This is a rush transcript from "Media Buzz," November 13, 2016. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
HOWARD KURTZ, HOST: Our buzz meter this Sunday its shock waves over the greatest media failure in modern political history. Failing to grasp with all of the talk about Hillary Clinton on the verge of victory and that the country would elect President Trump.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)
JOHN KING, CNN: We're having a conversation now that it was impossible to have two weeks ago. It was just improbable. You were not having a reality based conversation trying to do this map.
JAKE TAPPER, CNN: It's just remarkable. I mean I don't think that we can over state this. Not only the Democrats and the Clinton campaign, not only pollster and the main stream media, but Republicans, did not anticipate that this night was going to be this way.
CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS: I think we are all at least I am coming to the conclusion, to the conclusions of wrong word to open to the possibility. Donald Trump could be the next president of the United States.
TUCKER CARLSON, FOX NEWS: Let's be honest there's no one that I know that thought this three hours ago.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT-ELECT: To those that have chosen not to support me in the past, in which there were a few people. I am reaching out to you, for your guidance and your help, so that we can work together and unify our great country.
(END VIDEO CLIPS)
KURTZ: Why did so many journalists underestimate the anger and frustration of Trump's voters? Why were the pundits and the pollster so spectacularly wrong? And the media was all in this narrative, and it was just everybody was marching and locked up. Clinton is going to win. Clinton is going to win. I am obsessed with our small band of partisan systematically be legitimize the main stream press and we just stood there and let it happen. And most of all, I am obsessed with how wrong and profoundly, historically, epically wrong we all got the election.
Why are some liberal commentators blaming the press for not stopping Trump? That is not our job. Plus Donald Trump says that twitter helped him win the election. And can journalists now be fair to the President-elect? I am Howard Kurtz and this is "MediaBuzz."
New York Times a published a truly extraordinary banner headlines after the election and here it is. Democrats, students and foreign allies faced the reality of the Trump presidency. The clear implication was that many people and the paper fine sympathetic remained shocked and even appalled by the prospect of President Trump. It's firstly impossible to imagine in such a times had long after Democratic victory, the paper editor and publisher now saying that perhaps Trump's sheer unconventionality lead them to underestimate his support in promising to be fair. This is some journalist and even some media critics, question how the news business so utterly botched this high stake election that so many expected Hillary Clinton to win.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: It's hard to be apparent tonight for a lot of us. You tell your kids don't be a bully. You tell your kids don't be a bigot. There are afraid of how do I explain these to my children.
LAWRENCE O'DONNELL, MSNBC HOST: Donald Trump will take his place now among the racists who have lived in the White House.
LAURA INGRAHAM, EDITOR IN CHIEF, LIFEZETTE: Everyone is emoting tonight and as my deceased mother would have said, suck it up butter cup. It's not fun to lose, but not everybody gets a trophy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KURTZ: All right. According to report on The Hill, under consideration for White House press secretary, joining us now to analyze the coverage of the election and its aftermath, Erin McPike a Political Commentator and former reporter for Real Clear Politics, Kristen Soltis Anderson, Washington Examiner Columnist and a Republican Strategist and Julie Roginsky, a Democratic Strategist and Fox News Contributor. Erin, the election is over and seems to me that there are still major elements in the media that are kind a have been hostile to President-elect Trump. What explain that?
ERIN MCPIKE, POLITICAL COMMENTATOR FORMER REAL CLEAR POILITICS: I don't know what explain it but there's still obviously a lot of shock. You showed the New York Times headline from Thursday morning, but we continue to see headlines in the New York Times that is of resignation. I would point you to the Washington Post where the headlines are more of intrigued and openness to cover on what is to come. We even saw that Arthur Jr. put out this memo to readers on Friday, saying that we got it wrong and as you mentioned, they are still trying to figure it out but they haven't quite gotten there yet. We are seeing today, I looked through the pages of New York Times, not just the front page and they're doing stories now of what is actually going on in the Rustbelt. Where were the stories after he won the primary? Where were the country stories?
KURTZ: Because the media consensus was a Rustbelt wasn't in play, Hillary Clinton had it locked up and here is a story in the New York Times and a new story, Kristen, from when he met with President Obama in the White House.
Mr. Trump whose campaign whose support from white supremacist groups, sat in front of a bus with the reverend Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., so the media risking their credibility with these kinds of news passages and headlines.
KRISTEN SOLTIS ANDERSON, WASHINGTON EXAMINER COLUMNIST: There are a lot of places when you look at the election returns that voted for Obama quit heavily two elections in a row. Places like Luzern County and Pennsylvania that have now flip and become Trump country. These are not places that have been rejecting President Obama all along. These are for places that for economic reasons have changed their attitude and decided that Trump is the person who is most likely to.
