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Fox News Sunday

Ted Cruz attacks Donald Trump's financial record; Trump responds

This is a rush transcript from "Fox News Sunday," January 31, 2016. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS HOST:  I’m Chris Wallace.

With less than 24 hours until the voting starts in Iowa, the candidates make their final pitch.  Today, the two GOP frontrunners, Donald Trump and Ted Cruz.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE:  You don’t get 30 seconds to respond to me.  

SEN. TED CRUZ, R-TEXAS, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE:  Your question was you have disagreed --

WALLACE:  You don't get 30 seconds to respond to me.  

Today, Senator Cruz is here for round two.  

I know you like to argue about the rules, but we're going to conduct the debate.

CRUZ:  If you guys ask one more main question, I may have to leave the stage.  

WALLACE:  Ted Cruz from Des Moines, Iowa.  

Then --

DONALD TRUMP, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE:  Look at the cameras, like the Academy Awards.  This is like Academy Awards.  

WALLACE:  Donald Trump boycotts the Fox debate.  But will it hurt him at the caucuses?  

TRUMP:  Will I get more votes?  Will I get less votes?  Nobody knows.  Who the hell knows?  But it’s for our vets.  We raised over $5 million in one day.  

WALLACE:  Trump shows up on "Fox News Sunday."  

And our panel analyzes Trump's gamble, the Democratic dead heat and Hillary Clinton's escalating e-mail problem.  

All, right now, on a special edition of "Fox News Sunday."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE:  You are look at the Iowa state capital set atop a hill here in downtown Des Moines.  It's the only five-domed capital in the country.  

And hello again from Fox News.  We're broadcasting today from the rotunda inside the capitol building.  And if you're wondering as we did that bell is from the battleship, the USS Iowa.

We begin with breaking news.  With the first American set to start voting for president tomorrow night, the race here in Iowa is still up for grabs.  Take a look at the final Iowa poll from The Des Moines Register.  Donald Trump now leads Senator Ted Cruz by five points with only four candidates in double digits.  

And check out the movement from the last Iowa poll just three weeks ago.  Trump and Marco Rubio are up.  Cruz and Dr. Ben Carson have dropped.  

On the Democratic side, it's still tight between Hillary Clinton and Senator Bernie Sanders, just three points separating them inside the poll's margin of error.  

In a few minutes, we'll talk with the two frontrunners in the GOP race, Donald Trump and Ted Cruz.  

But first, we have Fox team coverage on the final frantic days of campaigning.

Let's start with Fox News chief political correspondent Carl Cameron who is tracking the Republicans -- Carl.  

CARL CAMERON, FOX NEWS CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT:  Hi, Chris.  

A stunning 45 percent in that Des Moines Register poll say they could still change their minds in the Republican caucuses tomorrow night.  That has Donald Trump and rest of the Republican field able to take nothing for granted.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TRUMP:  So, Jerry, you're my friend for life and I appreciate it.

JERRY FALWELL, JR., LIBERTY UNIVERSITY:  Thank you, Don.  

CAMERON:  Trump was joined by Jerry Falwell Jr. last flight to bolster his position with evangelical conservatives and for the first time in months, downplayed his polling lead to get out his vote.  

TRUMP:  It all doesn't matter if you don't caucus on Monday.  The polls don't matter.  Nothing matters.  The only thing that matters is the poll that's going to be taken on Monday.  

CAMERON:  Trump continues to question Cruz's citizenship, a sign Trump is not overconfident.  

Likewise, Cruz runs attack ads against Rubio while rally his ground troops and boasting about his momentum against Trump.  

CRUZ:  Where we are right now, this race is a dead heat.  It is neck and neck.  Now, it is effectively a two-man race.  

CAMERON:  Under fire from both Trump and Rubio, Cruz fires back with a double barrel.  

CRUZ:  A vote for Marco Rubio is a vote for amnesty.  And a vote for Donald Trump is a vote for Obamacare.  

CAMERON:  Seventy million dollars in television ads have run in Iowa, most of them negative.  

Rubio feeling momentum casts Cruz as rattled.

SEN. MARCO RUBIO, R-FLA., PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE:  It doesn't sound like he’s feeling too good.  It sounds like he's under a lot of pressure and may be not reacting very well to it, which is problematic because presidents are under pressure every day.  

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CAMERON:  And the pressure is mounting for the caucus tomorrow night.  

The record turnout is 122,000 people for the Republican caucuses in Iowa.  That was in the last election in 2012.  Most of the projections and models suggest it will be a bigger turn out, perhaps as much as 160,000.  But there is snow predicted tomorrow night, Chris.  

WALLACE:  Carl, thank you.  

Now to the tight Democratic race.  Just a day before the Iowa caucuses, Hillary Clinton is in full damage control after the State Department revealed they can't release private e-mails because they contain top secret material.  

Chief White House correspondent Ed Henry has the latest on the investigation and how it's affecting the campaign -- Ed.  

ED HENRY, FOX NEWS CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT:  Good to see you, Chris.  

Last May, Hillary Clinton had a 41-point lead in that same Bloomberg-Des Moines Register poll.  That lead has now imploded.  She is in a dead heat today with the Democratic socialist Senator Bernie Sanders.  And she has an e-mail problem that simply will not go away, a looming FBI investigation, plus, as you noted, the Obama administration now confirming there were at least 22 top secret embarrassments on her server.  

On the ground here, what I’m seeing is Clinton getting far smaller crowds than Sanders.  And to rally the base in the final hours, she's stressing her experience, her close ties to President Obama, while Sanders is getting Obama-sized crowds, 3,500 screaming students last night at the University of Iowa, though the big question, of course, is going to be tomorrow night, will Sanders get Obama-sized turnout from 2008?  Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, D-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE:  I’m a progressive who actually like to make progress.  That's what I believe in.  

