Chaffetz on Clinton investigation: Subpoenas not optional
Chairman of the House Oversight Committee reacts on 'The Kelly File' after IT specialist refuses to appear before Congress
This is a rush transcript from "The Kelly File," September 15, 2016. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
MEGYN KELLY, HOST: Breaking tonight, Hillary Clinton back on the campaign trail after a health scare sidelines the candidate and the political reporters are saying it could not come soon enough as a series of dramatic new polls show Donald Trump gaining traction across this country and in the states that matter.
Welcome to "The Kelly File," everyone. I'm Megyn Kelly. We are now just 54, 54 days away from a race that -- well, ending, that not long ago seemed to be Mrs. Clinton's for the taking.
But the last week has produced the kind of headlines that has some Democrats, for lack of a better term, how you say freaking out. NBC News tonight saying Clinton is back on the trail and not a moment too soon for Dems.
The Hill sent out an alert late today saying, "polls darken for Democrats" and even the liberal website, Vox, called this, "A brutal series of polls for Mrs. Clinton."
In just moments, Charles Krauthammer is here on what's happening with these numbers and why. Plus pollster, Larry Sabato, is here with what he sees as the real worry for the Democrats.
But first, Trace Gallagher, is in our west coast newsroom tonight with new data from the critical battleground states. Hey, Trace.
TRACE GALLAGHER, FOX NEWS: Hey, Megyn and breaking right now, Real Clear Politics has just moved Colorado from leans Clinton to a toss-up. That's significant because it means the Electoral College projections are continuing to get much tighter.
This week alone, Real Clear Politics has moved New Hampshire, Michigan and Colorado into the toss-up category. Back on August 15th, Hillary led in New Hampshire by eight, Michigan by seven and Colorado by eleven points.
Also concerning for the Clinton campaign is that in just in the past 48 hours, RCP has Trump taking the lead in the all-important battleground states of Florida and Ohio. Both are well within the margin of error, mind you.
But it's important to remember, the last time a candidate lost Ohio and won the presidency was 1960 and no president has lost Florida since 1992.
The simple math here is that over the past month, 72 Electoral College votes have moved from Hillary Clinton's column to the toss-up column. So as of today, the map has Clinton with 200 electoral votes and Donald Trump with 164.
Here's the concern for Trump. You need 270 to win. For Trump to hit the magic number, he would have to win the same 24 states that Mitt Romney won in 2012, which is certainly not a given, and he'd also have to win both Ohio and Florida.
If you plug in all of the Real Clear Politics averages of where the candidates stand at this very second, even with Hillary Clinton's current dip in the polls, the Electoral College projection map gives her 293 electoral votes to Trump's 195, but the needle is moving in the right direction.
KELLY: Trace, thank you.
Well, as you heard, Hillary Clinton still holds the edge on the electoral voting map, but all the momentum seems to be with Trump. My next guest says if Clinton doesn't want to lose this lead, she better come roaring back and in a big way.
Larry Sabato joins me now, the founder and director of the University of Virginia's Center for Politics. Larry, good to see you. So when you look at New Hampshire, Michigan, Colorado, all moving from lean Dem into a toss- up.
Not to mention Trump taking Florida and Ohio. It tells me that she suffered an electoral disaster over the past 30 days. Was it basket full of deplorables, the health? I mean, what was it?
LARRY SABATO, DIRECTOR, UNIVERSITY OF VA CENTER FOR POLITICS: Actually, I think the last week was the most damaging. Most of these new polls were conducted at the time when she had said basket of deplorables and then you had the liable omission about her health problem.
I think it was very damaging to her. The first part of the month was simply losing all of the convention bounce, which was expected. I mean, that was a big convention bounce she got. She wasn't going to keep it.
But she's deteriorated further because of the things she did last weekend. It's hurt her. I know the Clinton team doesn't believe in pushing panic buttons, but I think they ought to at least test it out.
Because if they continue to deteriorate and they are getting close to the 270 mark, they've got to be worried about that and they're going to --
KELLY: They're falling from being above 270 and she's fallen down below like dangerously close to it.
SABATO: Absolutely. Look, if they don't increase the enthusiasm among the base Democratic voters especially minorities and also young people who, by the way, are flaking off to the third-party candidates, not criticizing the third-party candidates, but they are coming in second.
KELLY: They do not care that Gary Johnson doesn't know what Aleppo is. They still are going for Gary Johnson with big numbers. I want to ask you about that because we see -- a Fox News poll came out today and we see this often now, the two-way race and four-way race.