KURTZ: So why did the press not pick up on that during 18 months of campaign?
SOLTIS ANDERSON: I think you know you saw in a lot of polls that you always had the white working class leaning towards Trump. What was miss was a lot of Princeton College educated white voters, etcetera, were breaking for Donald Trump, black voters, Latino voters, the exit polls suggest vote for Donald Trump in much higher margins that the polls would have suggested. So I think that is actually the group that the media missed. It was not the white working class so much, because we knew that they were going to go for Trump. It's a lot of white college educated professionals, African-American and Latinos, who voted for Trump and even though that the media said that was impossible.
KURTZ: Julie it seems like some of the media just cannot come to grips right now, with the fact that Trump won. Why don't you think of that once you start with your own reaction when you came out of the train station here in Washington?
JULIE ROGINSKY, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: I did, I came here yesterday and I went to the capital where I used to work and said I just can't believe it. And I think that a lot of people not just in the media, but Democrats like me and others are in disbelief. I will say and haven't thought about this, I think that the conclusion that I came to is people like, you know put the blame on myself as well as the media lives in an ivy tower. We live in Washington or we live in New York, we are not worried necessary about putting our kids through college, we can afford to do that. We're not worried so much about paying for health care, we can do that, we weren't worried so much about making our mortgage or rent payment. We can do that.
We forgotten to our own affectionate is that there are people when I went on TV over the last four years and saying wait the economy is getting better, look at this metrics, there are white working class voters and not just white working class voters but as you pointed out, Latinos and African Americans and others said, maybe on paper it's getting better, but I can't pay my mortgage. They are saying it is greater that more people that have health care insurance, thanks to Obamacare, which I consistently cited, but I'm seeing more and more out of my pocket for those premiums and people like me forgot about those people.
KURTZ: There is a phrase for that. It is called, the hour of touch and Erin, let me play for you the question that I asked you just this past Sunday, two days before the election.
Erin, a number of pundits that came out two weeks ago and said that this race was over and done, Hillary is going to win, whose is going to be an the cabinet and no way that Trump can pull this thing off. Was that in retrospect reckless?
You basically said that it was.
MCPIKE: It was.
KURTZ: So virtually all of the media were wrong, about Hillary Clinton winning this election. What does it say for the political headline and Trump needs a miracle. How do we now have the pundits coming out and saying that we're going to tell you what is going to happen in this thing that we said that it was not going to happen?
MCPIKE: What do you mean they're going to say what's going to happen in a Trump presidency?
MCPIKE: We always need to cover what's going to happen over the next 70 days and actually cover what Trump is going to do and start asking him those questions. Going back to some of the points, I think that there is laziness in leaning on the polls versus actually covering what is going on the country. You and I, Howard have talked for a long time about how many news organizations are shutting down bureaus and not getting out in the country. This is a moment for the news organizations to go back and reopen the Chicago bureaus and staff them up. And actually go out into the country and report on what it is that people are talking about and what they want?
KURTZ: How about the bureau in Detroit? And you know, journalists who are trying to say will Donald Trump has a bigger path than people realize and we played a clip last week and lecturing mark helper and who wasn't saying that Trump was going to win but he hears how he can get it interesting. You're being too optimistic. Well it turns out, Halpen was right, so even when the data were there, they were a sort of a group thing about it and it was not right.
SOLTIS ANDERSON: Well, there were some states that it was a group thing problem, so for instance, in the state of Pennsylvania, the polls only showed Clinton with a slim lead in Pennsylvania, but the narrative was, well Pennsylvania is always loosely with this stuff, all right. Republican always thinks they can win Pennsylvania but they can't. So there, it was people misreading the data. But there are others states, I mean Wisconsin, the polls were off by over six points and in the state like Michigan, the polls were off by three to that Ohio the polls off by five points. The polling errors were not uniformed across the country. Some like New Hampshire, Virginia were perfect, but it was just the right combination of state that led people to think there were pieces that were completely off the board, especially in the upper Midwest, and if you actually consider the states in play, then suddenly you're 80 percent projection for Clinton and it has to become much more even.
KURTZ: A lot of changes now in the media, for example McCory Lewandowski, Trump's first campaign manager, resigning from CNN. He had been a commentator like to go in to the Trump administration. Let me put up on the screens for you, the cover of people magazine. took so much heat over this and including from Hollywood celebrities It's kind of a standard post election coverage, you see it, they are President Trump, beside with him, photo's spread dealing with Trump and so forth. The magazine took so much heat over this. Including from Hollywood celebrities and said we are not going to get interviews, we are going to boycott. But the there had to put out a statement saying this isn't a celebration, it is a news story.