What we need is a plan and a commitment and me, yes.  Thank you.  

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS, I-VT., PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE:  We began this campaign, we were 3 percent in the national polls.  Here in Iowa, it is virtually tied!  

(CHEERS)

We are going to make American history on Monday night.  

(CHEERS)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HENRY:  The surest sign yet that Clinton hit a rough patch is the fact that her staff is now negotiating with Sanders' staff on adding up to four more Democratic debates.  That is a far cry from last year when she was a clear front-runner and was ducking more debates -- Chris.  

WALLACE:  Ed, thanks for that.  

We're joined now by Texas Senator Ted Cruz who has been locked in a fierce battle for weeks to win the Iowa caucuses.  

And, Senator, welcome back to "Fox News Sunday."  

CRUZ:  Thank you, Chris.  Good to be with you.

WALLACE:  Let's start with the new Des Moines Register poll.  Three weeks ago, you were beating Trump by three points.  Now, you're trailing by five points.  

How do you explain the eight point swing away from you?  

CRUZ:  You know, Chris, I’m thrilled to be where we are.  We're 36 hours away from the Iowa caucuses and we’re in a statistical dead heat first place.  If you told me ten months ago we’ve been where we are now, we would have been thrilled it with.  

Right now, this is all about turnout.  This is all about who shows up tomorrow night at 7:00 p.m., and we're focused on if conservatives come out, we will win.  What we're seeing is if the old Reagan coalition coming together.  We're seeing conservatives and evangelicals and libertarians and Reagan Democrats.  

And if conservatives come out, we're going to win tomorrow.  

WALLACE:  Donald Trump is hitting you on several fronts.  And here's what he had to say in an interview we did last night.  Take a look.  

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP:  He's got a situation where he didn't disclose Goldman Sachs.  He didn't disclose Citibank on his personal financial disclosure form.  He didn't disclose to a lot of people the whole thing where he was born in Canada.  

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(LAUGHTER)

WALLACE:  Between all that and the fact that you oppose the very popular ethanol mandate here in Iowa, are you in danger of losing a conservative state that would seem perfectly made for you and even you have admitted that if Trump were to win Iowa and New Hampshire, as you put it, he might become unstoppable?  

CRUZ:  You know, Chris, I’ve got to say, Donald looks very rattled there.  I mean, it’s interesting.  A month ago, he was singing my praises everywhere he went.  I was his friend.  I was terrific.

WALLACE:  Well, in fairness, you were singing his praises a month ago.  

CRUZ:  But, Chris, I still am singing his praises.  What he has changed to doing is insulting me every day, you know, attacking me.  He knows this loan story as complete nonsense.  It’s also the height of chutzpah for someone who owes hundreds --  

WALLACE:  That’s a New York -- that’s a New York value.

CRUZ:  It is.  I’m trying to help Donald with that.

WALLACE:  OK.

CRUZ:  But for someone who owes of hundreds of millions of dollars if not billions of dollars, to attack Heidi and me because we put our life savings into running for Senate.  And a statement that the loans weren’t disclosed, he knows that’s flat-out false.  The loans were disclosed.  

WALLACE:  What do you mean he owes --  

CRUZ:  If you look at his financial disclosure, he owes at least $480 million right now, and it could be billions.  And, by the way with, loans when Heidi and I take loans, we pay them back.  Donald declared bankruptcy four times.  

And so, for him to sit there owing hundreds of millions or billions or who knows, and to criticize Heidi and me for putting our entire net worth into the campaign is astonishing.  It is not honest, especially because the loans were disclosed, that were publicly disclosed at the time.  The entire complaint of "The New York Times" that Donald has seized upon is that they were filed on the wrong form, that I filed on the Senate form rather than the FEC form.  

But here's the important point, Chris -- Donald is engaging in daily insults.  I’m not responding in kind.  I have not insulted him.  I don’t intend to insult him.

WALLACE:  You just talked about the fact that he owes half a billion dollars.  

CRUZ:  That's not insult, that's a fact.  He's attacking me on this loan and he has said, you didn't play that quote, but that I’m corrupt and owned by the banks.  I mean, he’s -- he has -- he called me a Canadian anchor baby.  

And you know what?  That's fine.  He's entitled to do that.  

There's a reason he's engaging in personal insults.  He doesn't want to talk about the issues.  He doesn't want to talk about the substance.  The same reason he skipped the Iowa debate because his record is inconsistent with --

(CROSSTALK)

WALLACE:  As you know, we have an interview that we did last night with him and I play exactly that clip of you saying he's trying to hide his record.  I want to drill down --  

CRUZ: But let's take a second on his record then.  I mean, let's not just have the insults.  Let’s actually look at the record that --

(CROSSTALK)

WALLACE:  All I’m saying is we confront him on that record.  So --

CRUZ:  Well, for example, on Obamacare, Donald Trump supports expanding Obamacare to make it full on socialized medicine like Bernie Sanders.  You got Hillarycare, Obamacare and Trumpcare.  And if Donald Trump is elected president, the federal government will be in charge of every one of our health care.  

And, by the way, that's his position right now.  It is identical to Hillary Clinton.  

WALLACE:  Right.  

I want to drill down into Cruz-care, because there is a statement you made about Obamacare that has gotten a lot of attention since the debate.  Here it is.  

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CRUZ:  We have seen now in six years of Obamacare that it's been a disaster.  It is the biggest job killer in this country, millions of Americans have lost their jobs and have been forced into part time work, have lost their health insurance, have lost their doctors, have seen their premiums skyrocket.  

