Should feds treat Ahmad Khan Rahami as an enemy combatant?

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," September 20, 2016. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone, I'm Juan Williams along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Brian Kilmeade, Dana Perino and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5 o'clock in New York City and this is "The Five." Major developments in the investigation of suspected New York and New Jersey bomber Ahmad Rahami, did the FBI overlooked another warning, this time from the alleged terrorist own father. Chief Intelligence Correspondent Catherine Herridge has the details. Catherine?

CATHERINE HERRIDGE, CHIEF INTELLIGENCE CORRESPONDENT: Well, thanks. The suspect's father told reporters in New Jersey today that he warned the feds about his son two years ago.




UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Doing bad? Why he was doing bad?

M. RAHAMI: He stabbed my son, he hit my wife and I put him to jail two years ago.


M. RAHAMI: My son.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What son did he send?

M. RAHAMI: Nasser.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why? What happened? Why did you send?

M. RAHAMI: For no reason. Two years ago I called the FBI; my son was doing really bad, OK? But they check it almost two months, they say, "He's OK, he's clean, he's not a terrorist." I say, OK. Now they say he's a terrorist. I say, OK.


HERRIDGE: When we first told you about that prior contact here on Fox News yesterday between the FBI and Rahami before the dramatic arrest. The victim in that domestic dispute alleged Rahami also showed signs of possible radicalization. Two sources confirmed to Fox the FBI followed by on the lead, but there was not enough to pursue it and the original allegations were withdrawn. A lot of other people had picked up the story today and just within the last hour. So the FBI had issue a statement that written part, quote, "In August 2014, the FBI initiated an assessment of Ahmad Rahami based on comment made by his father after a domestic dispute that were subsequently reported to authorities. The FBI conducted internal date database reviews, interagency checks, and multiple interviews, none of which revealed ties to terrorism." Meantime, two sources now confirmed to Fox News that writings recovered at the scene where Rahami was picked up including references to the al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden who was killed by the Navy SEAL in 2011, as well as the American cleric Anwar al-Awlaki, who's really the father of the digital Jihad. He was the first American targeted for death by the CIA and killed in a 2011 drone strike. It's worth noting that Awlaki was a source of inspiration for the terrorist who shot dead 49 at the Pulse nightclub in Orlando. And despite the very public statements we've had from authorities, two sources insist the view among the rank and file, investigators in New York, New Jersey, as well as the federal level here in Washington, is that the search is not over and that it seems unlikely, at this point, based on the evidence and how the events unfolded that Rahami was acting completely alone, Juan.

WILLIAMS: Thank you, Catherine. Appreciate it.

HERRIDGE: You're welcome.

WILLIAMS: So, let me ask you Kim --


WILLIAMS: What did you think? Did the FBI flub this?

GUILFOYLE: Listen, I was a, you know, big fan of law enforcement and definitely some of people in bureau and they do a phenomenal job, and obviously to be commended for being able to get him into custody and located him, people seeing something, saying something. Everything worked right there. Now, in terms of circumstances here we're at least hearing some initial reports, but we have not been able to verify for sure the veracity of the statements, saying that he reported this, so we cannot --

WILLIAMS: You mean the father?



GUILFOYLE: To say that OK, this is something that they meant. If they went and talked to them they had to make threat statement at the time. And you just wonder what is sufficient to trigger further scrutiny and review, to be able to devote manpower resources, agents to it to follow it up, and then what's the protocol for what period of time to do this. So obviously, you don't want to hear something like this, because you want to get it right, because they just need to get it right one time and look, and look at what happened. We're just lucky that despite, you know the injuries, et cetera, that there wasn't a loss of life in the circumstances.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Can I ask Kimberly something to on that, because the suspect didn't initially talk, but it would be wise from him to talk because if there are other bombs, if he did have help, if one of those bombs actually ends up hurting somebody, then he could be held responsible, if I understand that correctly.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, exactly, as an aid in a better or coconspirators to add further time on to his charges. And this why you would -- it's good that he was taken alive and what Juan mentioned yesterday, he was able to get back quick medical treatment, because you -- that's an information, you know, rich source of Intel right there, that you can find out who was he speaking to? Was there any kind of potential felony (ph) was operating? Were other family members involved? Are there other potential explosive devices planted in different areas? What does he know to different contacts that lead thread to another potential terror incident that could be, you know, basically, you know positioned to happen in the future that we could maybe prevent by information from him.


GUILFOYLE: That's what I think is important.

WILLIAMS: One of the interesting things, Brian, is that according to FBI, this guy was a ghost online. He did not have a profile where he was in contact.


WILLIAMS: Direct contact.

KILMEADE: Well, it is me to text him. He keep going, he kept going there, go to Afghanistan and Pakistan, we'll be in touch.


KILMEADE: I'll see you soon. His wife disappears two weeks ago. His wife disappears -- his mom disappears three months ago. At which time he is in constant contact with somebody. There's no way this guy, logic tells you there's no way this guy acted alone.


KILMEADE: There's no way he is sitting in the second floor with amounts to a lean to, which four other people whether like, I wonder what he is doing with that huge pot on the surface and his Christmas lights. Logic tells you there's something there. And Dana, to your point, yeah, he could talk right now, but he doesn't care. He's never seeing the light of day again. And the biggest (inaudible) for him, probably is that he nodded off and survived in a doorway, which is bizarre. I don't know what he was on that he couldn't stay conscious for 24 hours after the world is looking for him. But I really think the FBI in a way is overworked and understaffed. If you think about it, Orlando, they knew about him. San Bernardino, they knew about him.