The one between Clinton and Trump and the one with the two other candidates. And Clinton does better, according to our Fox News poll, if the other candidates are in. She does better if they are in.
She's got a one-point lead over Trump with the other candidates in. If you take the other two candidates out, Trump is beating her by one point. So what does that tell us?
SABATO: Well, Megyn, actually, most polls show exactly the opposite. I've become convinced that especially in the swing states, Gary Johnson, believe it or not, is hurting Clinton more than Trump. Why?
Because he's become a parking space for so many of those millennials who supported Obama but don't like Clinton. And, of course, Jill Stein mainly takes from Clinton. She takes almost nothing from Trump.
KELLY: Jill Stein who is going to make Madea Benjamin of Code Pink her secretary of state. I have to ask you this quickly. So when you look at the numbers and talk about the millennials, what rule could President Obama or Bernie Sanders play for Hillary because they are unleashing him in Ohio for her this week?
SABATO: Surrogates help but they alone cannot pull you across the finish line. Only Hillary Clinton can get across the finish line and she's got to show vigor. She's got to show endurance and stamina, not just on the campaign trail but in those debates coming up.
KELLY: She's got to fight for it. She took August off. She was just waiting and watching Trump hoping he would implode and he didn't. She's suffering. Larry, great to see you.
SABATO: Thanks, Megyn.
KELLY: Well, this poll surge is not only becoming a topic for the headline writers, it's also becoming an issue on the campaign trail with both candidates today talking about what's going on.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The polls are coming out. We're leading in so many polls, I can't tell you. I don't know where to begin, but that's a good feeling.
HILLARY CLINTON, D-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I've always said that this is going to be a tight race. I've said it from the very beginning, whether I was up, down, it didn't matter. Those are the kinds of presidential elections that we have in America at this point in our history.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Joining me now, Dr. Charles Krauthammer, syndicated columnist and a Fox News contributor. Charles, good to see you. Let me start with her comment there. Up, down. The thing is, she sort of downplays the huge lead she had over him just three weeks ago. I mean, it's not an understatement to say that many neutral, political pundits were saying he was done.
CHARLES KRAUTHAMMER, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Well, remember, he has that terrible several weeks right after the convention that were the worst of Donald Trump and then her campaign strategy, since she didn't really have a positive message, it's really hard to come up with an edge.
I don't think that she can come up with an answer. She gave a speech today where she said I've got 38 proposals on my web site. It's about the most wooden thing any candidate could say.
KELLY: Right, whoever goes there.
KRAUTHAMMER: What their strategy has been is to demonize. Trump, you've seen the ads, the new ad that came out just this week, showing a leading Republican politicians saying that Trump is unstable, et cetera.
So it was to make him very negative and unacceptable, beneath the threshold to be president. That's the strategy. But what happened was he ran into a very effective -- she ran into a very effective counterstrategy from his new team, Trump's new team which was warm and cuddly, kinder and gentler Donald Trump.
So it counteracted that image. There he was in a black church, there he was speaking about compassion for illegal immigrants with a foggy message and then you've got a few days ago this enormous new entitlement for child care.
Here's a guy who cares about African-Americans, cares are minorities, about immigrants, cares about mothers and women. So you run into that new Trump at the same time that she is escalated the rhetoric about the old, the bad, the bully Trump, talking about the basket of, you know --
KELLY: Deplorables.
KRAUTHAMMER: -- deplorables, who are irredeemable, anti-American extreme, and the two images are clashing and his strategy is working. Hers is not.
KELLY: It's interesting because I mean, Trump supporters have been with him from the beginning. But to those people who rejected him because they felt he was a bully or anti-Hispanic or anti-black or women or what have you, do you think they are actually starting to be persuaded that what they saw for all those months was not real?
KRAUTHAMMER: I'm as puzzled as you are by the phenomenon and I can tell by the tone of your question. I wasn't sure it could be done, but he has shown a lot of discipline. He has not gone off-script. Look, what was the worst of what happened in the bad time for him in the three weeks when he sank in the polls?
It was his insensitivity to the gold star parents, the idea that this guy has no empathy. The entire campaign for Trump for the last three weeks has been an empathy emphasis.
He cares about this. He cares about that. The tone, he's not shouting and all of that contributes to a makeover. Now, do I believe it? I don't know. Do other people believe it? It seems to be having some kind of an effect.
Maybe not that people are rallying to him, but those who are completely opposed to him perhaps are opening their minds and given the fire she's been under on the honesty issue, on the transparency issue, they may be looking at the race through a different lens.
KELLY: Let me ask you this as a psychiatrist. If I've been told that a child with two bad parents will try to idealize the least bad one, they need to have one, right?