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE:  But, Senator, the fact checkers say you're wrong.  Since that law went into effect, the unemployment rate fell from 9.9 percent to 5 percent, as 13 million new jobs were created and 16.3 million people who were previously uninsured now have coverage.  

Now, don't get me wrong, there are plenty of problems with Obamacare.  But more people have jobs and health insurance than they did before Obamacare.  

CRUZ:  Chris, the media fact checkers are not fair and impartial.  They are liberal, editorial journalists.  And they have made it their mission to defend Obamacare.

(CROSSTALK)

WALLACE:  There's certainly no question that more people have jobs and more people have health insurance coverage.  

CRUZ:  Yes, there is question.  Number one, we have the lowest percentage of Americans working today of any year since 1977.  That's fact.  They focused on --

WALLACE:  But there are 13 million jobs created, sir.  That’s a fact.

CRUZ:  The fact is that from 2008 to today, we've seen economic growth of 1.2 percent on average.

(CROSSTALK)

CRUZ:  Chris, don't interrupt me.  I'll give an answer --

WALLACE:  That's changing the subject.  

CRUZ:  No.

WALLACE:  Thirteen million new jobs have been created.  

CRUZ:  And that is a historically slow rate of job creation if you look at what has occurred in any previous year.  You know, Obama is the first president ever to have a year of 3 percent economic growth.  Millions of people in this country are hurting.  

One of the problems is you've got the elite, the Washington elite, the rich have gotten richer under Barack Obama.  The top one percent are in a higher share of our income than any year since 1928.  But working men and women are hurting.  

And I'll tell you, you know, representing Texas, one of the things I do when I go home is I host small business roundtables.  And I bring together 20, 30 small business owners around the table and just ask them, share what’s on your heart.  Share what you're thinking about.  Share what you’re praying about.  

I have never done a small business table where at least half the small business owners didn't list Obamacare as the single biggest obstacle they're facing.  Millions of Americans have lost their jobs and the people have been forced into part time work.  Or lost their health care or lost their doctors or seen their premiums skyrocket.  

WALLACE:  Let's talk sir about your alternative, what you say you would do after you repeal Obamacare, how you would replace it.  And this is what you listed in the debate.  

Sell health insurance across state lines, expand health saving accounts, make insurance portable so you can take it with you if you switch jobs.  Now, conservative think-tanks say those are good ideas.  They also say they would have no effect in giving people who are now uninsured health coverage.  

CRUZ:  Well, that's simply not the case.  So, for example, the biggest barrier to access is cost.  If you want more people covered, what you want is lower costs.  When you ask people, "Why don't you have health insurance", they say, "Gosh, I can't afford it."  

Allowing people to purchase health insurance across state lines would create a true 50-state national marketplace.  That would drive down the cost and expand the availability of low cost catastrophic coverage.  

WALLACE:  But, sir, the Congressional Budget Office, nonpartisan, the National Center for Policy Analysis, certainly not a left wing group, have both said that that kind of selling insurance across state lines would have minimal effect in expanding access.  

CRUZ:  Well, I can't speak to what the CBO can say.  What I can tell you is if you want more people to have choices, you want more choices and lower costs.  That's what gives more people health insurance.  

If you want fewer people to have health insurance, if you want fewer choices and higher cost, which is what Obamacare does.  For example, President Obama told the American people that under Obamacare the average family's premium would drop $2,500.  In fact, the average family's premiums have risen $3,000.  

Now, Chris if, you're a single mom, if you're struggling to feed your kids, $5,500, that is real money that you can't provide for your family.  And this law is a disaster.  People are hurting.

I’ll tell you, as I travel the country, everywhere I go, I talk to people.  You know, we had an event Friday night.  Let me give you --

(CROSSTALK)

WALLACE:  We're running out of time and you guys agreed to 10 minutes.  And I just want to ask you two more questions.  

Look, nobody doubts there are problems with Obamacare.  I just want to explore those issues with you.  

CRUZ:  Sure.  Happy to.  

WALLACE:  One thing that struck me in the debate is that the other candidates disagreed with you sharply.  But it wasn't about policies.  It was more than that.  Take a look, sir.  

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. RAND PAUL, R-KY., PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE:  What is particularly insulting, though, is that he is the king of saying, oh, you're for amnesty.  Everybody is for amnesty except for Ted Cruz.  

RUBIO:  This is the lie that Ted’s campaign has built on -- and Rand touched upon it -- that he's the most conservative guy and everyone else is a -- you know, everyone else is a RINO.  The truth is, Ted, throughout this campaign, you've been willing to say or do anything in order to get votes.  

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE:  Senator, that's --  

(LAUGHTER)

WALLACE:  You laugh.  But that's not the normal political discourse.  That seems personal.  

CRUZ:  Listen, six weeks ago, every candidate in the Republican field was attacking Donald Trump.  Today, they're all attacking me.  I think that reflects the race has changed.  

I understand in that debate -- part of the reason Donald skipped that debate, part of the reason he was afraid to stand before the men and women of Iowa is he didn't want that scrutiny.  So, naturally, everyone else is shooting at me.  That's fine.  That's their prerogative.  

I’m not going to respond in kind when, you know, when people engage in those sorts of attacks.  Now, I will talk about substance.  So, for example, on the question of amnesty, it is a fact that right now, Marco Rubio advocates amnesty for 12 million people here illegally.  He advocates legalization and citizenship for everyone here illegally.  He even advocates amnesty for criminal who are here illegally.  

It is also a fact that Marco has said whether went on Spanish television with Jorge Ramos that he would not revoke President Obama's illegal executive amnesty on the first day in office.  He said you can't do that overnight.  That’s going to take time.

If I’m elected president, I will rescind every single one of President Obama's illegal executive orders on day one.  