KILMEADE: New York, New Jersey, they knew about him. We knew about him, we didn't (inaudible) down on it. If they want more restraints and more freedom, let's hear it. If not, get more people --


KILMEADE: And it's not just a problem.

GUILFOYLE: It's (inaudible).

WILLIAMS: But Dana --


WILLIAMS: Oh, I'm sorry, Greg. You want to jump in.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Well, no. There is, there is an over- arching threat to all of these. OK, the father accuses the son of being a terrorist. That makes him Islamophobic, right?


WILLIAMS: Mohammad?

GUTFELD: The father is Islamophobic.

PERINO: It's not an easy thing to do to turn your son in.

GUTFELD: You know, I might --


GUTFELD: I'm getting -- the point is, in all of these cases you have to be so careful as an investigator when you're making an accusation like that, that you could lose your career, because if you appears being bigoted because we live in a climate that if you actually see something and you say something, you end up being something, which is unpopular and perhaps you might get demoted. You look at these last four attacks.


GUTFELD: Yeah. You look at the last four attacks in Orlando, New York, Philly and San Bernardino, they all were traveling. They were all traveling to Pakistan, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia. So here you have --


GUTFELD: Here you have needles in a haystack that are sending you a helpful signal. These needles -- you can actually see these needles moving. Why not profile travel? That's not racist.


GUTFELD: That's not -- it's traveling.



WILLIAMS: But not Dana, I was going to say to you that the local office here in New York, the FBI office said, "There is no evidence of a sale (ph)."

PERINO: Well, and that might be true. But it is early on the investigation. And I think we got so much new more information today, more information from the hearing from the father that it's a little bit too early for him to say that. Remember, the last time the government said, oh, there's nothing to see here, there was actually more to see. So I would, I would wait. The other thing I wanted to point out is -- two points, the FBI. Remember James Comey tells us that there are open investigations in all 50 states. That's probably means multiple people on all 50 states. I would think that one of the things that the government need to think about, and taxpayers need to think about], is the FBI under resourced? And do they need more? Do they need different laws? Do they need different rules?


PERINO: Do they need more people, recruitment, training, and that? And we should -- we're not to decide. Are we willing to pay for that, and what -- if we are not willing to increase the budget then, what we are willing to give up? The other thing I would point out is that there is a very interesting article, frontpage of the cover story of "Weekly Standard" just current week by Steve Hayes and Tom Joslin about Guantanamo Bay, and President Obama's determination to close it. In it, it says that President Obama is convinced that GITMO is the big recruiting to all .


PERINO: . for terrorist. That is not the evidence that any of these cases for these guys. I t is all been traced by, it's either bin Laden, but most importantly, al-Awlaki. No one is talking about GITMO anymore, but we're on the path to closing them.

WILLIAMS: That's a good point. All right --


WILLIAMS: It was a very powerful image. There you see a guy suspected of such heinous crimes being attended to by EMT's and given all of his rights, all the rights he's entitled to as a U.S. citizen. Another reminder of how great this country is, in my opinion. In America, we even treat bad guys with dignity. Trump, however, lamenting the treatment given to Rahami. He even suggests we -- maybe we should treat him as an enemy combat.


DONALD TRUMP, PRESUMPTIVE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: He will be taken care of by some of the best doctors in the world. He will be given a fully modern and up dated hospital room. It will probably even have room service knowing the way our country is. Congress should pass measures to ensure that far (ph) and enemy combatants are treated as such. These are enemies, these are combatants --


WILLIAMS: You hear the same thing from Senator Graham of South Carolina. And basically the distinction is here with -- if he is treated as an enemy combatant Greg, then he has no more random rights and no rights to counsel, no lawyers.

GUTFELD: Yeah. Well, first to Trump is really like the guy at the bar or the bartender.

KILMEADE: Absolutely.

GUTFELD: It is exactly what you would -- you could go into a place. This is exactly what you're going to hear, and it's like, this is crazy. Why are we treating them? Now obviously, we give him the medical care because we want him to survive, so we can get info out of him. We don't want him to die. We want to protect him, so that we can use him. We're using him.

GUILFOYLE: So we can drain them.

GUTFELD: Yeah, we can drain them dry and then we'll kill him. But I, I agree -- I agree, though, that you should -- with Trump and with Graham, Senator Graham, that you should lose your rights. You know, with Islamism declares that the world is a battle field. It is no longer up to our idealism to dictate response. Once you go jihadist, you forfeit your status as a citizen, and we have to. We -- it's the only -- this is a new world. It's not the same world anymore.

KILMEADE: Well, not only that. The Boston police chief agrees with Greg and agrees with Trump. He said we delay, this could be reading Miranda rights to Tsarnaev brothers, because we have to get the most information .


KILMEADE: . as quickly as possible to stop the next attack. And I would argue that this is the same thing here there's an urgency. Not deny, delay. Why not look at him and who he is .


KILMEADE: . and understand that all of us, especially it was in 23rd, 10 blocks away, you can be say it's personal. All of us are somewhat at risk, right?

WILLIAMS: As I understand, he has not been read his Miranda rights. And he's been charged locally, but he's not been faced yet any federal charges.

KILMEADE: I understand, it's because of his medical condition that he has not been lawyered (ph) up yet, but it has been no, it has been no legal decision yet.

GUTFELD: That's was smart.

WILLIAMS: That's the key. Now Judge Napolitano, Dana, says, he has constitutional rights, he's an American citizen.

PERINO: That's right.

WILLIAMS: What do you think?