So do you think this is a situation where the mom figure is really not being, let's say, straight with us about how long she has? And I don't mean to say she's dying.
I just mean her health has clearly been one of the many issues on which she has not been totally forthcoming and so it's like, OK, I have to choose one of these people and as she starts to look worse, he necessarily starts to look better.
KRAUTHAMMER: I would agree with that, but without the psychiatric context but I don't play one on TV. Look, I think it's rather simple. You've got two choices.
They are the two most unpopular candidates we have seen in our lifetime. It's mostly people who are voting to prevent the other from getting in. She has looked really bad with all of the new e-mail stuff, with all of the transparency issues.
I don't think health has anything to do with this at all and then he's been this new image and perhaps that is -- look, I think the one thing that is true, in an age of social media, the life expectancy of a memory, of a sound bite, of an image, is very small.
Sound bites are small, images are small, and there's no past, no memory. So I think it turns out there's a new persona with only two months to go. That's the question that this campaign hinges on.
KELLY: It's incredible to think about. It' good news for Anthony Weiner. Anyway, I've got to go. Great to see you. Go ahead, Charles.
KRAUTHAMMER: Some memories are ineradicable and that's one of them.
KELLY: It's great to see you.
KRAUTHAMMER: OK.
KELLY: Meantime, a defiant Donald Trump. Tonight, he went off script and back on the attack and in just moments we'll hear from his campaign and a top Hillary supporter on the new controversy catching fire.
Plus, new developments on the Clinton e-mail front after Congress sent a subpoena to the FBI. The powerful chairman of the House Oversight Committee, Jason Chaffetz is here on the next steps in his investigation.
And then, America's media took a stunning hit today. Howie Kurtz and Noah are next on how this issue is going to shape this election.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is it fair to just say the liberal media is out there trying to make a case against Donald Trump? The media was front and center of Sunday morning playing it over and over and over when Hillary Clinton tripped. She faces a double-standard every day right, left and center.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: Breaking tonight, The Washington Post just published a new interview with Donald Trump and gone was the toned down candidate we've seen in recent speeches.
First, Trump went after CNN's Anderson Cooper saying, quote, "I don't think Anderson Cooper should be a moderator because he works for CNN and over the last couple of days, I've seen how he behaves. He'll be biased. Very biased."
Then he issued a warning for Mrs. Clinton saying, quote, "If she treats me with respect, I'll treat her with respect. If she doesn't, I'll reciprocate."
And when asked if President Obama was born in the United States, he said I'll answer that question at the right time. I just don't want to answer it yet.
Trace Gallagher live in Los Angeles with more on how Mr. Trump may be turning up the volume -- Trace.
GALLAGHER: You know, many would argue, Megyn, that Trump's rapid fire incendiary comments throughout the primary helped him win the GOP nomination. Others like Charles Krauthammer say his recent surge in the polls is part and parcel of the new more disciplined, more restrained Donald Trump.
But in recent days, there are signs of the old Trump making cameo appearances. For example, on Sunday when Hillary Clinton collapsed at a 9/11 event, Trump initially gave her a get well wish, but last night, Trump took a shot at Clinton getting overheated. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I don't know, folks, do you think Hillary would be able to stand up here for an hour and do this? I don't think so.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GALLAGHER: Then there was the confrontation at a church in Flint, Michigan, where Pastor Faith Green Timmons interrupted Donald Trump for attacking Hillary Clinton. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Hillary failed on the economy, just like she's failed on foreign policy. Everything she touched, didn't work out. Nothing.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Trump, I invited you here to thank us and not give a political speech.
TRUMP: OK. That's good.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GALLAGHER: Trump responded on "Fox & Friends" by saying the pastor was nervous and shaking because she was planning on interrupting him the whole time. Hillary Clinton defended the pastor as a rock for her community.
When hacked e-mails of Colin Powell showed the former secretary of state called Trump a national disgrace, Trump shot right back on Twitter, quoting, "I was never a fan of Colin Powell after his weak understanding of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq equals disaster. We can do much better."
And when told that Senator Harry Reid said that Trump is not slim and trim, Trump said, "Reid should start working out again with his rubber workout pieces," a reference to the exercise band that Reid snapped last year causing him to fall and break his ribs and bones in his face -- Megyn.
KELLY: Thank you, Trace. Joining me now with reaction, Trump campaign national spokesperson, Katrina Pierson, and Clinton supporter and DNC Committee man from New York, Robert Zimmerman. Great to see you both.