WALLACE:  We got -- we got a minute left.  

CRUZ:  Sure.  

WALLACE:  Finally, you and I had a couple of run ins in the debate.  One of them was about whether or not you qualified for a 30-second response.  Let's revisit it.  

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE:  The question was about -- it's not my question that you get a chance to respond to, it's his answer.  You don't get 30 seconds to respond to me.  

CRUZ:  Your question was you have disagreed --

(CROSSTALK)

WALLACE:  You don't get 30 seconds to respond to me.  

I like to go on, sir.  I know you like to argue about the rules, but we're going to conduct the debate.  

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE:  A number of observers thought that you threw yourself off there, that arguing about the rules.  

Do you think that sometimes your lawyerly instincts get in your way?  And you have 30 seconds to respond, sir.  

CRUZ:  Look, I was surprised you didn't let me respond there.  That’s your prerogative.  I’m happy to respond that to whatever you like, Chris.  

WALLACE:  And?  I mean, the general question is to whether or not sometimes you get down into the rules as opposed to --  

CRUZ:  Look, I’m not interested in a rules debate.  What I’m interested in is 36 hours from now, the men and women of Iowa are going to caucus.  And we have a grassroots army.  We’ve got 12,000 volunteers in the state.  

Let me give you an example of what we're seeing on the ground.  Friday night, we were in Wilton, Iowa.  There are 2,800 people that live in Wilton, Iowa, we had 700 come out to our event.  A third nearly of the town came out.  We're seeing that every day.  

And this race is a simple choice.  A vote for Marco Rubio is a vote for amnesty.  And a vote for Donald Trump is a vote for Obamacare.  

The reason conservatives are uniting behind our campaign is because I am the only candidate in the race who has been a consistent conservative, who’s been a fiscal conservative, a social conservative, a national security conservative, and the stakes are too high for us to roll the dice and take a risk.  

WALLACE:  Senator Cruz, thank you.  Thanks for your time.  

CRUZ:  Thank you, Chris.

WALLACE:  I know you're awfully busy in this final day.  We'll see how the world turns tomorrow night.  

CRUZ:  I look forward to it.  

WALLACE:  Up next, Donald Trump and his first FOX interview since he boycotted our debate Thursday night.  That plus a special Iowa caucus panel as "Fox News Sunday" continues from the state capitol in Des Moines, Iowa.  

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WALLACE:  Welcome back to Iowa.  As we take a look at the famous arches over the Des Moines River.  

Well, the candidate who was soaked up the lion's share of the attention in this campaign kept at it this week.  The question of whether Donald Trump would or wouldn't attend the Fox News debate became a kind of soap opera, as we all know he didn't which he admits say big gamble just before the caucuses.  

But last night, we spoke with Trump in his first Fox debate -- first Fox interview since the debate.  It was down the road about two hours at a campaign event in Davenport.  

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE:  Mr. Trump, welcome back to "Fox News Sunday."

I want to start with that new Iowa poll.  Three weeks ago, you were trailing Ted Cruz by three points.  Now you're leading by five points.

I guess the question for you is, how come?

TRUMP:  Well, we had a great week and maybe even a great couple of weeks in Iowa.  We've been here a lot.  I have a fantastic relationship with the people of Iowa and the evangelicals and the Tea Party, and we really have done a lot of work in Iowa and I've gotten to know a lot more people.

And, you know, I've known the folks here for a long time, but we really -- there's been some very special things happened over the last two weeks, Chris.

WALLACE:  Now, 29 percent of people in the polls say they disapprove of your decision to skip the debate.

What do you want to say to voters in these final hours before the caucuses, who may feel that you snubbed them by not showing up at the one debate to be held here in Iowa?

TRUMP:  Well, you know, you love Fox and so do I and I get along great and I have a great respect for Roger Ailes.  But what happened is they put out a press release that was very nasty and was taunting.  And it was not appropriate --  

WALLACE:  Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.  I don't -- I --  

TRUMP:  -- anyways.

WALLACE:  -- I don't want to get it -- I don't want to get into that.  I'm just saying, what do you want to say to voters who feel that you snubbed them?

TRUMP:  Well, I -- what I'm saying is you have to stick up for your rights.  And in the meantime, I raised $6 million for the veterans, which is very important.  And you have to stick up for your rights.  You can't let people do that to you.  

And just like if I were running the country, I'd stick up for our country.  But you can't let people do that.

And frankly, I had a very successful evening.  We had a tremendous overflow crowd and we raised, in one hour, Chris, which I think you're very happy about, for the vets, we raised $6 million.

So, I was very happy about that.  It was a great thing.  It was a great decision and we'll -- we'll do it again sometime, Chris.

WALLACE:  OK.

Ted Cruz, who I suspect you're familiar with, says the real reason that you skipped the debate is because you want to hide your liberal record from voters.

Here's Mr. Cruz.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CRUZ:  He doesn't want to debate cronyism because Donald supported President Obama's TARP bailout of the big Wall Street banks.  Donald supported President Obama's stimulus plan.  And if you can't debate the issues, the only thing you have left to do is toss insults.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE:  Senator Cruz says, Mr. Trump, that you're trying to hide your support for the bailout and the stimulus, you're trying to hide your record from voters.

TRUMP:  Chris, I'm not trying to hide anything.  I was a businessman.  I had many different feelings about many different things.  And, by the way, in business, as you know, you have flexibility.  You can do many things many different ways.

What I am very sure of is that Senator Cruz has hid the fact that he had major loans from Citibank and Goldman Sachs that he didn't put on his personal financial disclosure form.  That's called hiding a record.

I wasn't in politics when I was coming up with different views.  Nobody even asked me my views, frankly.  I was a businessman.  My views didn't matter.  I'm not a politician.

