Ben Carson speaks out about overcoming violent past

GOP frontrunner responds to media accusations on 'The Kelly File'


This is a rush transcript from "The Kelly File," November 5, 2015. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

MEGYN KELLY, HOST: Breaking tonight, Republican 2016 front-runner, Dr. Ben Carson newly atop the national poll average taking a serious new attack as one major media outlet seems to suggest he made up parts of his compelling life story.

Welcome to "The Kelly File," everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Of all the GOP candidates for president, none may have a more powerful, personal story than Dr. Ben Carson. Overcoming a troubled childhood in inner city Detroit to go on to Yale Medical School ultimately becoming a world-renowned, life- saving, pediatric neurosurgeon. He tells of growing up in violent streets in a home with a single, illiterate mother and almost becoming a victim of what he says was his own terrible temper before his mother's lessons and those of God took hold and put him on a path toward a life of helping others and of accomplishment. But tonight, as Carson reaches the top of the GOP field, all of that is being challenged by a dramatic series of reports from CNN which, today, ran numerous segments proclaiming that they spoke with about 10 people from Carson's past who could not disprove Carson's claims but could not corroborate them, either.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We went through the yearbooks. We've called many of his classmates, found his close friends through every period of his life. And the person that he describes in his anecdotes on the campaign trail as leading up to this religious epiphany that he had cannot remember any episodes of violence.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: People interviewed by CNN who knew Carson back then are surprised by that description.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nine friends, classmates and neighbors who grew up with Carson told CNN they have no memory of the anger nor the violence the candidate has described.


KELLY: Dr. Carson is here to respond to these attacks live. But, first, we turn to Trace Gallagher with more on the reporting. Trace?

TRACE GALLAGHER, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Megyn, Dr. Ben Carson says he felt the hand of God during several key moments in his life but never more so than when he was 16 years old and he had just tried to stab a friend in the stomach during an argument over of what music to listen to.  Carson claimed that if not for a belt buckle deflecting the blade, he and his friend's lives would have forever changed. He says he asked God to free him from his destructive personality, or, as he described it, an uncontrolled pathological temper that led him to throw rocks, punch classmates and attack his own mother. Listen.


DR. BEN CARSON, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: My mother was trying to get me to wear something and I didn't want to wear it. Picked up a hammer, hit her in the head with it. Fortunately, my brother caught it from behind. Other than that, I was a pretty good kid.



GALLAGHER: But CNN claims they spoke to nine of Ben Carson's childhood friends, classmates and neighbors and none has any memory of him being an angry young man. Although one former classmate told CNN he did recall hearing something similar to the attempted stabbing but thought it might just be chatter. CNN also says the Carson campaign would not provide details about the history of violence including identities of these Ben Carson hurt and documents of any disciplinary action.

In his 1990 auto-biography, Ben Carson did name names saying he punched a boy named Jerry and tried to stab a boy named Bob. Now he says those names are fictitious and he made them up because if he disclosed real names, the media would invade their lives. But the auto-biography was written decades before his presidential aspirations. And in the book there is no indication that the names had been changed. Carson still maintains that he will not expose their true identities, but he has no problem if those people go public on their own. Carson also said the investigations looking into his past are, quote, "so desperate looking for scandal, they're almost comical" -- Megyn.

KELLY: Trace, thank you.

Joining us now, republican presidential candidate, retired pediatric neurosurgeon and author along with his wife, Candy of "A More Perfect Union" Dr. Ben Carson.

Dr. Carson, thank you so much for being here with us.

CARSON: Pleasure.

KELLY: I know that you've said that this feels like a witch hunt, what's happening over at CNN. But let me ask you flat out whether you standby the claim as a young man as a 14-year-old boy, attempted to stab another boy and attacked your mother with a hammer.

CARSON: Those claims are absolutely true. You know, I am a hundred percent sure that they're true. And this is simply an attempt to smear and to deflect the argument to something else. Something that we've seen many, many times before.

And I never used the true names of people and books, you know, to protect the innocent. You know, that's something that people have done for decades, for centuries. That's something that's commonly done. You know, the person that I tried to stab, you know, I talked to today said, would they want to be revealed? They were not anxious to be revealed. And it was a close relative of mine. And I didn't want to put their lives under the spotlight. This is something that I have to do. None of those people decided that they wanted to do this. And the media is ruthless. So, you know, I would say to the people of America, do you think I'm a pathological liar like CNN does? Or do you think I'm an honest person? And I'm going to leave that up to the American people to make that decision.