Let's talk about where Trump is, Katrina, because he's been on the straight and narrow for a few weeks and his poll numbers are doing great. Why start in on Anderson Cooper who is a very solid journalist and who is not even on the air this week, he's out of town.
And why start threatening to go after Hillary and why for the love of God won't he say that Barack Obama was born in the United States?
KATRINA PIERSON, TRUMP 2106 NATIONAL SPOKESPERSON: Well, here we are 15 months later and still there are many in the media that expect Donald Trump to be some robotic politician and that's just not who he is.
He was asked to respond to Colin Powell's comments and he did. He's not going to let the media determine what he talks about and when and that's exactly what you're seeing. Mr. Trump is going to be Mr. Trump.
He will respond when he feels like it. And it's just really unfortunate that Mr. Trump simply wants to focus on his policy, which is something that everyone has been saying they want to hear and yet we hear these diversionary tactics by the Clinton campaign and the media which is CNN.
KELLY: But before I move on to Robert, what about the -- Barack Obama being born here? Because this is what his campaign manager and his chief surrogate, Rudy Giuliani, said about that issue because Trump had been pushing the birtherism thing saying Barack Obama wasn't born here. He wasn't born in Hawaii. This is what they said a couple of days ago. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KELLYANNE CONWAY, TRUMP CAMPAIGN MANAGER: He believes President Obama was born here. I was born in New Jersey. He was born in Hawaii.
RUDY GIULIANI, FORMER NEW YORK MAYOR: Donald Trump believes now that he was born in the United States, but that issue was raised originally --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When is he going to say that this president --
GIULIANI: I believe it, he believes it, we all believe it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He does? Are you --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: So why wouldn't he say it when asked tonight?
PIERSON: Well, simply because he doesn't talk about that anymore. First thing is Barack Obama is not on the ballot.
KELLY: That is not going to fly.
PIERSON: It is going to fly, Megan, because this is completely irrelevant to the election cycle.
KELLY: It's not completely irrelevant. You have a lot of people in this country, in particular, African-Americans, who feel that that position was a racist position meant to de-legitimatize the president. I'm taking no position on this.
I'm relaying to you what they've said. His own campaign manager came out and said that he has shifted his belief on this and now when asked directly he refuses to confirm that. Why?
PIERSON: And you also have a poll in South Carolina that shows that Mr. Trump is pushing 30 percent on African-American support and Hillary Clinton --
KELLY: That's a dodge.
PIERSON: No, it's not, Megyn. I'm telling you. Mr. Trump has said he is not going to talk about it. I've given you the answer. You want to know why?
KELLY: I just don't want to answer it yet. Robert, what do you think?
PIERSON: The media is not going to force Mr. Trump to say anything that he is not ready to say.
KELLY: The media didn't for him to come out and take a position being a birther, but he did.
PIERSON: That came out of Hillary Clinton's campaign in 2008.
KELLY: Given the chance to question her about it, we certain will, but right now we have you. Go ahead, Robert.
ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, CLINTON SUPPORTER: OK, let's be clear, it's not about asking Donald Trump to be robotic. It's about asking him to have honor and decency and show respect for the truth. And that's really what is at issue here.
KELLY: You support Hillary Clinton.
ZIMMERMAN: I beg your pardon?
KELLY: You're talking about respect for the truth and you're a Hillary Clinton supporter and the American people think that she's not truthful, to put it gently.
ZIMMERMAN: Megyn, you're dodging the issue. We're talking about the fact that Donald Trump will not discuss whether -- may I finish my point, please? We're talking about Trump and refusing to recognize that President Obama is an American citizen and that reflects -- despite what his supporters say. It's disgraceful, racist and dishonest.
For that manner, Pastor Timmons, like a typical bully and coward, he stood up and defended him when he was being heckled and when Pastor Timmons told him to respect the rule of what the church has asked him to do. He backed down and did what he was told.
PIERSON: He was very respectful.
ZIMMERMAN: And then when he left the church and was on Fox & Friends this morning, he lied about her. He called her a nervous mess, like a typical bully, when he was confronted, he backed down. When on his own, he went out there and tried to antagonize.
KELLY: Go ahead, Kat.
PIERSON: He made an observation. He felt like the woman was nervous. That's not an attack. That is not racist, George. You weren't there. How can you sit there and say that? You weren't there?
ZIMMERMAN: The media covered it.
KELLY: He said she was so nervous, this is on "Fox & Friends," she was a nervous mess and so I figured something was up, really.
PIERSON: How is that an attack and how is that racist?
ZIMMERMAN: I'll tell you why it's an attack because Pastor Timmons defended him at the church when he was heckled and in fact --
PIERSON: She couldn't be nervous?