PERINO: That's right. Well, I mean when we had a big battle here, in this country after Ed Snowden released all the nation's secrets and that was the question of privacy and all -- I mean, American citizens should not be spied upon, they should not do this or that. He is, whether we like it or not, he is an American citizen. And one of the reasons that we treat him at the hospital is because it is another part of just who we are as an exceptional nation. So we are a nation of laws and that's why -- also at a hospital, the reason you get room service is because you're strapped to a bed and you can't get food for yourself.

GUILFOYLE: To the vending machine down the hall.

PERINO: Yes, but I guess --

KILMEADE: That's right, make a change for a dollar.


KILMEADE: All right.

PERINO: Go down to the cafeteria like when you're up and able to walk around, but I don't think we would want them. Like right now, I think to stay in this room is probably the best thing.

GUILFOYLE: Thank goodness.


GUILFOYLE: You can get some of that, the family restaurant, the chicken.

WILLIAMS: Hey, Senator Graham said something really interesting --


WILLIAMS: Kimberly, he said you can first designate him as an enemy combatant, and then try him .

PERINO: Right.

WILLIAMS: . as a civilian. Would that work?

GUILFOYLE: Well, I mean, it's definitely one approach. YOU can try it, right? You can always come back on appeal. But nevertheless, you brought up something else to in terms of exigent circumstances, public safety. When you have some of those, clear and compelling evidence, I think convincing evidence --


GUILFOYLE: Oh my, God, you have bomb in New Jersey, you've got multiple different sites with explosive devices, IED's. I mean, give me a break. You have an obligation to keep the public safe. So whether you're an American citizen or not, then you would be able to go in to say, let me see if I can get fit you down and get some information and appeal to you, you know, as a family person at this. Anything you do to try to be able to get information or does he have someone else that he's working? Like Dana said and Catherine Herridge said that it keep becomes parent he wasn't just a solo actor.

KILMEADE: He may be the leader.

GUILFOYLE: So who else is the -- perhaps, exactly, but who -- and by the way .


GUILFOYLE: . who else has he influenced?

GUTFELD: I don't think --

GUILFOYLE: Then who else you can influence in and radicalized.

GUTFELD: And he could have been the guy that they just used.

WILLIAMS: They could have --

GUTFELD: They could have just been the guy that they used it, put him out there.

PERINO: But there's also --

GUTFELD: He's not the leader, but he is the guy that gets caught first.

PERINO: But the other thing we didn't --


PERINO: . talk about. We don't have time for, but I'll just make a quick point. It's the domestic violence connection to .


PERINO: . the women and that -- it's repeated in these instances.

GUTFELD: But the other thing --


GUTFELD: The anti-gay thing is important because the left prefers to focus on the homophobia of Christians, you know they don't want to bake the cake, and that's horrible. But they can no longer escape the hypocrisy of not facing the anti-gay element of Islamophobia -- Islamism. It's cowardice .

WILLIAMS: Well, I mean --

GUTFELD: . to go after Christians and not go after Islamism.

WILLIAMS: Let me emphasize your point that he apparently told his ex-wife now.


WILLIAMS: That he was appalled at the presence of homosexuality in United States. He said there is no homosexuality in Afghanistan.


WILLIAMS: You're looking live on a Trump rally in North Carolina. We're keeping an eye on it. If Trump makes any news, we bring it you right here on "The Five." Otherwise, you can watch this live on Ahead, Donald Trump renews his call to start profiling, to prevent more terror attacks. We'll debate that, next.


GUILFOYLE: If we want to stop terrorists before they strike again, we are going to need to start profiling according to Donald Trump.


BILL O'REILLY, "THE O'REILLY FACTOR" SHOW HOST: You want to profile Arab or Muslim men. How would that work?

TRUMP: Well, then have no choice. Look, Israel does it and Israel does it very successfully.


O'REILLY: Are you worried that sometimes when you say these things that peaceful Muslims will be the victim of backlash, a victim of people just lumping everybody into the terror jar.

TRUMP: Well, first of all, I never said the term Muslims. You did. You tell me Muslim -- I didn't say that.


GUILFOYLE: One of his advisers, Middle East extra (ph) Walid Phares, agrees.


WALID PHARES, TRUMP'S FOREIGN POLICY ADVISOR: I was just in Egypt, as you just mentioned. And what did I do there. I met with the top Muslim clerics, the ministry of religious affairs. And I asked them, how do you do it? How to make a differentiation between extreme and not extreme? They told me, you got to identify the ideology. This is exactly what we are not doing in America.

STEVE DOOCY, "FOX AND FRIENDS" CO-HOST: Because they do extreme vetting there.

PHARES: They do extreme vetting. They have the tools for extreme vetting because they know what ideology is.


GUILFOYLE: But who were that guy in the sofa .


GUILFOYLE: . had the same your suit on.

KILMEADE: I was definitely aware of that. I would never wear of that--

GUILFOYLE: I mean --

KILMEADE: . in the show.


KILMEADE: On cable.

GUILFOYLE: All right.


KILMEADE: It doesn't work.

PERINO: It is like a corset.


KILMEADE: It's the tie is another thing.


KILMEADE: It's really the tie and suit. This guy comes in suit a hatch back and makes his suit on the spot.

GUILFOYLE: And you're like --

GUTFELD: You're wearing this because after you have lipo, you have to keep that area tight, right?


KILMEADE: Right. I m not really sure, I don't want to reveal too many in to the final block of the show.


KILMEADE: Meanwhile, back to the topic --

GUILFOYLE: Meanwhile, the producers, because they know about this being a real show, said you're wasting valuable time. OK, back to the business at hand. So you had Walid on, this morning, and he has a very specific viewpoint on this.