ROGINSKY: Well, he is right, it is a news story. What I find interesting about People Magazine as they had their own reporter saying that Donald Trump had assaulted her.
KURTZ: Yes, former people reporter said this happens a decade. It does not change the allegations.
ROGINSKY: It does not change that at all, but I find it interesting the same editors that came to her defense are now putting it out. I think there is a little congruity here. What I find interesting to some extent is that there's been from the media, now is People Magazine specifically, but there has been a way of covering for example Hillary Clinton that now that I hope the same kind of attention turns to Donald Trump. For example like the conflict within the Trump organization and their finances and what President Trump will do. Something like that is very important for the media to focus on.
KURTZ: What is he supposed to do? Just like pretend that he did not win the election? Not have a headline about President Trump?
ROBERTS: No, they should cover it but cover it as specifically.
KURTZ: Who is in the cover?
SOLTIS ANDERSON: Here is the thing about People Magazine, when we are reporters you very much want your editors to have your back. You want them to stick up for you. When you write a story and someone says, that is not true. You can't ever believe that in any gossip stuff that you get into or any serious event that is she did, that they're going to up end their entire editorial mission. Most magazines that are in this country are going to put the president-elect on the cover. That is just a fact. They cannot have it (inaudible).
KURTZ: Let me get to, you know everyone knows the anti-Trump protest in major cities around the country and Trump rallies and people are up by tweeting that this is being incited by the media and I don't know if that is true, but the question is 15 million follower came up in an interview tonight in CBS 60 minutes, Lesley start asking him whether as President, will he continue to -- be quite so desirous on Tweeter. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: When you give me a bad story or when you give me an in accurate story or someone other than you and the network or whatever and of course CBS would never do it, though they do it, but I have a method of fighting back. That is very tough.
LESLEY STAHL, CBS NEWS: You're going to do that as president?
TRUMP: I'm going to do very restrain, if I use it at all. I am going to be very restrained.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KURTZ: The importance of Twitter and do you believe President Trump will be very restrained?
MCPIKE: I think Donald Trump has uncovered that people are interested in getting their information straight from the source, straight from the candidate rather than through the filtered or perhaps the media. And I think, you know, a lot of the folks that are going to criticize him and I maybe well one of him for not being traditionally presidential. I think what we need to realized is that for a lot of people, traditionally presidential being very restrained on something like twitter is not necessarily what they voted for. That the concept of what is presidential can change.
KURTZ: Julie, this did not last that long, because this morning the real Donald Trump tweets wow, New York Times is losing thousands of subscribers because of their poor and very and highly in accurate coverage of the Trump phenomenon. So he is back to whacking the media.
ROGINSKY: Yeah, that is what we need from the president. I think he has to understand that when the president speaks, the markets are moved and foreign policies get made. These are not things that should be done in a vacuum based in 140 character tweets that the president tweets out. You have to give a little thought and not in the middle of the night about tweeting out something that you are upset about.
KURTZ: When the president tweets, speaks or tweets. All right, let me get a break and let us know what you think. Stick to the email@example.com.
When we come back Hillary Clinton campaign chief says one of the reasons that she lost was the press was against her and later Sharyl Attkinson, on the media bias and the election outcome and the coming coverage of the Trump administration.
KURTZ: By the way the New York magazine is going to retract the loser coverage? Can you retract a cover? Turns out to the Hillary Clinton campaign is also charging media bias, now that she lost the election. Everyone expected her to win. Kristen and in a conference call with donors yesterday widely reported by the media, Hillary Clinton's top by FBI Chief James Comey, renewing that investigation and to the e-mails.
RNL saying that Comey letter rising doubts that were groundless and baseless, proven to be, stop our momentum, says Hillary Clinton. Now we will never know what would have happened. Could it be said that the saturation coverage of Comey's renewed investigation did change the atmosphere?
MCPIKE: She was already falling in the polls before the Comey letter. And frankly, I mean, if you asked about anything in this last two weeks, that would have change the voters mind, I think something like the affordable care acts premium announcement, is going to have much more on effect on someone's pocketbook than the rehashing of the debate over the e-mails that we have already been having for a months. So I think the idea that sop her momentum, I have a lot of questions about that.
KURTZ: Fair enough. I think it is her media momentum, that was the story for days and now Julie, John Podesta and the former campaign chairman for Clinton said according to The Hill on different conference call, the media always covered her as a person who would be president and therefore tried to the advice rate her before the election, but covered Trump as someone who was entertaining and sort of gave him a pass. Is that a pass?