ZIMMERMAN: And then when he left, like a typical bully, he started to malign her. But here is the bigger point, today, Donald Trump Jr. tried to minimize the holocaust, the unspeakable loss of six million lives by comparing it to a bad day on the campaign trail.
KELLY: I don't know about that, Robert.
PIERSON: George wants to divert from other things, like Hillary Clinton --
ZIMMERMAN: First of all, it's Robert. Secondly, we're talking about --
PIERSON: We're talking about, George, you brought up Donald Trump Jr. so I want to address that. He talked about the gas chamber because it's a form capital punishment right here in the United States as recently as 2010 --
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: Can I jump in? You lost the audience now. They don't know what you're talking about and that's my job to make sure they do. Donald Trump Jr. tonight said that -- he defended his comment saying that they would be warming up the gas chamber if Trump had said -- I'm trying to find the original comment. In any event, he made some comment about, if my dad did that, they would be warming up the gas chamber for him.
ZIMMERMAN: That's right.
KELLY: And then you have the anti-defamation -- he acted like Clinton, he would be getting the gas chamber. The Anti-Defamation League said that's inappropriate. You don't make references to the holocaust. He said it was actually a reference to capital punishment.
We are going to leave at that. He's tried to clarify it. Great debate. Great to see you both.
I do workout. I don't have time. My job, my kids. That's really all I do, but I do workout.
New drama with the Hillary Clinton e-mail scandal as the powerful chairman of the House Oversight Committee, Jason Chaffetz sends a subpoena to the FBI and is now threatening the guy who set up Hillary Clinton's server. Showdown at the House and Jason Chaffetz is here to explain, live.
Plus, the American media took a huge hit today. We'll show you what it means for the 2016 race when Howie Kurtz and Noah (inaudible) join us next.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I have really good news for you. I just heard that the press is stuck on their airplane. They can't get here. I love it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: Fifty-four days to go and Americans trust in the media has never been lower. Today, les than one in three Americans say they have some trust in mass media, but it's conservatives driving the drop with more than half of Democrats but only one in ten Republicans, well, about that, expressing trust. And who's proud of the plummet? The Republican nominee, Donald Trump. Listen.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
TRUMP: I had a lot to do with that poll. I think I had a lot to do because I've exposed the media. I really am -- I'm very proud to say that I think I had a lot to do with that poll number.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
KELLY: Moments ago in New Hampshire, Trump again showing not a ton of regard for the media starting in events before they arrived, watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I have really good news for you. I just heard that the press is stuck on their airplane and they can't get here. I love it. So they're trying to get here now. They're going to be about 30 minutes late. They called us and said could you wait and I said absolutely not. Let's get going. Let's get going, New Hampshire.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Joining me now, two journalists who have doggedly followed the median in this election cycle, Howie Kurtz, host of "Media Buzz" right here on Fox and Noah Rothman, assistant online editor of Commentary Magazine, great to see you both. So, you know, the problem is, without the press, we don't get to see him. He doesn't get as much coverage. They are not there to hear what he has to say and he can't get his word out as much, which he does like to do, but it's always fun to beat up on the media. Howie, what did you glean from these results?
HOWARD KURTZ, "MEDIABUZZ" HOST: You know, I talked to Donald Trump tonight an interview for Sunday's "Media Buzz" about this very point and as he portrays it, the media has been so relentlessly dishonest toward him, in his view, that he's had no choice but to push back. And in effect, he thinks it's his credibility or the media's credibility at the same time, Megyn, in this incredibly polarized campaign.
Hillary Clinton is sending out fundraising letters saying there's media bias against her so, no wonder this is part of the reason that public confidence is dropping. We're getting it from both sides.
KELLY: Noah, do we know why faith in the media has dropped among conservatives? I realized Trump think it's because he has criticized the media relentlessly, but there are also a lot of conservatives who feel that the media fell down on the job in vetting Trump.
NOAH ROTHMAN, COMMENTARY MAGAZINE ASSISTANT ONLINE EDITOR: Yeah, precisely, that has a lot to do with it. That number bottomed out among Republicans. Last year it was in the 30s, somewhere in the low 30s. This is just -- very few Republicans have any faith in the press and it has a lot to do with, A, Donald Trump saying that media people are horrible by their own terms and in press rallies but also per Republicans who didn't vote for Donald Trump who think that he got a lot of unfiltered coverage that he did not deserve, that resulted in the prominent position he had in the primaries.
So, yeah, on both sides of that aisle, from among Republicans, there is no faith in the press.
