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The Five

Does signing GOP loyalty pledge help or hurt Trump?

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," September 3, 2015. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Greg Gutfeld along with Jedediah Bila, Geraldo, Eric Bolling and Ainsley Earhardt. This is "The Five."

He signed on the line and finally all was fine.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The best way for the Republicans to win is if I win the nomination and go directly against whoever they happen to put up. And for that reason, I have signed the pledge.

(APPLAUSE)

TRUMP: So I will be totally pledging my allegiance to the Republican Party and the conservative principles for which it stands.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUTFELD: Hooray. The pledge means endorsing the Republican nominee and bars a third party run. It's like mommy and daddy finally making up and all the shouting stops. For now.

The good news: The pledge forces everyone, Donald included, to take the campaign seriously. He has to be less pundit, and sadly, more political.  He can't just keep saying China until his face explodes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)

TRUMP: Let's say China.

China.

China.

China.

China.

China.

China.

I'm not angry at China.

I want to take our money back from China. And China's going to like us.

Look at China.

And by the way, not just China.

China.

China.

China.

China all the time.

(END VIDEO CLIPS)

GUTFELD: Yes. The bad news: he just sold out to the evil RHINOs. The outsider has now hopped inside.

Now obviously, the pledge is not a legally binding document. It's one step above a blood oath in a tree house made by two kids in knee socks. And we all know Donald only signs deals with escape hatches. A big fan of the prenup, his success is in maintaining a plausible way out.

And here it is, in the Washington Post. "Trump's priority is to be treated with respect by the national GOP. If that relationship should ever sour, he could consider changing his mind."

Now, that does not sound like in sickness or in health.

But as we ponder Trump going third party, why not second? After all, Trump could rule as a Dem, a party that's all pantsuit, no cattle. Trump's for higher taxes, a trade war, defends Planned Parenthood and single payer. Talk about a persuasive candidate. He's turned millions of righties into lefties.

So while I'm glad he signed the pledge, pledges are meant to be broken. Remember, no new taxes lasted as long as a fruit fly's puberty.

In sum, the only good pledge is the kind that polishing your wood or the one that fetches your beer at a kegger.

(LAUGHTER)

GUTFELD: All right. Got.

GERALDO RIVERA, "GERALDO RIVERA REPORTS" HOST: I got the last one. I just got it like the freshman's pledging.

(CROSSTALK)

AINSLEY EARHARDT, "FOX & FRIENDS FIRST" CO-HOST: And the other one, the pledge you spray on your furniture.

RIVERA: Well that I got.

GUTFELD: I got to credit Ben Crow (ph) have foe for the China montage, which was beautiful. Eric, what do you make of the pledge, positive development push?

ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: I'm baffled that he -- I mean, the really push -- the upside that Donald Trump was gaining was that he wasn't the establishment.

GUTFELD: Right.

BOLLING: He was part of the -- not part of the D.C. elite. There must be something in it. Now, I know he said came right out of the box and said, "I didn't get anything for it." One of the things he does get is that he -- I guess now that he has -- he will have to be on the South Carolina ballot.

GUTFELD: Right.

EARHARDT: Yeah.

BOLLING: Which they could have held back from him. But for me, Donald Trump wouldn't have needed that. For some reason, it just felt weird. I think there's more. I don't know what it is. It's either going to be, you know e- mail lists are very important.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

BOLLING: They're worth a lot of money, and may not have been a financial number, but in the e-mail list is huge. Infrastructure, maybe he'll get infrastructure in states that he doesn't have infrastructure. But Donald doesn't do anything without getting something in return. That's why I'm not sure I buy into him saying, there's nothing in it for me. There's always got to be something in it for him, in my opinion.

GUTFELD: It's a good point because he is sacrificing kind of the outsider status. By the way, you are commenting for two, today.

(LAUGHTER)

GUTFELD: Do you think he's going to stick with this?

EARHARDT: You know, I'm -- I like you, I'm shocked that he actually did this. But I think what he's getting in return is the fact that he's getting loyalty from the voters. He's showing that he's loyal to the Republican Party.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

EARHARDT: I think that Reince Priebus, his objective is to say, "We need a republican in the White House, doesn't matter who it is. I'd prefer this person or that person maybe, but we need a republican instead of a democrat." So that was his goal. I think Donald's goal here is to say, "I'm gonna be true to this party, this party that I'm representing, and I'm going to show the voters out there that I am loyal, I'm going to do the right thing." And I'm shocked because this is different than what he pledged in that first debate.

GUTFELD: Right. You talked to D.T. earlier.

RIVERA: 45 minutes yesterday, he only gave Reince Priebus, the RNC chair, 15 minutes today.

