stand whenever they heard our national anthem being played.
(END VIDEO CLIP) GALLAGHER: There were some 10,000 visitors here today, Martha, many of them World War II veterans in their 90's, and beyond. And many of them acknowledge this was likely be their final trip to Pearl Harbor. Martha?
MACCALLUM: We thank them for their service, extraordinary stories. Trace, thank you. We will be right back.
MACCALLUM: So, Megyn is out on the West Coast tonight, as part of her "Settle for More" book tour. And this morning she was honored by the Hollywood reporter at their 2016 women in entertainment ceremony. She spoke about the wild election, that we all just witnessed, and why she has high hopes for Donald Trump's presidency. A message that was not well received by certain people in the crowd. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MEGYN KELLY, HOST: As for our President-elect Donald Trump, I have high hopes for him, despite the tweets and all the rest of it. There is much to admire about Donald Trump. There is. Stop that. Stop that. There's room for the loyal opposition in this country, absolutely. Guess who that is, Kathy Griffin. You got to love her.
KELLY: That would be the loyal opposition. Omarosa is going to hurt you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: So that middle finger I guess was part of that whole thing, and some coarse language that came courtesy of Kathy Griffin, as Megyn just said. Perhaps known for her recent work in the amply name reality series -- TV series, "My Life on the D List." Megyn went on to offer some advised from those face with a difficult situation to unlike the one that she based right there.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: When and if the dark forces rear their ugly heads, we must maintain our dignity as a people and as women. We must reject the urge to fight with pigs, which gets us dirty and the pigs enjoy. That's actually been one of my number one lessons of the past year. Don't get in the gutter. We don't have to settle for less when it comes to respect, and dignity, and what we deserve, and can accomplish. We resolve that we will do better and be better. And that we will find a way to settle for more. God bless you. Thank you, and good luck.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCULLUM: Megyn's new book, settle for more, is a New York Times best seller now. You can you get it online and in stores. Get your copy and more of the wisdom that she just spoke there is available in that book, I promise you. Thanks for watching tonight, everybody. I'm Martha McCallum. I will see you at 9:00 in the morning, on "America's Newsroom" with Bill Hemmer. "The Kelly File." See you later.
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