KILMEADE: And he did. And he is building up the fact that he had a meeting with Donald Trump and (inaudible) .


KILMEADE: . as well as General Michael Flynn. And he says, listen, the way we do it right now, we have a huge problem in Egypt, and the problem is Islamic extremist. This is a Muslim country, Sunni, Muslims country. And we have to wait it out. And the way we do that is we do -- essentially these are my words, he had a different word from it, but extreme profiling. And he actually recommended that we kind to do the same thing even though he has a different philosophy than our democratic set-up right now. They are in the state of crisis in Egypt. They are trying to stabilize things. And we are going on the other way, when we have the APV (ph) out for an Arab or Muslim. We can't even name the skin color. We tell them their height and their hair color. And maybe the right colors, if no one is offended.

GUILFOYLE: Right. And then we get confused. They don't know if they are still looking for Dan or May.

KILMEADE: Yeah, we don't really know.

GUILFOYLE: The blond or the brunette? OK, and so perhaps, the thoughts they advice Trump with respect to his policy that he has about extreme, vetting.



KILMEADE: It would basically, as Dana know, you have to be able to hunt people down, but you got to do it while holding on this --

WILLIAMS: You know what Greg said earlier? It's like we are in a bar. It looks like we are in a bar and this is the guy at the bar, the bartender and he is just mapping off. Because, last night I'm waiting on "O'Reilly" I'm waiting for Trump to say, oh this is how I do it. This is the method. This is how I would target people. And then he says, not only that, I'm not talking about Muslims. I'm wondering, is he talking about, except he's appealing to fear and anger in the society.



PERINO: . on the part of what he said he wasn't talking about that. The other thing in terms of being too PC is when they release the name of the suspect, OK? And it's obviously an Islamic name or an Arabic name.


PERINO: And you still can't say that there might be sort of connection to terror. I think we know enough now about that. The other thing I'm interested -- aside from how you target or you profile or whatever you call it. That could be a fine line. It's, how do we start to deal with this moment of radicalization? For example, the father have said, do the tough and say "I'm turning in my son." Because there is something that triggers it and can we do a better job of catching it before it happens. And part of it is the travel. When you go, that's where you go and get your blessing and your information and you'd be excited about.

WILLIAMS: You know, it's said in the -- it said the FBI said there were secondary screenings on two of his trips, that they stop him and did another screening, but there were no red flag.

KILMEADE: But for some reason they retake -- took his passport when he was in Afghanistan.


KILMEADE: If you do something to violate the people of Afghanistan, you've really pushed the bar along way.

GUTFELD: You know --

GUILFOYLE: It's really true.

GUTFELD: What upset me today was when President Obama was talking about, you know, globalization and people coming from here and people going there and he said that you know, America, we shouldn't fear people who look different from us.

KILMEADE: No kidding.

GUTFELD: He's got it completely wrong. It's not about race. It is about ideas. If you're talking about Egypt, where everybody is essentially, we have a few Christians, but a lot of Arabs. So it's not about appearance. They are doing vetting based on pernicious, toxic, deadly ideas.


GUTFELD: That's what we should be doing. The best prevention known to man is the immune system. We talked about our physical, our body the fact that, you know, our body, human body is free to engage with foreign agents, because we rely on an immune system. That is the hardening of a soft target, that's why you're healthy. That's the way we should be think about it. Another way to think about it is --

GUILFOYLE: But we have a compromise immune system.



GUTFELD: We have a compromise immune system. We are the beacon of light that attracts all of these poor people from other countries to come here because they want to be free. But in order to preserve that beacon of light we have to keep out the people who want to put the light out.


GUTFELD: The only way you can have a safe haven is it if it is truly safe and protected. So when we're -- when we are, quote, "profiling," we're actually protecting the refugees that want to come here, because we're fairing out the people that want to destroy, the very reason why you come here. Refugees are leaving a place that is horrible or else they wouldn't be leaving. Why bring that horribleness to here and eliminate the safe haven?

WILLIAMS: That's not --

PERINO: But the father --

WILLIAMS: That's not racial profiling.


WILLIAMS: That's not religious profiling. Is it?


WILLIAMS: And that's, and that's the question. That's what gets the objection from the left that you (inaudible), but the objection would be a violation of your constitutional rights on the basis of your faith, on the basis of --

GUTFELD: But I think it's OK, but I will say this, you're talking --

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, but we're talking about people --


GUTFELD: Look. Let's be honest. Islamism is faith. It's the most extreme faith. For some people they believe it's their best faith. So it is religious profiling if you ask somebody, hey, how do you feel about Sharia law? Problem is they might lie. That's the problem.

WILLIAMS: That's a big one. What if they say they are not a communist? We don't communist out of here.

GUTFELD: We should.


GUTFELD: You'd be the first to go.



PERINO: The father came --


PERINO: The father came -- they were -- he was against the Taliban. You know the son is 27-years-old .


PERINO: ... and it comes, it's the radicalization part. It's the father open a business might have been --


PERINO: Does he annoy al the neighbors that he was an entrepreneur, he was like trying to live the American dream.

GUTFELD: It's true.

GUILFOYLE: American chicken.

PERINO: It was fun and said --


PERINO: I don't know how you .

WILLIAMS: Good point.

PERINO: . compare that out.

GUTFELD: Yeah. Well, he -- I mean --

GUILFOYLE: Maybe listen to the dad.

PERINO: It might.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, my dad was --

PERINO: He should have a word for it.