(CROSSTALK)

RIVERA: At least three times more. So this is a deal that helps Reince Priebus because he is the desperate one, he is the one fearful, that an independent run by Donald Trump would really torpedo the Republican Party. Maybe, make it obsolete in future years. But I'll tell you what is at play here, I have no doubt that Donald Trump signs this because Donald Trump is sure now, that he is going to be the nominee. As I said here, a couple of weeks ago, he's going to be the nominee. Why not throw this bone to the established party? I think the reasons that Eric lists, the pragmatic reasons, the state primary listing and so forth, the list and all that kind of infrastructure stuff, are true, but I think basically, what you're seeing here is a very confident candidate who wishes the election was yesterday. And he has nothing to lose because he knows he's going to be the republican nominee.

GUTFELD: He's not the only one who wishes it were yesterday. Jedediah, do you think it was a good move? I know you're not a fan of pledges.

JEDEDIAH BILA, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: I'm not. I wouldn't have signed it if I was running for president, just because I wouldn't want The RNC dictating to me what I can and can't do. And I think the people -- I think the people who really love Donald Trump, are gonna vote for Donald Trump whether he sign the pledge or not. But if he was going to be loyal to his real core constituency, those people that are really passionate about him, I think those people would have loved for him to tell the RNC to take a walk and say look, I'm loyal to my own principles, I'm loyal to or myself. I'm not necessarily loyal to the RNC. It depends on what the RNC does. Are you gonna back the government republicans? If I don't win, the candidate who comes up front center, are gonna be a big government republican? It could be Pataki? I don't know if I want to support that guy. I think that when I was looking on Twitter last night and seen the feedback, I tweeted out that I would not have signed that pledge, and I got a whole wave of people saying, absolutely, he shouldn't do it. With that being said, though, I think the people who love him, there's nowhere else for them to go. They don't love anybody else, so they're going to back him no matter what.

BOLLING: Two quick thoughts. So he comes to the podium and he says, "I've signed this." and he holds up the paper. It's kind of like, you know, a little bit of clapping to your point, that no matter what Donald Trump.

BILA: Yeah.

BOLLING: Does his hard core supporters are going to support him? Had he walked up to that and said ripped in half.

GUTFELD: Yeah. That would have been news.

BOLLING: It would have been news.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

BILA: Yeah.

BOLLING: It would have been all over the place. His supporters would have been crazy. They will go nuts for him. But did you notice that shot? Producers, can you put that shot up again? Look at that shot. Look at the background on that shot. That is.

EARHARDT: Millenials.

BOLLING: It's millennials. It's young people. It's minorities.

RIVERA: Oh, you don't think that's by a random crowd.

BOLLING: I know.

(LAUGHTER)

RIVERA: You don't think they just be.

BOLLING: That's my.

RIVERA: Behind it.

BOLLING: Geraldo, that's my point. It wasn't.

RIVERA: That's central casting.

BOLLING: I -- that's my point. That's what he's going for right now.

RIVERA: I get it.

BOLLING: He's going for the bigger picture, the bigger republican.

GUTFELD: That's what President Obama.

BOLLING: Background.

GUTFELD: By putting doctors behind, you know.

BOLLING: No, no. And I guess that's why I do.

BILA: That's true.

BOLLING: But in the past, he never did that before. How many times have we interviewed Donald Trump at his place over there? It was whoever showed up, and it would -- I'll be perfectly honest with you, the crowd didn't look like.

EARHARDT: Isn't interesting.

BOLLING: That when it's random.

EARHARDT: How many young people he has supporting him.

BOLLING: Yeah.

EARHARDT: And if you go on his social media sites, he has the ability to just swipe a few numbers or letters and he can tweet something out, and millions of people see it. He doesn't even need to have negative campaign ads because he can just tweet. If Jeb Bush says something he doesn't like, he just tweets it and millions of people see it. It's unbelievable. And do you remember the Fox poll -- this was months ago, someone went out in Times Square and they asked, who is -- who's going to win? And every single person, except 2 percent of the people polled, did not know who Donald Trump was. All the other candidates, some of them were coming in at like 50 percent. People didn't know who they were.

BILA: Yeah.

EARHARDT: Because he has.

GUTFELD: It helps to have a TV show on.

EARHARDT: Absolutely.

GUTFELD: For eight or nine years.

EARHARDT: Absolutely.

GUTFELD: OK, let's see what.

RIVERA: No time like primetime.

GUTFELD: Yeah, exactly.

BILA: That's true.

EARHARDT: Right.

GUTFELD: Here are the other candidates what they were saying about signing a pledge.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE, R-N.J.,  PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If you run, you can't be a sole looser and then run as an independent, if you don't win the nomination. So I have no problem with it. I obviously will sign the pledge.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Will you sign it?

RAND PAUL, 2016 GOP PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Yes. And the thing is I signed a pledge when I ran for the U.S. Senate. Because they asked me would I drop out and run as a third party or would I support the nominee. And I do believe you have to support the nominee.

JEB BUSH, 2016 GOP PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Yeah, I would, of course. Of course, I would. We need to be unified. We need to win.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUTFELD: Is that good? Thoughts?