ROGINSKY: Well I think and this is due to Trump and not the media started to normalize some of the comments whether about the judge or the woman or anything else.
KURTZ: What do you mean when you say the media is normalized?
ROBERTS: Because when you have, let's remember, Mitt Romney had that battered women comment and then the 48 percent, everybody went ballistic. It was one mishap, right? Trump has so many time and time again. It almost became normalized. It almost become anything and not one became crazy and something that was had them happened that people, because so many of them happened, but people were starting to get used to it.
I will say, look I think that people voted for the hope and change in 2008 and those same people voted for hope and change now. People were promised the height of the great recession that their pocketbooks were going to be fuller and they are not going to be paying as much for health care as it pointed out, and it did not happen. You cannot say that people that voted for Trump are all racists or bigots or anything else. A lot of them were Obama voters and voted for the same thing.
KURTZ: You cannot say that even thou some have been saying that. We will talk about that later in the program. Also interesting that Donald Trump is saying that he may preserve some elements of Obama care particularly banned on pre-existing conditions and allowing young people on 26 to stay on the parent's policy. In which, some people could say always changing is my old President-elect go through this and they have to reconcile, they made promises with reality. But in that Podesta conversation, he said that he was talking about what they do is the old coverage of the email scandal versus Donald Trump business conflicts, didn't release his tax returns, but does the Clinton camp really believe that the media was not aggressive enough toward Donald Trump?
SOLTIS ANDERSON: They may. I think that the bigger problem that the Clinton campaign had is how they were covered, because some people just saying in a blanket fashion that the media is maybe anti-Trump. But they certainly won in the tank for Hillary Clinton and the reason that I would point to on that, is that over the course of these campaign the media was on the activist mission to get Hillary Clinton to apologize for everything whether it was the e-mails, whether it is Benghazi, whether it is her husband in the past, it was all these activist mission and it was very strange rather than covering what you would actually do, and I think you that is why Podesta (inaudible).
KURTZ: Her own top advisers said that she had a path lodge logical inability to apologize, but at the same time some of this WikiLeaks disclosure, whether it is Donna Brazile leaking CNN questions at advance, other journalist closing up with the Clinton campaign mad a lot of people think that the press was not on attack for Hillary Clinton and starting to be very sympathetic to her.
MCPIKE: Well, if you take a look Donald has been asking this question over for the last number of decades. Do you think that the presidential candidates are they talking about issues that mattered to you? Is that what you hear when you tuned in to the media and you see what it being discussed. We hit record lows in this campaign and I place a lot of blame on, for instance the Clinton campaign for that?
KURTZ: Do you place the blame on the media which was constantly distracted, you know by access Hollywood and all kinds of accusations?
MCPIKE: I would have loved to see more covers of the issue. But you know what, people knew that Donald Trump wanted to build a wall, renegotiate trade deals and he made very clear on what he wanted to do. Hillary Clinton had a basket of about 5,000 things that she would talk about variously. And I think that was hard for any one message to break through that.
KURTZ: All right. We're going to leave it there, Julie Roginsky, Kristen Soltis Anderson and Erin McPike, thanks very much for stopping by this Sunday. Ahead Frank Luntz has some brand new polling on how the Americans view the coverage of the election.
But first some ugly stuff for the liberal commentators, I mentioned this earlier, which is still rallying against Donald Trump. His voters have the press.
KURTZ: I understand that liberal commentators are upset that Donald Trump has just won the White House. What I don't understand is why they are still saying ugly things in a way for re-elections.
(Inaudible) is Chief Correspondence and an African- American who wrote last night that Donald Trump is not going to be president and re-tweeted after the election results I did quite not understand how much white people hated us. What? Many white voters help get Barack Obama two terms. CNN Commentator Van Jones is a former Obama White House aide said this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JONES: We have not talked about race. This was a "whitelash." That was a whitelash against a changing country. It was a whitelash against a black president in part.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KURTZ: A "whitelash" because your candidate lost. It is fine to be critical of Trump. But he did spend time reaching out to the black community. And then there is guy, I respect media critic, Jeff Jarvis, who has a graduate journalist program at the city of University of New York. He said that journalism seems broken, tweeting, "My profession failed to inform the public about the fascist they are electing."
Did you miss so much negative stuff the press dump on Trump? Driver also call the outcome again, "The victory of the uneducated and uninformed." Sorry it is really unattractive if you call voters dumb, because you don't agree with their decision.