GUILFOYLE: And we talked about that about peaceful law-abiding Muslims that, yeah, that want to be here that can left the horrible place and want to be here and be safe, ands have public safety and have good communities and safety (inaudible), that's why you got --

KILMEADE: Underwear bomber, same thing. Dad said, "I don't worry about my son." And the next thing you know, his underwear is exploding.


PERINO: Thank God --

GUTFELD: I had that problem.


GUILFOYLE: And looks like your vest might explode too.


WILLIAMS: They are picking on you, buddy.

GUILFOYLE: Next, Obama always said --


GUILFOYLE: "I'm going to win the White House." But is he starting to get worried that he could beat Hillary? Greg is going to fill us in on all of that.



GUTFELD: It's official: President Obama is scared.

How do you know? He's getting desperate. On Sunday, he said sexism is hurting Hillary's White House bid. Yes, sexism, because she's a woman. This is from no-named guy who stole a woman's job eight years ago. Remember that? Everyone knew Hillary, no one knew him. Yet, he just cut in front of her. Why? Sexism, obviously. And back then being the first black trumped being the first female. Lucky for them no transgender Native American was running or both of their clocks would have been cleaned.

But whining about sexism reveals Obama knows Hillary's in trouble. When all else fails, blame patriarchy.

Still, it's weird that you're sexist for not voting for Hillary because she's a woman, but it's okay to vote for Hillary… because she's a woman. But Obama is grasping at more straws than Michael Moore at a milkshake factory.

PERINO: Awesome.

GUTFELD: Which is why the president made this plea on Saturday:


PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: After we have achieved historic turnout in 2008 and 2012, especially in the African-American community, I will consider it a personal insult, an insult to my legacy, if this community lets down its guard and fails to activate itself in this election. You want to give me a good send-off? Go vote!


GUTFELD: It's amazing. If only he took terror this personally.

Maybe he's panicked. It's like he just woke up, realized he's late for a final for a class he blew off all semester. Because Hillary, frankly, could blow this thing. Trump has momentum because Hillary has no-mentum -- a word that I just invented.

PERINO: Banned.

GUTFELD: It's a gradual drop that didn't stop on that curb in New York. And Obama's worried if it ever will.

GUILFOYLE: Oof, that's good.

GUTFELD: All right. Dana, he seems a bit concerned. He wasn't so concerned before, right?

PERINO: I think that they are -- talking to some people today, I think that they believe that she has the fundamentals in place.


PERINO: All the leg -- like, all the blocks, bricks and mortar that you need for a campaign.

GUILFOYLE: Get out the vote, ground.

PERINO: Yes. She -- she could blow it.


PERINO: And I -- the thing about him saying that he would be personally insulted, so I'm not personally persuaded by that. Obviously, I'm not the audience. But if you listen to the audience, they went nuts; and they cheered, and they loved it. So when he's talking about sexism, he is -- he is very good at targeting the audience that he's talking to. So that goes to one group.

And this point about, as the first African-American president, if she doesn't win, he'll take it as a personal insult, that works with another group. It's not going to work with me necessarily.


KILMEADE: He's addressing the Congressional Black Caucus. They were cheering from the moment he walked in. He said, "If you don't vote for me [SIC], essentially, you're -- you are essentially saying this" -- Trump is a repudiation of everything that he has done for the last eight years. Exactly. People do not like what he did the last eight years.

PERINO: Correct. Obamacare.

KILMEADE: Obamacare; friends with Cuba; the Iranian deal, the worst ever; the lack of action on Syria; pulling out all the troops in Iraq. Why can't somebody be a repudiation of what you were? Like, for example, you reportedly were a repudiation of what George Bush was. Why was that OK?

GUTFELD: That's true. It's a pendulum.

WILLIAMS: You know, I love your fantasy. I really -- I just...

KILMEADE: What did I say that wasn't logical?

WILLIAMS: Oh, I'll tell you what.


WILLIAMS: The American people right now, one poll had Obama rated 58 percent positive. Oh, my gosh. That's stunning for an age of polarization, where nobody agrees on everything.

PERINO: Highest ever.

WILLIAMS: That's unbelievable. Fifty-eight percent.

GUTFELD: But Juan...

WILLIAMS: Let me say...

GUTFELD: Would you like...

WILLIAMS: Michelle Obama. Michelle Obama at 64 percent.

GUTFELD: You just proved -- you just proved my point. Michelle Obama isn't the president. Is it possible that people can like somebody and still think they're a bad president?

WILLIAMS: It's possible. But I'm telling you right now...

GUILFOYLE: And you can also compare them to what else you're seeing.

WILLIAMS: ... what we know about the American public is they're not dumb. They're looking at things like the stock market. They're looking unemployment. They're looking at their personal finances.

KILMEADE: So why is Trump resonating? Why is he in a flat-footed tie, and she's running his entire agenda?

GUILFOYLE: Americans feel that the country is going in the wrong direction, despite they might have, you know, personal politics where they like President Obama. He is likable. He's a great public speaker.

He's fired up, because it is his legacy at stake. He does not want her to trip on the curb come election day. He wants her to deliver the White House so that he can keep intact his legacy and not have Trump repudiate it, as we said. I think that's -- that's what this is about.

WILLIAMS: A lot of people right now, just to answer your question...

GUILFOYLE: He fires up about himself and climate change.

GUTFELD: Juan...

WILLIAMS: A lot of people, I think, respond to what President Obama said at the U.N. today. That...