KELLY: So just to clarify, you're revealing tonight that the person you attempted to stab, unsuccessfully, something, a story you've told many, many times including in your book, was a close relative in your family.

CARSON: It was a close relative in my family. You know, I really don't want to get into the details of who that person was. But, also, I want to point out how silly the CNN investigation is. Because when I would have flashes of temper, it would only be the people who were directly involved. It wouldn't be something that everybody else would know. And, as far as the episode in junior high is concerned, none of those people that they talked to knew about what was going on at Hunter Junior High School. I mean, that's just silly to think that they would not.

KELLY: They take issue with the fact that in describing the incident where you're trying to attack your own mother. An incident that your brother stepped in to stop. One time you told that story saying you had a hammer. One time you didn't mention a hammer.

CARSON: It's always been a hammer. But also remember, these are things that happened over 50 years ago. And a lot of times reports are what a paper reports or what a broadcast networks --  

KELLY: The details someone chooses to highlight. Understood. The other thing about the CNN report is, they talk to people who knew you who cannot believe you had such a temper because they described you as quiet, nerdy with glasses, skinny and unremarkable. How this suggests that you didn't also have a temper, I know not. How finding nine people to say they have no memory of your temper proves that it didn't exist, I also don't know. And then there was a tenth who said, he remembers a report of you attempting to stab somebody at the time but couldn't clearly recollect it.  Do you feel like this is the beginning Dr. Carson? The beginning of some in the media trying to end your candidacy?

CARSON: Yes, it's a smear campaign. But, you know, I'm not going to play that game with them. They can do it all they want. They're going to go back and try to find anything that I've ever said and try to get me on defensive about it in order to distract away from the things that are important. But, in our country right now, you know, we have divisiveness going on and hatred. We have a fiscal situation that threatens to destroy the future for our children. We have military deterioration when we have enemies who wanted to destroy us.

KELLY: Uh-hm.

CARSON: There's so much going on that we need to be dealing with.  And this is just garbage. And they don't want to talk about it because they don't have good solutions for it.

KELLY: Well, this is one of the things that led you to post a bit on Facebook last night that has gotten a lot of attention. Because some continued to come back to the fact that you are not a career politician and Donald Trump keeps hitting for that saying, you know, he doesn't have the experience. He can't do it. Well, he can't do it the way I would do it.  So you took to Facebook last night to admit that you have no political experience. But you referred us to the founders and said this is -- hold on, I get to that in a second.

And said, the current members of Congress have a combined 8700 years of political experience. Are we sure that's what we want? And then you went onto say, this is it, folks. My candidacy is different. You go onto say I have neither Donald Trump's money nor Jeb Bush's political network.  However, I wouldn't trade a single child I treated for all of Trump's money. While I admire the Bush family's dedication to service, I, too, served nights, weekend, holidays, birthdays and anniversaries with severely injured patients were my public service. This is my life experience."

CARSON: And my life experience is the same experience that millions and millions of Americans have had. And that's the reason that millions of Americans are resonating with what I'm doing. And they recognizing the recklessness of many in the media and the political class who wants to claim that they have all the answers. But all they've done is run us into the ground. It's time for something new and different.

KELLY: Dr. Carson, you finished this piece on Facebook by saying, "I didn't go to embassy cocktail parties or beg lobbyists for money. I spent night after night in a quite sterile room trying to save the life of a small child. That was my life service. This is my life experience. What I have is a lifetime of caring, integrity and honesty." And you stand by that pledge tonight and stand by the statements you've told in the past as a commitment to that assertion of your honesty before this audience.

CARSON: Absolutely. And I know that they will try to come at those things and attack them. Let them go ahead and play their silly games. We have much more important things to do.

KELLY: Dr. Carson, thank you for being here.

CARSON: Thank you, Megyn.

KELLY: All the best.

Breaking tonight, a dramatic development to a stabbing spree on the college campus. As authorities discover a manifesto outlining a frightening motive for murder. We are live with those developments in moments.

Plus, breaking news on President Obama now considering the darkest theory behind the crash of a Russian passenger jet killing hundreds of men women and children. We are joined by a former Muslim jihadist turned CIA double agent on whether ISIS could take down an American aircraft.