Gabriel Prominent Author really went off, "America died on November 8, 2016, not with a bang or a whimper, but at its own hand via electoral suicide. We will brace for the violence, the anger, the racism, the misogyny, the xenophobia, the nativism, the white sense of grievance will undoubtedly be unleash now,"
Pretty scary stuff and then what about Director Aaron Sorkin, his heroes are usually preachy liberals like Martin Sheen on the West Wing, a program I really like. In a letter to his daughter N.Y. posted by Vanity Fair, Sorkin wrote, "This is truly horrible. It is the first time that a thoroughly incompetent pig with dangerous ideas, a serious psychiatric disorder, and no knowledge of the world and no curiosity to learn has. And it wasn't just Donald Trump who won last night. It was his supporters too. The Klan won last night, white nationalist, sexist, racist and buffoons."
The Klan won? That might be played on the TV drama but it is a letter, just seem angry and over rot. Aren't liberals supposed to support tolerance and unity? Wouldn't they have been furious if Hillary had won and conservatives kept trashing her? You could still fight for your beliefs, but perhaps you should follow President Obama lead and be a bit more gracious toward the guy who won.
Coming up one of the leading never Trumper's Rich Lowry and a former Democratic spokesman face off over the coverage of this election and later Sharyl Attkisson and some stunning negative headlines greeting President- Elect Trump.
KURTZ: The election maybe over but some of the media are still furious, perhaps a bit shell shocked at the outcome and that includes conservative common commentators who win the never Trump camp and Liberal commentator who are in I can't even imagine this guy is president camp.
Joining us now in New York is Rich Lowry, Editor of National Review and Fox News Contributor, and here in Washington Mo Elleithee, Executive Director of Georgetown University Institute of Politics, a one time Democratic Spokesperson and now also a brand new Fox News Contributor. Welcome gentlemen. Rich, you famously put out an issue on National Review, against Trump and you have been pretty steadfast in opposing him, and now you have mixed feelings about Donald Trump becoming president.
RICH LOWRY, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Well, the against Trump issue was in the primaries and in the general election we never got on board the Trump train, but the coverage of Hillary Clinton was much harsher. Every cover we ran about the presidential race and the general election was an anti- Hillary cover.
I am not sure if any news organization out there had more harsh coverage and incisively coverage of the email controversies in the coming investigation than we did. But yeah, I was surprised as anyone. I wrote that he would win the thing. I could see him getting to 260 electoral votes, but I had a lot of trouble seeing him getting him over the top. He did it. My hats off to him, and now we are hoping for the best.
KURTZ: You had a lot of company in that regard. Now, Trump, not only running against the main stream press but ran against you and National Review and The Weekly Standards and Bill Kristol and Cloud Hammer and Jonah, does his victory undercut you a bit in terms of who now defines conservatism within the Republican Party?
LOWRY: Yeah, so in the party now we have this enormous populous wing, most people would have thought there was a chance that even existed a year ago. And the populous control the conservatives control congress and if they can get it together, they is a chance to do a lot of good. But the populous clearly had it with him. Because you always want to control the White House and you look at how the course of the national history and that is been more common that we have had uncomfortable and awkward relationships with Republican presidents rather than hand and glove relationships. Really the only exception would be Ronald Reagan. When have problems with him at times, but when Trump is right, and he going to hit on all sides, will be among his fiercest defenders, when he is wrong, we will have the independent to call him out and try to correct him.
KURTZ: OK. Liberal commentators like yourself on your estimate. Donald Trump has over estimated the appeal of Hillary Clinton.
MO ELLEITHEE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF GEORGETOWN UNIVERSITY INSTITUTE OF POLITICS: Well, look I think that I also have been eating a lot of query. I thought back in the spring, during the primaries, when we saw what is going on, I thought that a lot of Democrats were underestimating his potential. I thought there was a path for him that he could win, but like Rich has said like a lot of other people did not think that it was likely. I think one of the problems that too many of us had was that we were too busy looking at this election through an old paradigm, looking at it through the paradigm of left versus right, looking at it through the paradigm of the two candidates and did not spend enough time looking at what was happening around the country and this populace wave that swept.
KURTZ: I would say that the media by and large were guilty with that.
ELLEITHEE: That is right.
KURTZ: Especially looking back, now, when CNN Van Jones said that the election was a white lash against the black president and when (inaudible) said I did not realize how much white people hate us, is that adding to the divisiveness of the country?
ELLEITHEE: Look, I believe that again and I was wrong before, but I believe that there was this incredibly strong, unheard voice in Middle America that saw Donald Trump as the vehicle to be heard. It turns out that much of that voice was blue collar and was white. What we need to be careful about is pitting that voice against the Democratic Coalition, against African American and Hispanics, and I think the left and Democrats are going to have to go moving forward and figure out how to bridge these two different constituencies once again, because of just taking one side against another.