KELLY: So how is this, I mean, Howie, you look at -- it's the lowest point in 44 years, or in Gallup's polling history, the faith in the media. And so how does that play into this election?
KURTZ: Well, first of all, I have to say, if you look at those numbers, the media were a stock. I mean, you'd have to sell it. That's how bad those numbers are. And it's a result over the years of self-inflicted wounds, bias, blunders, sensationalism, superficiality, so a lot of it is on us. It plays into the campaign because when we try to fact check the candidates, people don't believe us. When we try to report o the candidates, people think they are not getting the straight scoop from us.
And so, also I have to say, although we should take most of the blame, our profession, there are a lot of partisan folks out there who don't really have any interest in journalistic (inaudible). They want us to either back their candidate or trash the other candidate or both, and so it's hard to please everybody when it's such a high bipartisan environment.
KELLY: But then you have people like this woman over on MSNBC, Noah, who thinks that -- can we please play that thought? That it was bias for the media to show her falling down. We don't have it. We played it in the tease. She was like -- how did she put it, Hillary's --- she stumbled and the media kept playing it over and over. It was like the woman passed out. She did not appear conscious. She's supposed to be commander-in-chief. What were we supposed to do? Ignore it?
ROTHMAN: And that's what's really absurd about the whole situation. She shunned the press. She kept the media cameras away. Her pool was kept in an enclosed space so they couldn't cover her. That video was surreptitiously filmed. If you had press pool on her, you might have had something that was a little more explanatory.
They would have had to come up with something that made sense. Instead it was heat stroke, then pneumonia, then chronic dehydration and then sort of a flu and back to pneumonia. This is all of the simulation because they kept the press at arm's length. They have nobody else to blame but themselves for the situation.
KELLY: No, and for keeping us in the dark and giving us different stories, of course we wondered and of course we're going to cover that. I mean, the woman wants to be president. We didn't know whether she's all right. Good to see you both.
KURTZ: Good to see you Megyn.
KELLY: And do we know that? They say we do. Also tonight, Donald Trump goes on Jimmy Fallon's show and what happens next may win him a lot of new fans. We'll show you.
Plus, the powerful chairman of the House Oversight Committee Jason Chaffetz is here next and what he expects after he did this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. JASON CHAFFETZ, R-UTAH: I've signed this subpoena. We want all the 302's and we would like the full file. You can accept service on behalf of the FBI?
JASON HERRING, ACTING ASSISTAN FBI DIRECTOR: Certainly.
CHAFFETZ: You are hereby served.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHAFFETZ: Will the FBI provide the Congress the full file with no redaction of personal identifiable information?
HERRING: I cannot make that commitment sitting here today.
CHAFFETZ: Them I'm going to issue a subpoena and I'm going to do it right now. So let's go. I've signed this subpoena. We want all of the 302's and we would like the full file. You can accept service on behalf of the FBI?
HERRING: Certainly.
CHAFFETZ: You are hereby served.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: That was the chairman of the House Oversight Committee serving a subpoena to the FBI in dramatic fashion on Monday, as Congress looks into how the feds handled Mrs. Clinton's e-mail investigations and whether they have been forthcoming with congressional investigators looking into it. But the story did not end there. Joining us now live tonight, Republican congressman Jason Chaffetz, chairman of the Oversight Committee, great to see you, sir. Thank you for being here.
CHAFFETZ: Thanks for having me.
KELLY: So that was an attempt to get the FBI to give you an unvarnished look at the interview and the notes and who they talked to. But today you had a beef with this guy, Brian Pagliano, who set it up the private server in Mrs. Clinton's New York residence, who you served a subpoena to come testify in front of you and he blew you off?
CHAFFETZ: We sent him a second subpoena also to provide us the document that he supposedly got from the FBI that gave him immunity. He also blew that off. And you know what, subpoenas are not optional in this country. You have to comply with them.
KELLY: Why wouldn't he want to appear before you?
CHAFFETZ: I don't know. That's why you give people an opportunity. We can investigate anything at any time. It's how we do the checks and balances in this country. It's why we have this subpoena power to compel people to come before Congress. Sometimes they talk, sometimes they plead the fifth but you got to provide that opportunity and I expect them to show up.
KELLY: Now they say the Democrats on the committee say you are trying to harass him. You're trying to humiliate him, that's what his lawyer said too, that this is only a political show and you're trying to drag this guy before you who has already asserted that he wants to exercise his Fifth Amendment rights.
CHAFFETZ: No, we have a constitutional duty to also provide oversight at the executive branch. This is one of the largest security breaches in the history of the United States State Department. Classified information that could get people killed. Of course we're going to talk to the very person who essentially pulled the trigger and used the BleacBit and tried to destroy documents that were under subpoena. Of course we've got questions for him.