And a powerful video of Chris Christie. Maybe the most talked about thing on the web today. More than six million views. Former White House insiders Bill Burton and Marc Thiessen are next as we bring you the video everyone is talking about.


GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE, R-N.J., PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If it's heroin or cocaine or alcohol, we say, well, they decided. They're getting what they deserved. I'm pro-life. And I think that if you're pro-life, that means you've got to be pro-life for the whole life. Not just for the nine months they're in the womb.



KELLY: Governor Chris Christie is taking the Internet by storm today as the video of some comments he made last month racks up more than six million views in less than a week. And this wasn't another face-off between the outspoken New Jersey governor and some town hall heckler. This was -- well, watch it.


CHRISTIE: My mother was a smoker. She smoked her whole life. She was addicted to nicotine. I watched her as a kid growing up. She tried everything she could to quit. She had the gum. The patches. Hypnosis.  She tried everything. She couldn't quit. Now, when she turned 71, a little after that, she was diagnosed with lung cancer. No one came to me and said, don't treat her because she got what she deserved. We know the lung cancer was caused by the smoking. We know it was. But no one came to me and said hey, listen, your mother was dumb. She started smoking when she was 16. Then after we told her, it was bad for her, she kept doing it.  So, we're not going to give her chemotherapy, we're not going to give her radiation, we're not going to give her any of that stuff, you know why?  Because she's getting what she deserves.

No one said that. No one said that about someone who had cancer.  Yet, somehow, if it's heroin or cocaine or alcohol, we say, well, they decided. They're getting what they deserved. I'm pro-life. And I think that if you're pro-life, that means you've got to be pro-life for the whole life. Not just for the nine months they're in the womb. All right? It's easy -- it's easy to be pro-life. For the nine months they're in the womb.  They haven't done anything to disappoint us yet. They're perfect in there.  But when they get out, that's when it gets tough. The 16-year-old teenage girl on the floor of the county lock-up addicted to heroin. I'm pro-life for her, too.

I'll give you a second example. Did any of you went to law school?  Does anybody here is a lawyer too? You can admit it privately if you want later. But the people that you're closest to from law school, there's people who in your first-year study group. One of the guys that was in my study group, I'll give you his profile. You know he came, we went to law school at Seton Hall University. In New Jersey. He came from an Ivy League School to Seton Hall. He was the smartest of all of us. He became an editor of the law review. He was the first one of us who got a job out of school. He got it at a big, prominent law firm in our state. He's making more money than any of the rest of us.

He married an incredibly beautiful woman who's a doctor. They have three gorgeous daughters. One cuter and happier and more talented than the next. He was the first one among us to become a partner at his law firm.  He bought a great house. He had a great car. And, worse yet, he was really good-looking and in perfect shape. The guy used to run 10-12 miles a week, every week. So, we loved him, but we hated him. Because the guy had everything, right? He was running one day in his normal routine. He hurt his back, running. He was in his early 40s and was not giving into age. And he was running his normal time and he hurt his back. And so, he went to the doctor because he was having trouble working, really hurt.

And so, he said, listen, we're going to give you some treatment or whatever. But in the meantime, just to help you through, we're going to give you Percocet. Help numb the pain. Well, about a year later, I get a call from his wife. And she said he's addicted to these painkillers. And he won't listen and I kicked him out of the house. And he's living at his parent's house, and you guys need to go have an intervention with him.  Those friends from law school. You need to go and get him to go to rehab.  So we all went over there. We had an intervention with him. And it started a ten-year odyssey of him being in and out of rehab. During that period of time, she divorced him, he lost his right to see his girls, he lost his license to practice law, he lost his driver's license. He lost his home.

He bought himself a condo and she kicked him out. He lost that. He lost all of the money, spent all the money that he had saved and spent through most of his retirement when a year and a half ago, on a Sunday morning, Mary Pat and I got the call that we've been dreading forever.  That they found him dead in a motel room with an empty bottle of Percocet and an empty quart of vodka. Fifty two years old. But every measure that we define success in this country, this guy had it. Great-looking guy, well-educated, great career, plenty of money. Beautiful, loving wife.  Beautiful children. Great house. He had everything. He's a drug addict.  And he couldn't get help. And he's dead. And when I sat there as the governor of New Jersey at his funeral and looked across the pew at his three daughters sobbing because their dad is gone, there but for the grace of God go I. It can happen to anyone.