KURTZ: Let me get Rich back in, when terms like white lash, Barack Obama, I remember was not on the ballot this time, do you think that some in the media are going too far in defining these election and strictly and even harshly racial terms?
LOWRY: Of course. And it's what always happen, it is very blind and it is completely wrong and it was pointed out early in the program, that one of the key swing votes in this election was working class voters, who have voted for Obama in 2012 and we want for Trump this time. They did not all of a sudden become hideous racist in the course of four years. And I think it is very important for folks on the left to try to extend a little bit more sympathetic understanding to this working class rather than having contempt for them and Mo is exactly right, you know you can appeal to both sides. There used to be Democratic politician who really tried to do that, like Bill Clinton, but just this time around both the Democratic Party and the media just seem to think that there was something wrong inherently and in even trying to have an appeal to this voters.
KURTZ: And I am hearing some commentators on your side now, talk about sexism and that Hillary Clinton could not get there as opposed to all of the other reasons that we talked about, she didn't visit Michigan until the very end, and emails, and everything else and that she could not get there because she is a woman. Does that seem simplified?
ELLEITHEE: I think it's a bit over simplified. I'm not saying that isn't inherent sexism in many ways, but I don't think that does not define these election. What I will say though is whether we're talking about racism or sexism, I believe that we got to try to bridge the gap and we shouldn't over play that, but having said that, it's important to realize that the rhetoric that Donald Trump used throughout the elections did scare and alienate millions of American in a lot of these groups. And so, there is still that voice that needs to be heard. I hope that the president-elect, just as Democrat, I think they need to reach out and try to be heard by the white blue collar voters. He has to begin do his part to mend the divide with the people who are scared.
KURTZ: Well, I have a half of a minute. I mean Donald Trump wins against the press Wall Stripes, middle left and center, do you think that was a factor in his victory?
LOWRY: Yeah, it was. Republicans always complain about the press and often times it just comes off of blinding. I think it had more impact this time, because the bias is more obvious one and two it fit into these generalize theme that Trump had that was very powerful and that the system was rigged and our institutions are failing us and the press is still incredibly bias. And if Trump supporters were out in the thousands after Hillary Clinton victory and breaking things and smashing windows, and turning things to cops, it would be the front page news and there would be a tsunami of criticism throughout the media and we're hearing none of that, about these anti-Trump protestors.
KURTZ: I can't disagree with that. And on that point Rich Lowry, Mo Elleithee, thanks very much for joining us.
Ahead on the "MediaBuzz," why do the mainstream media, just now own up to the bias and misleading coverage that barred the much of this campaign? Sharyl Attkisson, on why it was obvious all along, and later, the late night comics choking on Donald Trump's victory.
KURTZ: Your watch maybe over but some of the media remain really angry about the billionaire republican who just won the White House. New York's Daily News which ridiculed Donald Trump as a clown and a dummy throughout the campaign. House of horror, you can see the White House, Salon, The misogyny apocalypse, The New Yorker Magazine, An American Tragedy. Editor David Remnick saying Donald Trump's victory is a triumph for the forces of the nativism, misogyny and racism.
Joining us now is an old friend of the show Sharyl Attkisson the host of Full Measure, airing on Sunday morning and Sinclair Television Station and author of the upcoming book The Smear. So for a year and half, you were among the few voices that were saying don't underestimate Donald Trump, don't write him off and don't minimize his appeal and now you have a lot of journalist coming out and saying, boy we got it wrong, we blew it.
SHARYL ATTKISSON, FULL MEASURE HOST: I think part of that because I'm not a political insider and I was not looking at the polls for my results and predictions. I was listening to ordinary people and anecdotes traveling the country and asking my friends liberals and conservatives and those who are in between and it was pretty clear to me as I predicted that Trump would win or would likely win.
KURTZ: Yeah. Well, do you think that this kind of a group that sets in a situation like this and everyone that a journalist knows is against Trump and everyone on the twitter feed is mocking Trump and perhaps in many cases reinforced by their own personal bias that this guy, who never held political office was not fit for the White House?
ATTKISSON: Absolutely. You put the finger on it. And I think that in a big picture to me, the media had allowed itself, we had allowed our self to be infiltrated by the political operatives, meaning we hired them, we welcome them into our news room and they work in the news department, they shape coverage, they work as managers and that is one reason why I think that you had a whole rash of news outlets actually trying to overtly and admit they were doing this and convince people who to vote for rather than just bring the facts and report on the campaign.