KELLY: Julie Roginsky is here now and I want to get to her in one second. Hi, Julie.
JULIE ROGINSKY, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Hi.
KELLY: She's with us, Fox News contributor and Democratic analyst. Yes, go ahead. Say it loud, say it proud.
ROGINSKY: Thank you. Wow, what a welcome.
KELLY: But before we get to you, I want to ask you whether this is going anywhere, right, because this is -- what is it all going to amount to? Because you're trying to talk to the people who set up the server and you're trying to talk to the FBI but the FBI has already issued its ruling. She's not going to be indicted.
CHAFFETZ: But people that when Director Comey came before the oversight committee, he also said he looked at nothing that Hillary said under oath and also look at all of the things that Congress has asked for that haven't been provided.
KELLY: So he was looking into whether she lied to you but you are looking into that.
CHAFFETZ: Yes.
KELLY: Julie, what say you?
ROGINSKY: Well, I say, look, I understand you're exercising both your right as a congressman and your right as a partisan politician to make hay out of a political issue, but you know he's going to invoke his Fifth Amendment rights so, the whole purpose of this theater (ph) is to drag him up to the hill -- we've seen it done by both parties, it's not just limited to what you're doing -- drag him up to the hill, make him invoke his Fifth Amendment rights, once again, say somebody under Hillary Clinton's auspices (ph), invoked their Fifth Amendment rights, and you get applauded by the conservative base and we all go on with our lives and that's what this is about.
I mean, look, I'm not a lawyer but it's very obvious to me that this person is not going to testify. You know it. Your fellow members of the oversight committee know it, and yet you're asking him to do this purely for the political theater. The political consultant in me applauds you, but the person who pays taxes in this country says why are you wasting tax payer money on an outcome that you know is going to end up being where it's going to be.
CHAFFETZ: You don't actually know if they are going to do that until they actually get there. I want to hear it from him himself. He's also has immunity so, I want to look at that document. It begs the question why...
KELLY: Does he have immunity from all committees in all circumstances?
CHAFFETZ: That's what I'm going to ask him. I mean, that's probably what we need to ask these witnesses. You can't just say, well, nobody is going to want to talk to us because it's going to be inconvenient and just let it go. If you get into that game of just saying, hey, you can just blow off the Congress, you don't need to show up, nobody is going to show up.
KELLY: OK, before we go, is this hurting her because her numbers are falling and as the e-mail scandal that we hear about day after day?
ROGINSKY: Her numbers are falling not necessarily because of this. Her numbers are falling over the last several days and you know why. She had this horrible health incident. She's been off the trail and Trump has had the field t himself. Let see what happens after next Monday's debate and where those numbers are. But I will say to this congressman, if you heard from his lawyer tomorrow that he's going to invoke his Fifth Amendment Rights, would you still beg him to testify? Would you still insist that he testify?
CHAFFETZ: He needs to come and testify.
KELLY: We'll have to leave it at that. Good to see you both. Up next, Donald Trump on Jimmy Fallon and we have a clip.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: New questions tonight as Hillary Clinton returns to the campaign trail, days after a health scare at the 9/11 memorial service on Sunday. A video showed Mrs. Clinton leaving the event early and appearing to collapse as she was getting into a van. Hours later, she emerged from daughter Chelsea Clinton's apartment looking like much better.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How are you feeling, Secretary Clinton?
CLINTON: Great. Great.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you talk to us for just a second? Give us a little statement?
CLINTON: It's a beautiful day in New York.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Now, some are pointing to pictures of Hillary leaving the event and then hours later leaving Chelsea's apartment saying that woman on the right was not Hillary Clinton at all. It was a body double. Brian Kilmeade is co-host of "Fox & Friends" and author of "Thomas Jefferson and the Tripoli Pirates." I could not believe how much circulation this actually got.
BRIAN KILMEADE, "FOX & FRIENDS" CO-HOST: It's unbelievable, and you know what, just to back everybody, you have me do it. So let's go to (inaudible) which we just saw a moment ago where the circles he used to be around football plays and quarterbacks. Now, it's around buttons and suits -- pantsuits. He is there saying are the conspiracy theorist, that this one woman has a different body composition.
One is slimmer than the other. They're saying one has more wrinkled skin than the other, one has higher cheekbones than the other and if there's one shot with her standing and her feet are kind of out, kind of like Ronald McDonald...
KELLY: Pointed out.