KELLY: Very powerful.

Joining me now to discuss it, Marc Thiessen, a Fox News contributor, former chief speechwriter for President George W. Bush. And Bill Burton who's a former Obama White House deputy press secretary. Thank you, guys, so much for being here.


KELLY: Marc, why has that gone so viral and become -- it feels like a new touch tone on this topic.

THIESSEN: Because so many people can relate to it. So many people have been touched by addiction. It touched me because my mother is a medical doctor and she spent 30 years treating heroin addicts in Harlem in the South Bronx, she's actually 80-years-old, and she's still going in three days a week to do it. And so I grew up going to visiting her at work and I met heroin addicts when I was a young kid and played with their kids in the waiting room. And I learned from that experiences. That one, there are people like you and me and, two, addiction is a disease.

And it's a disease that's touched a lot, amazingly, a lot of the presidential field. Ted Cruz lost a sister to addiction. Carly Fiorina lost a stepdaughter to addiction. Jeb Bush's daughter struggled with addiction. And so this is an issue that lots of people can relate to. A 120 people die from overdoses every single day. That's 44,000 a year.  It's overtaken car accidents as the leading cause of death for people 25 to 64. And so, this is something that the right and left can come together to do something about.

KELLY: You know, Bill, just as a matter of communications, you know, both of you guys have been in that business for a living. The story- telling, you know, the personalization of it, just taking you through a one-man story is very effective.

BILL BURTON, FORMER OBAMA WHITE HOUSE DEPUTY PRESS SECRETARY:  Absolutely. And I think that the reason that people find this so compelling is that in a presidential campaign, you get lost in the circuit of, you know, somebody says a stupid comment, somebody gets hit for some stupid, trumped up controversy. But here, you see a candidate being truly authentic and giving off this aura of, you know, this is really who he is and this is something that's important to him. And it's so rare that you see these moments, that I think this one went viral because people crave that from candidates for president of the United States and they got to get some of that from this clip.

KELLY: Uh-hm. And you know, Marc, he talks about how he's in favor of -- the whole life. He's pro-life the whole life. More and more we're hearing this kind of message from Republicans which may surprise a lot of people. Because they're pushing for criminal justice reforms that will not lead to the automatic incarceration of, you know, drug users in the easiest case, if you will.

THIESSEN: Sure. Absolutely. I think that was one of the most powerful messages. He had a message for his own party. Is that we've got to be pro-life for the entire life. Not just the first nine months in the womb. And I think that's a message that's resonating more and more with the Republican base. In New Hampshire, Kelly Ayotte is running on fighting heroin addiction.

KELLY: Look at this poll out in New Hampshire. Look at this poll out in New Hampshire. Look at how important drug abuse is. Where they have a serious heroin problem. Number one issue above jobs and economy, in terms of importance.

THIESSEN: Yes, absolutely. And so she's running on that in New Hampshire. In Ohio, it's a huge problem, as well. Senator Rob Portman has introduced bipartisan legislation to fight addiction and also to get medical help for these folks. And so, this is a bipartisan push.

KELLY: So, Bill, this was a moment for Chris Christie obviously. But there was another moment for him today which was not good. Which is he did not poll high enough to make the primetime debate on FOX Business Network coming up on Tuesday. And neither he nor Governor Huckabee. So, he will be in the so-called under-card stage. He came out today and said, I'll debate as I said any podium, any stage you put me on. How does it all play out?

BURTON: Well, look, I think it's tough for him that he's not on the main stage. But, you know, what you saw today from Chris Christie, I think is the reason that you're still going to see a moment in this race where Christie rises up and, you know, starts to threatens some of the frontrunners. I don't know that he's going to be the nominee, I don't know that he's best-suited for where the party is right now. But I do think that he has something that is very undervalued right now in this race and that's, you know, the ability to tap into this authenticity and this ability to -- you didn't see it here, but you see it in other places where he can speak to the fact that the American people are despondent in a lot of ways about where things stand, especially in the Republican primary voters. He speaks to this notion that the system is rigged. And you need somebody in the White House who can help to rig it for the American people.  I think that he does a good job delivering that message and he just hasn't had the platform to do it just yet.