Now, for the last seven months, I've been a politician.

But what I can tell you is that he's got a situation where he didn't disclose Goldman Sachs, he didn't disclose Citibank on his personal financial disclosure form.  He didn't disclose to a lot of people the whole thing where he was born in Canada, which probably makes it so he might not even be able to run, according to many, many constitutional scholars.

And he said he didn't even know he was a citizen of Canada until 15 months ago.

So, give me a break.  He shouldn't be mentioning me.

Here's a couple of things -- he didn't know he was a citizen of Canada?  Give me a break, Chris.

WALLACE:  You talked earlier about the veterans event you held during the debate and that you're proud of it, and understandably so.  You raised $6 million, including $1 million out of your own pocket.

But, sir, "Forbes" magazine took a look at your record of supporting veterans groups over the years and what they found is that from 2009 to 2013, the Trump Foundation donated $57,000 to groups helping veterans.  But over the years, they say that you gave at least twice that, somewhere between $100,000 and $250,000 to, of all things, the Clinton Foundation.

TRUMP:  Well, what I have done is I've given a lot of different events at Mar-a-Lago for the veterans.  We have many.  I can get you a list.  I didn't know you'd be bringing this up, but I can get you a list of all of the events I've given in Palm Beach, Florida, in different hotels I have for the veterans.

And I've opened up my houses.  I've opened up my -- in a couple of cases, my buildings.  And we've given many events.  But I can certainly get you that list and I'd be proud to.

I did give to the Clinton Foundation.  What I didn't know is they'd be using it for private aircraft and things like that.  The Clinton Foundation was helping with Haiti and with lots of other things and I thought it was going to do some good work.  So, it didn't make any difference to me.  

Again, I was a businessman and it was my obligation to get along with everybody, including the Clintons, including Democrats and liberals and Republicans and conservatives.

As a businessman, I had an obligation to do that, Chris.

WALLACE:  You know, you were talking earlier when we were discussing the poll about your support among the various groups here in Iowa, 60 percent of Republican caucus-goers identify themselves as evangelicals and you're doing very well with social conservatives.  I know that you're campaigning today with Jerry Falwell, Jr., the president of Liberty University, who has endorsed you.

And in a new poll, 52 percent of white evangelicals said they think that you would be a good or great president.  And I, you know, you don't fit the typical evangelical social conservative profile.

And I guess my question is, why do you think you're doing so well with that particular group?

TRUMP:  Well, first of all, I'm probably more honored when I hear that statistic than even the fact that I'm actually winning the poll by, you know, a pretty good number.  And I've come back from where I was losing the poll.  If you look, you know, from a few weeks ago, I think I was down on this poll and now I'm up fairly substantially so.

But I think I may be more honored by winning on the evangelicals than I am by even the win, because, you know, I've just had a great relationship.  I've just had a really great.

When you have Jerry Falwell, Jr. endorse me, that was a very big turning point.  I went to Liberty University, gave a speech.  We set the all-time record for attendance.  And I don't know, I can just tell you, they're something very special.

As you know, I'm Christian, I'm Presbyterian.  But there has been something very special as far as the evangelicals and my relationship with them.  And I saw that, also, in the poll numbers and it really stood out.  And, I'm very happy with it.

But I think it's also, it's the support of Jerry and Robert, you know Robert Jeffress, Pastor Jeffress, was -- has been tremendous.  And so have many other pastors.  I mean, we've had tremendous support from ministers, pastors and from Christians generally and evangelicals.

So, I'm really happy about it.

WALLACE:  But, Mr. Trump, let's take one issue.  You say now that the Supreme Court has ruled that same-sex marriage is the law of the land and that any politician who talks about wanting to amend the Constitution is just playing politics.  Are you saying it's time to move on?

TRUMP:  No, I'm saying this.  It has been ruled up.  It has been there.  If I'm a, you know, if I'm elected, I would be very strong on putting certain judges on the bench that I think maybe could change things.

But they've got a long way to go.  I mean at some point, we have to get back down to business.  But there’s no question about it.  I mean most -- and most people feel this way.  

They have ruled on it.  I wish that it was done by the state.  I don't like the way they ruled.  I disagree with the Supreme Court from the standpoint they should have given the state -- it should be a states' rights issue.  And that's the way it should have been ruled on, Chris, not the way they did it.

This is a very surprising ruling.  And I -- I can see changes coming down the line, frankly.  But I would have much preferred that they ruled at a state level and allowed the states to make those rulings themselves.

WALLACE: But -- but just to button this up very quickly, sir, are you saying that if you become president, you might try to appoint justices to overrule the decision on same-sex marriage?

TRUMP: I would strongly consider that, yes.

WALLACE: Finally, uh, you were campaigning with your daughter Ivanka, who is very pregnant, I think eight months pregnant, and you had a suggestion for how she could help the campaign. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Ivanka, it would be so great if you had your baby in Iowa.  It would be so great.  I'd definitely win.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE: Question, are you sure, Mr. Trump, you don't want her to wait until Super Tuesday, on March 1st, where there are a couple of states that have even more delegates?

TRUMP: Well, you know, I -- I was kidding.  In fact, that was at the event where we raised all the money for the veterans.  And to be honest with you, I was kidding. But, I wouldn't mind.  Look, Iowa would be a great place for her to have a baby and, frankly, so would New Hampshire and so would South Carolina.  We have about three weeks to worry about it, but they'd all be great places for her to have her baby.  She's a great person and hopefully it's going to be a healthy baby.  That's the most important thing.

WALLACE: I was going to say, too bad she's not having triplets.

Mr. Trump, thank you very much. We'll watch what happens on Monday night and we'll see you next week in New Hampshire, sir.