KILMEADE: ...and they say that Hillary Clinton never stands like that. The best theory is, there's no Secret Service. Secret service, as we know, cannot guard body doubles. So Secret Service are not allowed to do that. That makes sense. The child runs up and says hello while (inaudible) has to run up.
KELLY: Except it doesn't make any sense whatsoever because it's absurd because that's clearly the same person who has the same stomach and the same skin and the same everything.
KILMEADE: This is why you would not star in "Murder She Wrote" because you would have blown the whole plot in the first seven minutes and you have 25 minutes to film. I agree with you, however, this did not go away. If you see the comments underneath these stories, they build on it in a way I couldn't think of.
KELLY: I can feel the Twitter lighting up right now telling us that we are wrong and you know, you know what us, because we're not buying into this.
KILMEADE: I'm going to answer this real quick, Scott Baio is the MVP. He put it and tweeted out, "Does anyone know the new Hillary Clinton impersonator that looks like her body double? Where is she?" Another person in (inaudible) goes, "I'm in Los Angeles." So, Scott Baio blew the lid on this, now go find Joanie and our life will be complete.
KELLY: She loves Chachi. In the wake of the Hillary Clinton health scare madness, this happened at a local station and we didn't want you to miss it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We begin with breaking news about Hillary Clinton's death. Hillary Clinton's doctor has just revealed the presidential candidate has been diagnosed with pneumonia.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Oh, it's bad. Live TV, you say stupid stuff.
KILMEADE: Right, not me, but others.
(CROSSTALK)
KILMEADE: No, listen, Joe Torres I watch him every day and everybody in New York knows WABC is usually the number one station. Remember Roger Grimsby and Bill Beutel. You grew up watching them. Joe Torres said that -- he should have used the word health and Megyn the amazing thing is...
KELLY: Not dead, she's alive.
KILMEADE: If you said that, James would stop you and say something and you'd never be in...
KELLY: And fix that.
KILMEADE: You said they'll fix that. He went the whole show, nobody fixed it until the end they said he misspoke, but you know what he meant.
KELLY: He clearly did misspeak. I mean, you have to laugh a little because as a news anchor, you know, you do say stupid stuff. You're my witness.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.
KELLY: And it's embarrassing and then you have to correct it.
KILMEADE: Again, I don't.
KELLY: OK, well, just to make it right. Now, something happened tonight on the "Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon" involving Donald Trump, and watch what it is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JIMMY FALLON, HOST, "THE TONIGHT SHOW": Can I mess your hair up?
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: The answer is yes but the people in New Hampshire where I'm going to be in an hour from now, I hope they are going to understand.
FALLON: You said yes.
TRUMP: Go ahead.
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
FALLON: Yes! Donald Trump everybody.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Good for him.
KILMEADE: Another reason why Jimmy Fallon is great and another reason why they say Donald Trump does have a sense of humor and humility about him. Am I right?
KELLY: Absolutely right, and I would say that Jimmy Fallon is great and also he copied me.
KILMEADE: What do you mean?
KELLY: Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Come here. It's not that combed (ph). I actually comb it back.
KELLY: Oh, I see. That's not receding hairline there.
TRUMP: I know it's not there. It's a tiny, tiny bit of receding.
KELLY: It looks good.
TRUMP: I am getting a little bit older. It's not that bad. You're a little surprised.
KELLY: I am.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: That's from 2011. Trump has a great sense of humor and he has the ability to be self-deprecating and if he can show more of that, he may be contrasted starkly to his opponent.
KILMEADE: Who has yet to show it, but maybe that's the October surprise, the sense of humor.
KELLY: That's the thing because behind closed doors, they say she is funny.
KILMEADE: How surprised would you be -- have you heard her behind closed doors?
KELLY: Yes, absolutely.
KILMEADE: How many doors are there? They get smart doors of nine layers you walk through all the way through with biosphere (ph)? I have not seen that.
KELLY: If he can bring that, I mean, not like the hair to the presidential debate, but if he can bring a sense of humor and find a way to make people laugh, that will be huge for him. You know she won't take that risk.
KILMEADE: Because you know her goal is to get -- unnerve him and get him angry to make him look like a bully. So, it doesn't matter what he says.
KELLY: That's right. She wants angry Trump.
KILMEADE: Right.
KELLY: Mr. Kilmeade, thank you sir.
KILMEADE: Thank you very much.
KELLY: I'm going to do it, too. See you. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: So let us know what you thought about the show tonight. Go to facebook.com/thekellyfile and follow me on Twitter @megynkelly. Let me know what you think. This is Dion.
DION: I think I lost my ring.
KELLY: Everyone needs one of these.
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