KELLY: Great to see you both. Thanks for being here.

THIESSEN: Thanks, Megyn.

BURTON: Good to see you, Megyn.

KELLY: And mark your calendars, because the next Republican debate is this Tuesday, November 10th, on the FOX Business Network. Trish Regan, Sandra Smith will start the coverage at 6 p.m. with the undercard.

And then Maria Bartiromo and Neil Cavuto will take over for the second debate at 9 p.m. in prime time.

And don't forget turn into -- tune into -- turn it to and tune into FOX News Channel and our Special Kelly File which will be live at midnight with complete debate analysis. Including those two guys you just saw.

We also have breaking news tonight on that campus stabbing spree after the FBI and the Department of Homeland Security got involved in the investigation. We learned a short time ago about a manifesto.

And up next, see what it tells us about the motive and the rest of what the attacker had planned.

Plus, President Obama now says he is considering the darkest theory behind the crash of a passenger jet that killed hundreds of men, women and children. He's done a reversal on this. We are joined next by a former Muslim jihadist turned CIA double agent on what it means if the Islamic State is behind this.


DAVID CAMERON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: My job is to act on the faces of the intelligence, making the judgment that if it is the case, we can't be sure, if it's the case more likely than not a terrorist bomb on that plane, then my job is to take the right action.  



KELLY: Breaking Tonight, President Obama previously reluctant to use the word "bomb" to describe the Russian passenger jet crash last weekend has now done so. Saying a bomb maybe to blame in a crash that killed hundreds of men, women and children over Egypt. Almost immediately after this jet went down, the Islamic state terror group claimed responsibility. And U.S. Intelligence has confirmed that an interceptive communications between ISIS fighters that suggests the Islamic state is behind what may be the worst terror attack since 9/11.

In a radio interview with the CBS affiliate in Seattle, President Obama today appearing to entertain the theory pushed much more forcefully by Britain's prime minister that a bomb was on board this plane.


PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: I think there is a possibility that there was a bomb on board. And we're taking that very seriously.


KELLY: Joining us now, Morten Storm. A former Muslim turned CIA double agent who infiltrated the world of radical Jihadism. He is co-author of Agent Storm: My Life Inside Al Qaeda and the CIA. Morten, thanks so much for being back with us tonight. So if this was a bomb.


KELLY: What does it tell us and what can we expect next?

STORM: Well, it tells us that ISIS, if it is from ISIS that they are willing -- they have people infiltrating airports, you know, in our world which is very disturbing news for us, because who can you trust anymore.

KELLY: How can they tell whether this was something that was directed at a higher level or whether if it is ISIS, it was a Lone Wolf type of event.

STORM: See, that's very early to say now, but I can tell you from my own personal experience from Yemen when I used to infiltrate AQAP, Al Qaeda and the Arabian Peninsula. They had their own people working at the inside the airport in Sana'a. And they actually have at the checkpoint and the passport control and they have the people who used to handle the luggage. And the same -- don't forget it happened in Great Britain in 2010 with the guy called Rajib Karim. He sent -- encrypt the messages to Anwar al-Awlaki. He was working for British Airways in Heathrow Airport. And he told Anwar al-Awlaki in those encrypt the messages that he knew a guy who loved him, who worked for the baggage handling and he will -- he will be able to do something there like, blow up planes.

KELLY: Does this seem like the work of ISIS to you. Do you think it's sophisticated enough to pull this off?

STORM: Absolutely. We should never underestimate the power of ISIS and al-Qaeda, you know, they have proven so many times before that they are capable of doing things. I mean, we have -- obviously, as for al-Qaeda's point of view, we have many attempts, such as the Abdulmutallab, the Richard Reid, the shoe bomber and you know there was many attempt to blow up airplanes. So it's not a new thing, the 9/11 in U.S.A. in 2001, you know, everything. So do not underestimate these people. They are capable of hitting us any way they want.

KELLY: There's been.

STORM: You know.

KELLY: There's been a lot of criticism of the security as this Egyptian Airport and, you know, the United States, we like to believe -- we like to believe -- that we have a better system. That our TSA agents have a screening process in place, that when they make us wipe down our hands and so on, they're testing for, you know, bomb residue, that that's going to stop a bomb from getting on board a U.S. aircraft. Do you believe -- notwithstanding with what you saw in Yemen, you know, the Yemen Airports are different from what we think from JFK, do you believe it could happen here?