TRUMP: Thank you very much. I appreciate it, Chris.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE: Up next, a special Iowa Sunday panel, including the state's governor, Terry Branstad. We'll discuss how tomorrow's caucuses may reshape the race for the White House.

Plus, what would you like to ask the panel about how Trump's debate boycott will sit with Iowa voters? Just go to Facebook or Twitter @foxnewssunday and we may use your questions on the air.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WALLACE: Coming up, Democratic frontrunner Hillary Clinton is in damage control.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KIRBY, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESMAN: The State Department will be denying in full seven e-mail (INAUDIBLE) representing 37 pages.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE: Our panel discusses what the latest twist in the e-mail investigation means for Clinton’s campaign, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUBIO: You know, Ted Cruz has been my friend and is. He's decided to run a very, you know, deceitful campaign at the end on some things he’s saying. People see through that.

CRUZ: In Washington, after campaigning and getting elected, promising to lead the fight against amnesty, Marco chose instead to stand with Barack Obama.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE: Senators Marco Rubio and Ted Cruz getting in a few more jabs in the final hours before the Iowa caucuses. And it's time now for our special Iowa caucus Sunday group. Fox News senior political analyst Brit Hume, Kathie Obradovich, political columnist for The Des Moines Register. We're honored to have Iowa's governor, Terry Branstad, the longest serving governor in American history, and Anne Gearan of "The Washington Post."

Kathie, let me start with you. You've been covering Iowa politics for 30 years or so. Put together the new Iowa poll from your paper, The Des Moines Register, what you’re seeing on the ground? Where do you get a sense of the Republican side things are headed tomorrow night?

KATHIE OBRADOVICH, THE DES MOINES REGISTER: Well, first of all, I think that we see Donald Trump with a decent lead going into the Iowa caucuses. A five point lead is usually a pretty good indication. However, what makes it exciting is that Ted Cruz really has a lot going for him in this poll, including the people who are most likely to turn out, the very conservative voters, evangelicals. We know that if there’s a blizzard, they're going to shovel their way to their caucus. And so, you know, there -- he is right. You know, his -- his point to you about turning out conservatives is exactly right.

WALLACE: Governor Branstad, you have made it very clear during this campaign you're not endorsing anyone, but you kind of dis-endorsed somebody because you’ve said that you thought it would be a big mistake to support -- for Iowans to support Ted Cruz because of his opposition to the ethanol mandate. And you’ve got some nice things to say about Donald Trump, that -- that he is talking about effective leadership, about making America great again. So I guess my question is, for voters who were wavering between the two frontrunners, Cruz and Trump, are you saying go with Trump.

GOV. TERRY BRANSTAD, R-IOWA: No, what I'm saying is, we’ve got a lot of really great candidates. And most of them support renewable energy. Iowa leads the nation in ethanol, biodiesel and wind energy. And Cruz's voting record has been against ethanol, it's been against the tax credit for wind energy and those are thousands of jobs in our state. Farm income is important. I'm the governor of Iowa. I want Iowa voters to be well informed. I trust Iowa voters. They've elected me many times. And I trust them to make the decision they think of who they think would be the best leader for this country.

WALLACE: But if it's Cruz and anybody, you're saying go for the anybody?

BRANSTAD: Well, I'm just saying, Cruz's record has been against renewable fuels. Renewable fuels, Iowa leads the nation in renewables. We produce more ethanol than we consume in gasoline. We're the leader in wind energy. We just saw the wind energy tax credit extended. Cruz is opposed to that. Those are thousands of jobs in our state. Forty-three ethanol plants. People making wind blades and turbine’s and towers and we want to protect those jobs. We want to continue to grow the Iowa economy.

WALLACE: Yes, I think -- I think you've made your point.

Brit, there are a couple of big stories going into tomorrow night. One is obviously who's going to win. And it seems it's likely to be one of these two front runners, Trump or Cruz. There’s also the -- the question of how well Marco Rubio does. Is he a strong third, a weak third, does he not even finish third? Depending on how those questions are answered, how much could this result, the Iowa caucuses, reshape the race?

BRIT HUME, FOX NEWS SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, some of the candidates are going to come out of here having done so poorly that unless they’ve somewhere got some money squirrelled away that they may not have, they're not going to be able to continue because you simply have to have money to continue. This is -- this is the way it's always been. And I would say this, by the way, about -- about the Trump supporters. They don't particularly fit the profile of your -- of your Iowa caucus goer. But my sense of their intensity is that they have the most intense -- sort of the most intense people I've ever dealt with. I see them all the time on Twitter. They don't -- they don’t care for any criticism of him. My sense is that -- that -- that they will turn out. Now, some of them may go to the wrong place although, but I think they're going to be out in force and I don't think anybody should count on a low turnout from the Trump people hoping to -- hoping to overtake him.

WALLACE: But -- yes, when you say the wrong place, you mean because you have to show up -- it’s different than a -- than a primary. You have to show up at a school gym or a church basement and you’ve got to spend a couple of hours standing up for your person and you’ve got to show up in the right precinct to have your vote count.

We asked you for questions for the panel and we got this on Facebook from Mel Van. And this was on Trump's decision to boycott the debate. He writes, "I was disappointed in Donald and think it could hurt him in Iowa. Do you agree?"

Anne, how do you answer Mel and do you think that Trump's decision to stay out of the Fox debate could hurt him in the caucuses?

ANNE GEARAN, THE WASHINGTON POST: Well, you would think it would, but it really seems to have been a no harm, no foul outcome. He clearly did very, very well in this very predictive, historically predictive poll. And within that poll, our -- our findings that -- that really don't seem to indicate at all that people are penalizing him for having skipped. And at the same time, the ratings for -- for the debate were high. It -- it sort of seems to have neutralized on both sides.