WILLIAMS: Yes. What he said was "You know what? There are a lot of people who are angry over globalization, who feel threatened by it, especially people who think the trade is bad for their employment prospects. And those people are the ones who are creating nationalist parties in Europe. They voted for Brexit in London."

KILMEADE: Are they bad people?


KILMEADE: Are they wrong?


KILMEADE: The people that don't agree with them is wrong?

WILLIAMS: Trade -- no, I'm just telling you, there's a report out even today about how limits on trade would hurt the American economy and cause us to lose jobs.

GUTFELD: I just want to -- I've got to move on here, because they're talking to me. But I'm glad you brought up Brexit, because this is exactly what President Obama did. He criticized the Brits, saying, "If you do Brexit, you're at the end of the line."

GUILFOYLE: And what happened?

GUTFELD: He just -- he just -- and what happened. And so now he's doing the same thing, except he's saying, "You know, they're a bunch of sexists." It's egregious to me that he -- he calls Americans sexist. He never goes after Islamism for their misogyny. Does he?

GUILFOYLE: No. He's only fired up about climate change and Hillary blowing it. Like, there you go.

WILLIAMS: That was a fair point.

GUTFELD: Thank you, Juan.

KILMEADE: And that Donald Trump is unqualified and unfit for the office. If they said about that [SIC] a 48-year-old, one-term senator. there would be outrage from sea to shining sea.

WILLIAMS: Oh, they did say it.


GUTFELD: We did.

WILLIAMS: I think Hillary Clinton.

GUTFELD: I think I said it. All right.

GUILFOYLE: Please stand when you say that.

GUTFELD: A few details on what to expect at Trump and Clinton's first debate, coming up this Monday. Stay tuned.


PERINO: One of the most highly-anticipated debates in U.S. history is just six days away. Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump will square off for the first time on Monday at New York's Hofstra University. We're going to be there. NBC's Lester Holt will moderate.

We now know what the general topics will be: America's direction, achieving prosperity, and securing America. So basically, that's everything. What we don't know is how it's all going to play out.


JIMMY FALLON, HOST, NBC'S "THE TONIGHT SHOW WITH JIMMY FALLON": Which Trump are you going to get? Do you have any idea what -- because he seems to be changing a bit.

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Well, look, he's trying to somehow convince people to forget everything he's said and done. You know, and I don't think that he's going to get away with that.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: If she treats me with respect, I will treat her with respect. It really depends. People ask me that question: "Oh, you're going to go out there and do this and that?" I really don't know that. You're going to have to feel it out when you're out there. But she's got to treat me with respect. I'm going to treat her with respect.


PERINO: So I've got an interesting way to watch the debates. It's not going to happen this time, because I'm actually going to be there. I can't do this. But in 2012, you know how I watched them? I had TV on, but I had it on mute; and then I followed it on Twitter. But I would watch. And watching the visual cues. You know when you're doing television, they say watch it with the sound off to see if you're persuasive? So can he appear presidential? Can she appear likable, even if you're just passing by through the living room? What do you think of that theory?

GUILFOYLE: Yes. No, I think it is true. Because it's part of being the message. It's part of communicating, verbal; nonverbal.

And then also I thought was interesting in terms of what he said, that it sounds like, if she feels she insults him, that he's going to bite back. But, like, that he wouldn't draw -- so...

PERINO: But what's the insult tolerance level at this stage of the game? The first debate. They have three to go -- three total.

GUTFELD: I don't want to overplay this debate, but this is the most dramatic -- most dramatic conflict since Cain and Abel. Since Cain and Abel.

KILMEADE: Don't overplay it, yes. It's a draw.

GUTFELD: You know what I love about this?

GUILFOYLE: You're understating it.

GUTFELD: No, you know what I love about this? Let me finish. OK. It's against "Monday Night Football," which is on ESPN. Right? So this is a first: a presidential debate that may be less political than football. There will be more controversy in football.

By the way, she's got to do -- she's got to appear pretty strong, because he's fading faster than a Labor Day suntan. And she doesn't have an -- she doesn't have an enthusiasm gap. She has an enthusiasm canyon. For Democrats, voting for her is like flossing. They don't like it.

KILMEADE: The only person prepared for this debate adequately is Dana Perino. And you know why? Because Dana, you know what it's like to work a panel, and after Sunday, you know what it's like to work a one-on-one show.

And Donald Trump only knows what it's like to work a panel when he's got a full stage of people, or maybe three others. He does not know what it's like to be one on one and go right back and forth, back and forth, back and forth.

And Lester Holt isn't a very verbose person, so therefore, there's really going to be a lot of exchanges. And that's why I say, if you can handle Stirewalt and handle these four other people, you're the only one prepared for what is actually going to happen at Hofstra.

PERINO: Well, that's...

GUILFOYLE: Good thing you'll be there.


WILLIAMS: Imagine the stuff I said. "Hey Dana, what about your husband? What about..."

PERINO: Peter?

WILLIAMS: No, I'm pretending that you're Hillary Clinton.

PERINO: Oh, I knew what you meant.


PERINO: I got it.

KILMEADE: "You mean whose legacy I have to totally give up and deny and repudiate? Because I've chosen Barack Obama over my husband?"

WILLIAMS: OK, second, how about this. And Dana, what's this about your health? How come you haven't you been on the campaign trail lately? You need rest, Dana?

PERINO: So that -- it will be interesting to see.

Let's speak about Lester Holt. What do you think his -- is going through his mind?

GUILFOYLE: What a nice man.

WILLIAMS: I think, obviously, Matt Lauer is going through his mind.

PERINO: Right.