KURTZ: Don't you think that viewers on all the networks who see the political commentators and many of them, you know two days from the previous campaign on the right or left know that these are partisans and do not view them or do they view them is kind a like we are all a bunch of insiders and grew up in journalism and grew up in politics?
ATTKISSON: I think they see everybody sort of an insider's, there is a market for that. Clearly some people want to hear that sort of coverage that is given in the campaign, but someone tweeted to me there are more of us who think for our self than they are of you who try to tells us what to think, I kind a sum it up.
KURTZ: Sharyl, I want to see the editors and journalists and even New York Times media columnists say that Trump is such a different, such a dangerous character in their view of potentially dangerous. We have to suspend our usual standards and cover him differently more aggressively than Hillary Clinton, who is , you know career politician, former cabinet member and then you see this USA poll by nearly ten to one, people said the media wanted Hillary Clinton to win and that included three quarters of Clinton supporters. So people are getting it.
ATTKISSON: Yeah, and because they had admitted it, there is always been a subtext or belief that the media is in on it sometimes, but they really came out in the USA today for the first time in a 34 year history saying that they were going to weigh in on a presidential campaign, don't vote for Trump. The New York Times, the header which I think was a particularly remarkable according to my information and there was a lot of information about stories that they could have done in Hillary Clinton that in a neutral sense a news organization would have done and yet they made the decision to hold or withhold those stories. Things like that have really cut into what credibility the media has.
KURTZ: And speaking of that, I mean you have been in this embarrassing performance and there is really no other word for it. Do you think the press will learn some lessons in the future, particularly when it comes to sort of getting out of the New York and Washington bubble?
ATTKISSON: Not really.
KURTZ: You're not optimistic.
ATTKISSON: Little. The same people who made this decisions which I think in many of us is particularly bad and agreed to decisions. When a journalist stand point cannot be relied upon either to fix their own problems or to correctly and accurately predict and report on things in the future. This is a huge problem.
KURTZ: Do you think that part of it is a sort of a cultural or social pressure where to sort of break from the pack and when you have people that maps and data and polls and saying that there's no way that Donald Trump is going to win and you pick off all these groups and he lost the debate and do they come out and say no, few did it and there's a chance and here is why. Do you think that there's that kind of pressure?
ATTKISSON: Absolutely. If you're someone and a lot of people in the press believe it or not, are group thinkers and they are in that crab mentality. If that is you, you are not going to be comfortable position, providing another analysis. You and I are not like that, we talked about this. The pressure that you feel and when you simply report the facts what you think you see, it's not the personal opinion of what you want to see happen, but it's treated like that, now your bias, because you're off the page and off the narrative and different than us. I don't mind being different from other people, but I think a lot of people are uncomfortable in that position.
KURTZ: It is not always easy, Sharyl Attkisson, great to see you, looking forward to your book.
ATTKISSON: Thank you.
KURTZ: After the break, some brand new polling done for this program on the media and the election and Donald Trump. Frank is up next.
KURTZ: So many failures to exam in the wake of Donald Trump upset victory among pundits, but also among pollsters, joining us from Los Angeles is Frank Luntz the veteran pollster and Fox News Contributor. Frank, you have a brand new post Election Day poll and I put the numbers here, founded 54 percent of those serving find the media coverage election bias, 46 percent said fair, and 39 percent said that it was anti-Trump and then that is a t but look at this, fair to each candidate 39 percent of the coverage was Anti-Trump, 31 percent have the coverage is Poll Clinton as a total of 70 percent.
On the other side only 16 percent says pro-Trump, 14 percent say Anti- Clinton, what is your take away.
FRANK LUNTZ, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Full understood what was happening in this election and I think, listen to your previous guest, that they were correct that Donald Trump running against the media, was an effective strategy, it upset the reporters. I was on Trump's plane or the media plane, the day before the election and the reporters were used to it by that point. They were used to being a focal point of Donald Trump's criticism. But for those who didn't want Washington to control their live, it was an effective strategy.
One more thing Howie, what I found interesting was in the exit polls when we studied why they were so wrong in state after state after state, it's because Trump voters refused to participate. It's not that they lied, it is not that they changed their information when they were filling out the ballot, it's that they said I don't want to do this, I don't want to help the media or I don't want to help the establishment, I'm not going to take that poll. No one knew that it was that deep and that passionate until Election Day and this is going to continue well into the administration.
KURTZ: Yeah, polls often have a trouble measuring passion. Hillary Clinton we should say did win or is winning the popular vote, but that is not how you are going to like the president, you got to get to 270.