WALLACE: Governor, your sense, does the debate boycott hurt Trump? It is something that are going to affect votes?

BRANSTAD: I certainly wouldn't advise anybody to skip a Fox debate right before the election.

WALLACE: God bless you, sir.

BRANSTAD: But, the fact that he had an event for veterans, he had a huge turnout for that, he's a very unconventional candidate and he's done a lot of things that we thought would hurt him that doesn't seem to have. I guess we'll find out on Monday night. I just don't know.

WALLACE: Kathie, just to finish with you, because, look, the The Des Moines Register poll was interesting. Basically almost 80 percent of voters either said that they approve of the decision to skip, or they just didn't care. But there was about 30 percent, actually my numbers are right, it was 29 percent, was that they did -- it did bother them. I mean 29 percent could be a factor in a close race.

OBRADOVICH: But I think 29 percent said it bothered them and 25 percent said it helped them. So we got about a -- about a 4 percent there where, you know, where the difference is. And, you know, is that 4 percent going to be a difference in -- on caucus night? You know, maybe if the debate were last night, it might be right on the top of people's thinking. It’s something as though Ted Cruz was there and was exposed to a lot of tough attacks as well. So, you know, I think -- I think that, overall, good for Trump.

WALLACE: All right. Good for Trump.

OBRADOVICH: Yes.

WALLACE: Interesting.

Panel, we have to take a break here, but when we come back, we'll turn to the Democratic race in Iowa and growing problems for the Clinton campaign as that e-mail scandal steals the headline.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: And my esteemed opponent, Senator Sanders, wants to start all over again. I’ve got to tell you, honestly, it's been a hard fight to get us to where we are today.

SANDERS: It is great to be against the war after you vote for the war.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE: The rhetoric on the Democratic side getting downright nasty in these final days before the Iowa caucuses. Incidentally, if you wonder why we never have the Democratic candidates on, here's the answer. We invite Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders every week. And every week they turn us down. The Sanders camp declines politely. Top officials in the Clinton camp don't even answer our calls and e-mail.

And we're back now with the panel.

Anne, you've been tracking the Democratic race here factoring in this new poll that shows Clinton with a, what, I guess a three point lead over Sanders, obviously within the margin of error. Your sense of where things are headed tomorrow night?

GEARAN: Well, she's actually been slightly ahead in -- in most recent polls, often within the margin of error, but enough ahead, a few points, that it looks as though, if -- unless something really strange happens with turnout or whether, that she will just squeak by. That appears to be the -- the most likely outcome.

Just squeaking by is certainly not where she was here only two months ago. Certainly not where she wants to be. The Sanders campaign is already claiming momentum out of The Des Moines Register poll. And presuming that he does very, very well here, just not well enough to beat her, they will continue to claim that momentum going into New Hampshire.

WALLACE: Actually, I’m going to pick up on that in a moment with -- with Kathie, but first I want to ask you, governor, the breaking news on the Democratic side has been the fact that the Obama administration announced that they can't release dozens of pages of Clinton private e-mails because they are too sensitive. Here is administration spokesman John Kirby.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KIRBY: Denying in full seven e-mail chains found in 22 documents representing 37 pages. The documents are being upgraded at the request of the intelligence community because they contain a category of top secret information.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE: Now, governor, I know you're not following this intensely, but your reaction to the Clinton e-mail scandal and your sense of how it's going to sit with Iowa voters?

BRANSTAD: Well, putting your own convenience above the security for the nation, I don't think it sits very well. And even among Democrats, a lot of people really question her integrity, her trustworthiness. And I think in the general election, it could be a big issue if she ends up being the Democratic nominee. But she doesn't have a lot of people that believe or trust her. They believe that she and her husband have always thought they were above the law and they didn't have to abide by the rules the rest of us have to. So I think it's a problem.

WALLACE: Kathie, you -- you heard what Anne just said, which is, and this isn't a prediction but just her read right now, is that Clinton squeaks by. Based on your read on the ground, the latest poll, the ground games, the size of the crowds, what's your read on what happens in the Democratic race? And what is the possibility that this could be a repeat of 2008, although in this case Clinton wouldn't get beat by a charismatic young Barack Obama, but by a 74-year-old socialist?

OBRADOVICH: Well, you know, there are parallels to 2008 because Bernie Sanders has a similar coalition supporting him that Barack Obama did, first time caucus goers, independents, people who, you know, have not necessarily been a huge part of the political Democratic process before. And, however, here's a big difference. In 2008, we saw first timers coming out in record numbers. This poll has really about 40 percent first timers and that is about average. So we're not seeing a huge surge.

Bernie Sanders, I think the -- generally speaking, these are really big turnout. We're not seeing that sort of build to a record turnout. Now, that could change, you know, in a very short period of time.

Brit.

HUME: Chris, if there’s one number in that Iowa poll that would give you a sense of why Bernie Sanders is doing as well as he is, and why he just might benefit from a last minute surge is the one when people were asked if the -- if our system in America, economic system, is rigged and screws the little guy. And the Republican poll, 50 percent among Republicans said that it worked, that the system is good. Sixty-seven percent of Democrats said that the system is rigged. Only a, you know, some tiny number said that it is fair. That is the soul of Bernie Sanders' message, that the capitalist system is rigged and the billionaire class is the -- is a -- is a -- is a bunch of pirates and the little guy’s getting screwed. And the sentiment, that strong, I think it counts in large measure for his success.

OBRADOVICH: One interesting point about that. That also characterizes Donald Trump supporters more than anybody else. All Republicans, demographics say the system’s working fine, except pretty much for Donald Trump supporters.