STORM: Yes. Don't forget, you know, we had at least an incident in United Kingdom, years ago with (inaudible) bombers. And that was, you know, homegrown terrorism -- a terrorist plot, you know, to blow up airplanes over the United -- U.S.A. so -- but from U.K. So I'm saying these people can do it, and even though we have strong security in our airports, they are sophisticated enough to -- and we have seen that to create bombs that cannot be detected, so.

KELLY: And so now, if it's not ISIS, you know, even if it is not ISIS, what is the risk in your experience of attempted copycat incidents. You know they get an idea, they claim responsibility for it even if they don't own responsibility for it and then they try to do it themselves.

STORM: Yes, you have many people who want to become martyrs and take the credit for these kinds of things. You know a guy who will sacrifice such as Abdulmutallab who came from a very rich family, who's willing to sacrifice his own life to become a martyr for this cause. You know, Lone Wolves, plenty of them out there, for sure that there will be people again trying to do the same.

KELLY: And if it is proven that this was a bomb on board this aircraft that killed so many Russians. All the experts are saying, Vladimir Putin will retaliate and it will be strong -- Morten, thank you very much for being here with us.

STORM: Thank you very much.

KELLY: All the best.

STORM: Thank you.

KELLY: Also Breaking Tonight, after the FBI and DHS got involved in the investigation, we learned a short while ago, about a frightening manifesto behind a chilling attack at a California College, the manifesto detailing the suspect's plans to go after his fellow classmate. Claudia Cowan reports live tonight from Merced, California with the very latest, Claudia?

CLAUDIA COWAN, MERCED, CALIFORNIA: And Megyn, stunning new details tonight are shedding light on the motive of yesterday's stabbing spree at UC Merced and it basically all comes down to revenge. The Merced County sheriff says that during an autopsy that was performed on the 18-year-old assailant in this case who was a freshman student at UC Merced, medical examiners found a two-page manifesto detailing his plans to get back at classmate who had recently kicked him out of a study group. The manifesto listed the names of 14 other freshman in his class. His plan was to tie them up, lure campus police to the scene, steal their gun and then use it to shoot students. Items found in the assailants backpack included zip tie handcuffs, duct tape, a night vision scope and other items that indicated careful planning and nefarious intent. Before he was shot and killed by campus police, he nearly got away with his twisted plan. He has stabbed one classmate when a contractor working nearby heard the teacher screaming and raced in to help, forcing the assailant to abandon his descriptive attack. Despite being stabbed himself, 31-year-old Byron Price m probably saved that student's life and may have prevented a deadly rampage. While the assailant's actions were praised on Twitter with a group affiliated with ISIS, officials here are ruling out any link to terrorism and their downplaying Islamic references in the manifesto in which the teenager praises Allah. Authority say that's latest case of campus violence is nothing more than ambitious vendetta. The four stabbing victims are recovering from their injuries, Megyn. And classes at UC Merced are scheduled to resume tomorrow.

KELLY: Claudia Cowan, thank you. Well, there are also dramatic new developments tonight in the case of an Illinois cop who reportedly stage his own suicide to try to make it look like a murder. As we hear suggestions, his family may be involved in this whole mess.

Plus, the stunning story of a boy who disappeared 13 years ago, only to turn up as a young man who never knew he was missing.

And then, Brian Kilmeade joins us on the growing outrage after an 8th grade girl gets detention for hugging.


KATHY FISHBOUGH, FISHBOUGH MOTHER: Well, basically, taking away human contact from each other and we're changing our children to where they're not going understand what good touch and bad touch is. It's just plain and simple, no touch.



KELLY: Well, as President Obama promotes his campaign to reform a criminal justice system, Hillary Clinton is following his lead. Last week, Mrs. Clinton was pushing for reforms that would prevent former convicts from having to disclose their criminal histories on employment applications. Or, so she thought. Watch.


HILLARY CLINTON, D-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Earlier today, I announced that as president, I will take steps to ban the box, so former presidents won't have to declare their criminal history at the very start of the hiring process.


CLINTON: That way, they'll have a chance to be seen as more than just someone who's done time.



KELLY: Brian Kilmeade is the co-host of Fox & Friends and co-author of the brand new book, Thomas Jefferson and the Tripoli Pirates. Great to see you, Brian, so she.