You made a little news on Election Day with an interview with Yahoo. Let me play a little bit of that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LUNTZ: Starting tonight on this show, no one will call me a Republican again, because I'm not part of this. I'm not part of that system. I'm not part of that negativity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KURTZ: You go way back, you worked with Newt Gingrich in 1994. What do you mean no one will call you a Republican again?
LUNTZ: Because it's not appropriate, because I've tried over the last two years to tell it straight. I did this on "60 minutes," I did it for the "New York Times," I did it for "Time" magazine. Trying to - and for the BBC, trying to be correct, trying to be accurate and not taking a point of view. And for you to label me, for the media to label me a Republican is not proper. There are some people who come out like James Carville, who is always going to take the Democratic perspective and there is some people who come on, who always take the Republican perspective. My job is to be accurate and to be precise and to not take any side and I've had it with this labeling, because we know.
KURTZ: Well, you've had a lot of Republican clients over the years. I think that is part of the labeling. But you also said in that interview we just played, that you're not part of the negativity, so the impression I got is that you were not happy with the way Donald Trump ran his campaigning and you didn't want to be associated with that either.
LUNTZ: I was not happy with the entire tone, I was not happy with the debates, because there wasn't enough substance. It was all about personality. I was not happy with the advertising. The Chris Wallace debate was the exception. The Chris Wallace debate actually showed people that could you have a real conversation and you could understand what the candidates were coming from. And he deserves tremendous kudos. But Howard, for the most part, this campaign was the most negative of anything I've experienced in the 30 years that I've been doing it and there has to be a way for people to unite, there has to be common ground. If you really want to get tax reform, if you really want to get an anti-poverty program, if you really want the U.S. to re-establish itself in the world order, then you're going to have to work across the aisle to get that situation on.
KURTZ: Let me just give you one more question, you said that in an essay in Time magazine, Frank that you were shocked by the outcome, that there was an echo chamber in the media and political establishment, that certainly guy like Trump could never win. Did you fall prey to the echo chamber like a lot of people?
LUNTZ: I absolutely thought, when I saw the exit polls and they had a plus five, plus six in states like Michigan, Pennsylvania, Ohio is dead even, Florida, Clinton had the lead, I was sure Clinton was going to win. And your exit poll, they were Fox News exit polls and it was clear to win. I have no doubt, base on the exit polls. And there were your exit poll, they were Fox News exit polls and it was clear. And then when the election is over, what happen? And then I was as stunned as anybody. But then you accept that, you acknowledge your mistake, you learn from it and then you move forward. And Howard, we got to find a way to move forward where it is about all of us together rather than about winners and losers. And I think that is going to be a very important theme that I'll be pushing between now and Election Day.
KURTZ: A good closing statement, Frank Luntz, great to see you, from Los Angeles.
Still to come, the late night comics who savaged Donald try to come to grips with President Trump.
KURTZ: It was no joking matter but nearly all of the late night comics were vehemently opposed to Donald Trump. So while they managed a few jokes after election night, most of them were, well, pretty bummed.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEPHEN COLBERT, THE LATE SHOW HOST: This is what it feels like when America is made great again. I was wondering, and I was really hoping it would feel better because this sucks!
SETH MEYERS, THE LATE NIGHT SHOW HOST: As a whites man, I also know that any emotions that I'm feeling are likely a fraction of those being felt by the LGBTQ community, African-Americans, Hispanic Americans, Muslim Americans. I'm hopeful that he is not actually a racist and then he just used racist rhetoric to court voters.
JIMMY KIMMEL, JIMMY KIMMEL LIVE HOST: No matter how you feel, Donald Trump is the president of United States of America, so thank god we legalized marijuana yesterday.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I know for a woman as a woman, it feels so sexist and I think I guess the message that I want to like spread out to other women is exactly what you're saying, not to give up -- sorry. I hate (BEEP).
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KURTZ: Only Jimmy Fallon who took some heat, because he only joked around with Trump during the campaign, remember when he pulled Trump's hair, struck the same tone.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JIMMY FALLON, THE TONIGHT SHOW: Republicans hope that he will keep his promise to build a wall and Democrats hope he'll keep his promise not to accept the election results.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KURTZ: Well, the night time community are entitled to get serious and if they were that deeply affected by Trump's victory, but a big chunk of their audience just voted the other way and they might keep that in mind over the next four years.
That is it for this post election edition of "MediaBuzz." I am Howard Kurtz, thanks for joining us, we hope you'll like our Facebook page, we post a lot of original content there, we respond to your questions on video. Media buzz at foxnews.com, firstname.lastname@example.org ask about the media, make a comment about the media, continue the conversation on Twitter. I'm Howard Kurtz and I will see you back here next Sunday. Look forward to checking out with you then with the latest buzz.
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