WILLIAMS: So -- but this is what Trump -- Trump is just so -- you know, at the whole thing about "The system is rigged, and they don't like me and the media is set against me."


WILLIAMS: So I think he puts -- he puts Lester Holt on the...

PERINO: And he said he was a registered -- he tried to say he was a registered Democrat. Then it came out that he's actually a Republican. Who knows? I think he'll be professional.

GUILFOYLE: Lester Holt's a very nice man. He's very professional. I like him a lot. Don't you? Remember, he was on our same hotel.

KILMEADE: And he can play a musical instrument. I've seen him in a band.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. I think he plays. He plays.

KILMEADE: He does.

GUTFELD: Well, that certainly makes him qualified.

KILMEADE: Six 15-minute segments. I do think it's going to be fascinating. I do think her health is going to come up. In fact, today she took the day off, evidently, from public? And he went after her for that.

PERINO: That's all right.

WILLIAMS: That's what I'm saying. Yes.

PERINO: She was doing debate prep.

WILLIAMS: Here's the thing. From the other perspective, from the Democrats' perspective, what if Trump just says, "You know, I'm standing here. I'm here. I look presidential. I'm moderate. I'm reasonable."

KILMEADE: Good. That's what he needs to do.


KILMEADE: If he blows a nuclear triad question, I don't think it's that big of a deal. It's how he holds himself. That's why they want him to explode. That's why they're reviewing all the tapes, Hillary personally, to find his hot button to get him to explode. Then it's game over.

PERINO: It gives me anxiety just thinking about preparing for a debate. I wouldn't want to be that person, either of them, because it's a lot to get ready for.

We have got a Brangelina alert for you. This is a first on "The Five." Big breaking news on Hollywood's most famous couple, ahead.


KILMEADE: All right. They were the most famous couple on the planet since Adam and Eve. Yes, were. If you have not heard, you might want to sit down. If you're like us, you're sitting already.

Brad and Angelina are divorcing; it's true. Jolie filed the paperwork on Monday, citing irreconcilable differences, and she expanded from there. Her attorney says she made the decision for the health of her family. She's seeking physical custody of their six kids.

Pitt gave a statement and said something like this: "I'm very saddened by this, but what matters most is the wellbeing of our kids. I kindly ask the press to give them the space they deserve during the challenging time."

And we do feel bad for the kids, but in terms of the couple, the most famous couple on the planet, this is rumored for a while. The fact that it is rumored, does it soften the blow for you, Greg?

GUTFELD: No, I'm emotionally devastated by this. Remember, Brad and Angelina claimed that they weren't going to get married until gays could marry. So now that they're getting divorced, I believe we must end gay marriage.

KILMEADE: Wait a second!

GUTFELD: Just cancel the whole thing. No.

This is a huge story on Twitter. It's amazing how many millions of people are more concerned about this than terror.


GUTFELD: That disturbs me. People find pleasure in the misfortunes of the fortunate.

KILMEADE: She evidently -- they're saying that the word is that he smoked too much pot, drank too much and gets kind of angry. Juan?

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God.

WILLIAMS: That's the word.

GUTFELD: You just described everybody at this table.


WILLIAMS: You know what -- you know what fascinates me about this story is the idea that he was cheating on her with an actress named...

GUTFELD: Maria Cotillard. Cotillard.

WILLIAMS: But I never heard of her.

KILMEADE: Who he starred in "World War II" with.


KILMEADE: He starred -- he starred with her in "World War II." That's the problem...

GUILFOYLE: TMZ said that's not true.

KILMEADE: That's the problem with being forced to make -- make out with someone to make a living. He had to make out with her.


KILMEADE: How do you do that and not suddenly feel as though the emotions are real?

GUTFELD: That's why I don't...

KILMEADE: They yell cut, do you cut?

GUTFELD: It's why I don't do Lou Dobbs' show anymore.

PERINO: It gets part of you.


KILMEADE: And as soon as he gets cable, he's going to yell at you. Dana.

PERINO: When she says that he got -- he would get angry, I think that's actually most women's complaint about husbands if they're -- the one thing that really bothers them the most is that the husband is an angry guy. That really bothers you.

KILMEADE: Really, more than anything else?

PERINO: Yes. My husband is not an angry guy.

KILMEADE: He is. He's happy, because he's married to you.

PERINO: he is jolly and British, but...

GUILFOYLE: And he sings, and he tells really good jokes.

PERINO: I don't like angry.

GUILFOYLE: Good company. Good dinner talk.

KILMEADE: Kimberly, do you like an angry?


KILMEADE: Do you like angry?


GUILFOYLE: No. What did Dana just tell you?

KILMEADE: Here's what -- here's what worries me the most.


KILMEADE: According to his friend, he's in the throes of some insane middle-life crisis. Ladies and gentlemen, if Brad Pitt is the most famous guy in the world with the most beautiful woman in the world with a wonderful family, and he's having a midlife crisis, we're all in trouble.

PERINO: I know what the answer is.



KILMEADE: Wear a vest.

GUTFELD: Nothing else. Nothing else. No shirt, just a vest.

KILMEADE: I think they're going to -- I think they're going to both land on their feet. Angelina Jolie, a great humanitarian. Much like you, Juan.

WILLIAMS: Well, I don't -- I mean, gosh, he's very handsome and very rich. I'm sure he'll do well.

And Angelina Jolie, I think she's a gorgeous woman.

But I must say, I thought Brad Pitt deserved a lot of kudos for the way he handled the double mastectomy. I think she said that he was extremely supportive. She never had to doubt her beauty or her love -- or his love during that time. And I always think, man, that's an example.