BRAIN KILMEADE, "FOX & FRIENDS" CO-HOST: Great to see you, Megyn.

KELLY: She meant to say former prisoners shouldn't have to disclose their criminal histories. What she said was presidents shouldn't have to disclose their criminal histories.

KILMEADE: A couple of things. Number one, we're not talking about Woodrow Wilson or Teddy Roosevelt who did not have a criminal history. You're talking about the only husband that she has, number one. And the only president could say, well, he does bit have a criminal history and he voluntarily (inaudible) himself. But I found most stunning is if you Google me, you'll see a lot of gaps. But what I've prided myself, it is going back and correcting them sometime that day or that week.


KELLY: On Twitter?

KILMEADE: Yeah. You know, you go back and correct (inaudible). She goes onto and it seems just to get worse because she goes on to say that good news is Target and Walmart also promise to ban the box. So Bill does have an option.


KILMEADE: Should he want to get another job in the later years, which my grandfather chose to do in his later years.


KILMEADE: He doesn't want to get of the house.

KELLY: She must just have been mortified when she walked off stage and people said, "You said president. You said president." She said, "What? What?" And even, that (inaudible) left the barn.

OK, in other news, an incredible story today, surfacing with respect to a missing child. He went missing when he was five-years-old and he is been found alive and well. Tell us.

KILMEADE: So they get this, at five-years-old he's living in Alabama. Birmingham, Alabama and he disappears. His dad was taking him to preschool and he's gone. So of course, everyone suspected the dad, but he's gone. He really had no rights to the child. And then the child is gone. Well, he changed his name and turns out he moved over to Ohio. So he's living in Ohio was this 18-year-old kid now. We now know as the Hernandez kid. We don't even know what's called Bobby Hernandez, he's living there and then all of sudden he decides he wants to go to college. So he applies for the college. He has to go see his counselor because every time he writes down his Social Security number, the application gets rejected. The counselor gets curious. He brings it down and runs a background check, goes to local authorities and it turns out, he's on the missing persons lists. And out he's on the missing persons list. And then one thing leads to another, the FBI involved the dad's 53-years-old and he is incarcerated and in a whole lot of trouble where this child goes who was now 18 -- missing when he was five. He's going to go right, trying to reclaim his life.

KELLY: The mother.

KILMEADE: He seems to be unharmed and relatively OK.

KELLY: The mother has been searching for him for 13 years. And now, it's his decision is to whether he wants to see her since he's no longer minor, but you have to imagine, they're going to have a reunion. What an incredible story and what years that father robbed that mother and that son of, in terms of that relationship. Just terrible, but thankfully, he's all right.

OK. We got a whole bunch of kid's stories today because the next one is unbelievable. So this young girl -- how hold is she, this hugger?

KILMEADE: The hugger is in 8th grade.

KELLY: OK, so an 8th grade girl does a quick hug of one of her classmates in school. In fact, I think we have her on tape describing it. Here, she's going to re-enact the hug, for us. Watch, Here it is.





KELLY: That's it. Like that. This is -- just quick, in and out. There she is. And tell the audience what happened to her.

KILMEADE: Well, what happened to her is this she says serial hugger. This is the second time she's been caught hugging. And the reason was -- this is actually before school. And she sees somebody she hasn't seen in awhile. Some say it was a consoling hug as well, judging by the length of the hold from the hug, which we all know is a gentle pat on the back means break up the hug (inaudible) my family. And they -- before school is seen by a supervisor, by one of the teachers, turns it in and she gets suspended. They've actually got a lawyer to get her back and get this thing overturned.

KELLY: They say it's against the PDA rule, Public Display of Affection, even if it's just a quick hug and hand holding is not allowed, either. Locking arms.


KELLY: I mean, I can't -- that's like how girls walk in the hall at school. They lock arms and they walk. What is up?

KILMEADE: Well, if you score a big goal, you're allowed to celebrate. You are not allowed to console with the hug. And the principal is standing strong, saying under -- over affect, too much affection is not a good signal.


KILMEADE: Now, the good news is Megyn, as you know, you and I are dealt with the Irish and Italian heritage.

KELLY: Yeah.

KILMEADE: So for the Irish, they wouldn't be getting suspensions, we barely touch each other. But for the Italians, you might as well home school your Italian kid.