WALLACE: Brit, I --

GEARAN: And it --

WALLACE: I just want to go, Brit, big picture. Step back and give us a 30,000 foot view of this. Clinton-Sanders, this FBI investigation, and there were big revelation this week about these e-mail that are too secret to even be released at all, the possibility that a new mainstream, big name Democrat could still get in this race. What is the possibility of this race really gets up ended?

HUME: Well, if something happens that makes us think that she is seriously likely to be indict, or is indicted, obviously that would change everything and who knows what would happen on the -- on the Democratic side. I mean it is -- there are lots of variables out there. I would say that Bernie Sanders, if he does respectably well here, even if he doesn't win, moves on to New Hampshire where he’s got this huge lead. If he wins there, it will be big headlines everywhere. That could shake up the race as it heads south. That’s supposed to be a great firewall for -- for Clinton in the south. I'm not sure that will be true. So, you know, there’s a lot of variable on the -- on the -- on the Democratic side that -- that will unfold as we go forward here.

WALLACE: Anne, I cut you off.

GEARAN: No, I was just going to say the -- that whole economic populism point that -- that the deck is stacked and things are rigged against the little guy is a theme that Hillary Clinton tried to strike and -- and has sort of essentially cooped first from Elizabeth Warren and then from Bernie Sanders when he became -- it became clear that --

WALLACE: It's hard for her to make that case, though, isn't it?

GEARAN: It -- apparently it really hasn't really taken. I mean she gets -- it’s an applause line in the room and -- and she certainly -- it certainly resonates in the moment. But people consistently, in this poll and others, name Sanders as the person who speaks to them on that point.

WALLACE: Now in Brooklyn, which is where the -- the new -- the Clinton campaign headquarters is based, they say, look, even if Sanders wins Iowa, even if Sanders wins New Hampshire, we’ve got this firewall when -- when they go down south. Do they really believe that or do they think this could just up end everything where Sanders could run the first two states?

GEARAN: Well, they believe it but they don't want to test it. I -- I mean, who would? It's -- it’s the -- clearly, you know, statistically, she's got a lot of things going for her in -- in South Carolina, in Nevada, too, which -- which vote next. And then the southern states, she's way ahead of him. That could change.

WALLACE: And -- and we’ve got about 30 seconds left. I know they play it down publicly. But behind the scenes, Anne, your best sense of how worried they really are about this FBI investigation?

GEARAN: Worried because it's a giant unknown. I man no one within the -- the Clinton organization can absolutely know for sure where this is going. And -- and that's the last thing you want is a giant unknown hanging over you.

WALLACE: Thank you all. It's been a pleasure talking with you. We'll see you next week in New Hampshire, except, I assume, Governor Branstad, you have better things to do with your time.

BRANSTAD: I'm going to be right here in Iowa working for the people of this state.

WALLACE: OK. You're always welcome, however. I just want you to know, it's an open invitation.

BRANSTAD: Well, thank you.

WALLACE: Up next, in a campaign for the ages, this may have been the wildest week yet. We go on the trail as "Fox News Sunday" continues from Des Moines.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WALLACE: The view from above Des Moines with a good look at the Polk County Courthouse. You probably don’t want to end up there.

Just think about this week, a presidential debate, the front-runner boycotts and serious new allegations against the top candidate in the other race. It may have been the strangest week yet on the trail.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Most likely I won't be doing the debate.

CRUZ: If she asks him mean questions, I mean, his hair might stand on end.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When you were governor or when you were in a -- in a --

GOV. JOHN KASICH, R-OHIO, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I am governor. What do you mean when I was?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Welcome to the seventh Republican presidential debate.

CRUZ: Let me say, I'm a maniac. Now that we’ve gotten the Donald Trump portion out of the way --

TRUMP: Look at all the cameras. It’s like the Academy Awards. This is like the Academy Award. We're actually told that we have more cameras than they do by quite a bit, so that’s something (ph).

CRUZ: Marco made the choice to go the direction of the major donors, to support amnesty because he thought it was politically advantageous.

RUBIO: You helped design George W. Bush's immigration policy. And then in the committee you said, I want to bring people out of the shadows. Now you want to trump Trump on immigration.

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE, R-N.J., PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Last night was a lot of fun. I always enjoy getting up on that stage.

CRUZ: Next cycle I'm told Lady Gaga’s going to run.

PAUL: I don't know who’s more dangerous to the country, Donald Trump or Bernie Sanders.

SANDERS: My opponent is not in Iowa tonight. She is raising money from a Philadelphia investment firm.

CROWD: Boo!

CLINTON: Stand up for me on Monday night. And if you do, I will stand up and fight for you for the next four years!

MIKE HUCKABEE, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Hi there. How are you?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, there -- oh, oh, come on, you’ve got to take us.

TRUMP: Ted Cruz is an anchor baby in Canada. But Canada doesn't accept anchor babies.

CRUZ: Donald Trump thought I was the nicest guy on earth. Now I wake up every day and take up Twitter to see the latest insults.

TRUMP: I’ve got a fire problem.

WALLACE: Well, we may have a bigger story than the politics by the time this is over.

TRUMP It is incredible.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE: Yes, there was one more surprise when a fire alarm went off in the middle of our interview with Donald Trump. All of this and we still haven't gotten to the first votes. But all that changes tomorrow night.

Be sure to tune into Fox News Channel at 6:00 p.m. Eastern for full coverage of the Iowa caucuses. And, by the way, Karl Rove, Joe Trippy (ph) and I will reunite as the campaign cowboys give you an early read when the first results start coming in from key precincts.

And that's it for today. Have a great week. And we'll see you next "Fox News Sunday," live from Manchester, New Hampshire.

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