GUILFOYLE: Well, she was very brave. She did that because of the BRCA analysis.

KILMEADE: That is a great way to end it, sort of upbeat. And let's just hope this doesn't become a big public spectacle because Dana will be...


GUILFOYLE: And we pray for the children, and they were together for a long time.


GUILFOYLE: You know, they waited ten years before they got married. Anyway, it's sad. I hope they co-parent together and work out the differences.

KILMEADE: A river runs through it now. Now a huge gap.

GUTFELD: Who gets -- who gets the pot plants?

KILMEADE: I think it's his, and that's the problem.

GUTFELD: But she gets to visit?

KILMEADE: "One More Thing," and it will include this couple, next.


WILLIAMS: Welcome back. It's time now for "One More Thing." I'm going to go first, because I know a lot of people who are undecided about who they're going to vote for in November. Well, as a public service, "The Five" and Wall Street Journal have put together some options for you other than Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump.

How about God? That's right. God. God is apparently from Staten Island, New York, and has registered with the Federal Election Commission to run in this year's presidential race.


WILLIAMS: Also wanting to get on the ballot, according to the FEC, Darth Vader. That's right.

And finally, my favorite outsider trying to run is one of my childhood heroes.

KILMEADE: Cap'n Crunch.

WILLIAMS: Cap'n Crunch. However, it's unclear whether the captain and any of these other candidates will pass the FEC's vetting process.

GUILFOYLE: You're going to vote for Darth Vader, right, because you love "Star Wars"?

WILLIAMS: No, no. I like Cap'n Crunch.

KILMEADE: Because you like a military man.


PERINO: OK. Well, I got a kick out of this little story out of Australia. So this family is worried that their daughter is missing, OK, so they send out -- they call the police and say, "Our daughter is missing."

So the police, in order to try to find her, put something on her Facebook page. And just a couple minutes later she replies. She goes, "I'm in my room."

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God.

PERINO: Like, this is an overreaction. And the police then had to say, "Well, we actually have to see you now, because it's been reported. You have to call us or you have to" -- so it was just a family misunderstanding, but this is how things happen in the real world.

KILMEADE: No Amber Alert needed.

GUTFELD: Do all the members of the family have weird faces?

KILMEADE: Yes. They'd have to.

PERINO: We were being respectful in blurring the face of the child, because she's 17. She's just in her room, though.

WILLIAMS: I wouldn't want -- I wouldn't...

PERINO: Can you imagine, Kimberly, I'm in my room.

WILLIAMS: All right. Gregory, it's your turn.

GUTFELD: I've got an article at It's my latest take on the terror attacks from over the weekend. I urge you to read it.

Now for this.


GUTFELD: Greg's Birthday News.


GUTFELD: Very excited. Mitch McConnell, Mitch McConnell turned 50. I think we have some pictures of him getting a watermelon cake.





GUTFELD: Amazing how tasty that is.

KILMEADE: That is not right. Oh, my goodness.

GUTFELD: Actually, actually, I'm joking.

KILMEADE: He's the majority leader!

GUTFELD: I'm joking. We love Mitch McConnell. It's actually Cerro the tortoise from Perth -- he's at the Perth Galapagos Zoo. I'm sorry, the Perth Zoo. It's a Galapagos tortoise, as I mutilate this. Fifty years old.

GUILFOYLE: I thought you were going to say Bill O'Reilly.

GUTFELD: No, I wasn't going to say Bill O'Reilly.

KILMEADE: Why don't turtles ever...

GUILFOYLE: You changed your mind. Yes -- Dana.

GUTFELD: Turtles have the best life ever. They've got their own home.

WILLIAMS: The brilliant Ms. Guilfoyle.

GUILFOYLE: Thank you so much.

So this is a really interesting story. When Chris Jones was 5 years of age, he almost died by drowning at a hotel swimming pool in Columbus, Ohio. So thanks to the actions of this officer here, James Poole -- interesting play on words...


GUILFOYLE: ... he lived. Last Friday, about 19 years later, 24-year-old Jones finally got the chance to thank Officer Poole for saving his life. Take a look at this.


CHRIS JONES, SAVED FROM DROWNING BY POLICE OFFICER: Remember me? From 1997. A 5-year-old in a swimming pool. Saved my life.


JONES: Because of you, I'm still here. Because of you, this 5-year-old little girl is right here.


GUILFOYLE: And then he -- isn't that so sweet? And then Jones introduced him...

PERINO: You always...


PERINO: ... "One More Thing."

GUILFOYLE: ... to his daughter.

WILLIAMS: Brian, your turn.

KILMEADE: Last night, "Kevin Can Wait" went on CBS, and why I really think Kevin James is my true idol is he as Kevin, retired cop from my Massapequa, my hometown that I still live in today. Look at that: Massapequa everywhere. Massapequa on the shirt; Massapequa on the sweater. A retired cop from Massapequa, why was I not dealt into this? I could have been the expert, the guy on the set needed and leaned on to find out what authenticity in television is all about. It would have been my first sitcom ever. But I wasn't leaned on or looked at. Kevin James, put me on the show.

WILLIAMS: Oh, that's so nice.

GUILFOYLE: Why don't you invite him on "FOX & Friends"?

KILMEADE: I should put him on.

PERINO: I can't wait.

WILLIAMS: All right.

KILMEADE: He's King Kevin (ph).

GUILFOYLE: Could refund (ph) him.

WILLIAMS: Set your DVR so you never miss an episode of "The Five." That's it for us. "Special Report" next.

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