KILMEADE: Because we are very (inaudible). Have you ever seen Napolitano in the hall? He hugs you.


KELLY: He got running away, he has a cold.

KILMEADE: Exactly.

KELLY: He's coming for me. All right.

KILMEADE: He'll be suspended.

KELLY: The last, but certainly not the least. Speaking of great imaginations, although this is a historical book and you do have a great imagination, nonetheless. So, Thomas Jefferson and the Tripoli Pirates approve the case that Islamic radicalism and Jihadism is not new to our country. In fact, we have a long a sort of history with dealing with this.

KILMEADE: I mean, maybe people look back and say the 93 bombing, that's when he first deal (ph) with al-Qaeda, and then he go back to the coal bombing. And they say, what is the problem in 2000 with this -- al- Qaeda, what do they have against us? Where's this come from, and then of course 9/11. So when you go back in history, and I kept here (inaudible), Thomas Jefferson has to deal with this. James Madison (ph) had to deal with this. What do you mean James Madison had to deal with this. So finally, about three, four years ago, I started diving into this with (inaudible) and it turns out the same Islamic extremists. Now the Muslim Islamic extremist attitude had them a brand new country, targeting us because we had no Navy and no protection. They were taking our guys hostage, 700 in all. Took 35 ships and the only way to get them back is to pay for it or convert to Islam because we were, of course, infidels for doing that. And to see Thomas Jefferson think about this the way Barack Obama and President Bush had to think about this. I thought this could be a good story to bring up because, what worked ultimately was to build a strong Navy and not to just to show it, but to use it. And if the history leads clues to the future, maybe we -- I want to consider that.

KELLY: It's fascinating to think, you know, we have Thomas Jefferson's example on how to deal with this very problem that is so prevalent in our country and our world in today's day of age. All right, so Brian Kilmeade, Thomas Jefferson and the Tripoli Pirates, and it's has very pretty color, very nicely done. Congratulations on the book's success, it's already number four, number, (inaudible). Well done, my friend.

KILMEADE: All right, thank you very much, Megyn.

KELLY: Yeah.

KILMEADE: See you.

KELLY: Coming up next, dramatic new developments in the case of an Illinois police officer who reportedly staged his own suicide to look like a murder. A new report he may have ordered a hit on someone. This is getting more and more bizarre, next.


KELLY: Well, there are dramatic new developments tonight, in a case of an Illinois cop who reportedly went to (inaudible) to make his suicide look like a murder. Touching of a massive manhunt and getting national attention. Now we are hearing this guy was suspected of embezzling money and may have even ordered a hit on the investigator looking into the case against him. Trace Gallagher has more from our west coast newsroom tonight. Trace.

TRACE GALLAGHER, LOS ANGELES: Megyn, months before staging his own suicide, investigators believe Lieutenant Charles Gliniewicz was afraid of police administrator who was auditing the books who was about to discover that he have been embezzling money for years. So Gliniewicz tried to hire a hit man to kill her. Police say last April, Gliniewicz would sent a text message to a woman asking for help arranging a meeting with a high ranking motorcycle gang member who, in turn, would arrange the contract hit on administrator Anne Marrin. That gang member denies the allegation, but Anne Marrin, who did eventually expose the embezzlement scheme, spoke about the alleged hit. Listen.


ANNE MARRIN, FOX LAKE VILLAGE ADMINISTRATOR: It's very unsettling. Again, you know, my concern is my family. It's quite unbelievable and almost surreal, I would say.


GALLAGHER: And apparently, the plot was even thicker because after his death, investigators found cocaine in Charles Gliniewicz's desk and they found deleted text messages, mentioning the possibility of planting something on administrator Anne Marrin. It's unclear if that's why he had the cocaine. Fox News has also learned that Gliniewicz's wife and son are being investigated for their involvement in the embezzlement. Police say they have more text messages proving that others, including family members, knew the money was being stolen. Megyn?

KELLY: Trace, thank you. We'll be right back.


KELLY: We have been discussing on Twitter the weirdness of some media trying to prove that a presidential candidate did not stab someone as a youth, while the candidate maintains that he did. It's of course relevant because Dr. Carson says that was the beginning of a real turn around for him and the beginning of redemption. Go to, on Twitter @megynkelly with your thoughts. Have a great night.

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