RIVERA: I've seen Jeb Bush -- Governor Bush, having to swallow his pride and say that, knowing the surveys all show Trump with three times his polling support, must have really irked the former Florida governor.

BOLLING: But they can also back out too, right?

GUTFELD: Yeah, everybody can.

EARHARDT: Yeah.

BOLLING: Your point to the.

GUTFELD: Yes.

BOLLING: Pledges being with.

RIVERA: But look at the news they got.

BOLLING: Are worth the paper they're written.

RIVERA: They dominated -- we led the show with this fake event.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

BILA: Yeah.

RIVERA: I mean, really, this was a made for TV event.

GUTFELD: It really was.

RIVERA: This is those other guys didn't have a press conference when they signed the pledge.

BILA: Yeah.

EARHARDT: That's true.

GUTFELD: Whacko.

RIVERA: Pledge.

EARHARDT: It's kind of hold like this...

RIVERA: Chris Christie looked through his papers and oh, yeah, I sounded like four months.

EARHARDT: Yeah, this.

GUTFELD: This was done at Kinko's.

EARHARDT: This is what it is -- exactly.

(LAUGHTER)

GUTFELD: Why was the date off?

EARHARDT: Exactly.

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: Can we talk about what this really is? Not this piece with pledge written on it. You know what this is, this is fear. This is the RNC.

RIVERA: I agree.

BILA: Absolutely.

BOLLING: Fearful of Donald Trump.

RIVERA: I agree.

BOLLING: That's why this paper was printed.

EARHARDT: Yeah, you're right now.

BOLLING: That's why we're talking about it.

RIVERA: Don't you love.

BOLLING: Nothing else other than.

RIVERA: Don't you love Trump?

BOLLING: A pledge has to do with, making sure Donald Trump doesn't up end the ship.

RIVERA: But he takes on -- he takes -- I pledge allegiance to the flag.

BILA: Yeah.

EARHARDT: Yeah.

RIVERA: I pledge allegiance to the -- that's what having no prompter does.

GUTFELD: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: Does it seem sarcastic?

RIVERA: I hope so.

GUTFELD: Yes.

(LAUGHTER)

GUTFELD: Can I roll? Probably, the most powerful part of this press conference was when he addressed the other candidate in the room.

BILA: Kanye West?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Kanye West. You know what, I'll never say bad about him. You know why? Because he loves Trump. He loves Trump. He goes around saying, "Trump is my all-time hero." He says it to everybody. So Kanye West, I love him. Now maybe in a few years I'll have to run against him, I don't know. So I'll take that back.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUTFELD: You know what? The funny thing about Trump -- and this is what makes him honest. He likes you, as long as you like him.

BILA: Yes.

GUTFELD: So he goes, "You know I like the guy because he says nice things about me." That is the heart of every human being, but they will never admit it.

BILA: That's true.

EARHARDT: Right.

BILA: If you ever watch him on Twitter, he's always praising everyone's performance, "Great job on TV, it's fantastic." And then you go and watch the segment, it's because that person was saying Donald Trump is the best.

(LAUGHTER)

BILA: He's the guy to lead the nation. So yeah, but you know what, you're right. He's tapping into something that's very basic and very human. We all do it.

GUTFELD: Our ego.

BILA: Yes. It's true. Only he's not afraid to put it front and center.

EARHARDT: You know I like to?

BILA: He's not afraid to say look, this is part of human nature, and the guy likes me and I then I will. You know what, that's cool. I like him too.

GUTFELD: But it's the moment he says something bad, it's over.

BILA: Kanye. No more Kanye West.

GUTFELD: Yes.

RIVERA: Isn't the real question whether or not that tactic has mitigated or reduced -- minimized criticism?

GUTFELD: Absolutely.

RIVERA: That he scared away the critics by that tactic. If you like me, I love you. If you don't like me, slam.

GUTFELD: It's a nice blanket.

EARHARDT: Right.

GUTFELD: It's a blanket.

BILA: But look what happens to the presidential candidates that criticize him strongly.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

BILA: Their numbers just seem to sink. Whereas, the ones that seem to back him, seems to rise.

RIVERA: Because people see him as like the king of the fraternity.

BILA: Right.

RIVERA: You want to be in the fraternity, then you know, you like, you like Donald Trump. You want to be an outsider? Then you don't like him.

GUTFELD: They're his pledges.

EARHARDT: You know what I like about him? I like that he answers so many questions, and he.

RIVERA: Yeah, he does.

EARHARDT: He's asking -- answering questions about Kanye West. He was answering questions. Someone asked if his daughter or his kids were going to be part of the administration. He said, probably not, but maybe. They're you know.

BILA: Yeah.

EARHARDT: Smart individuals. I thought -- I think he just has an open dialogue and.

GUTFELD: Here's an interesting thing, though, that you got the Monmouth Poll? Is that good? Is I said it correctly?

BILA: Yeah.

EARHARDT: Monmouth.

GUTFELD: Why do all these polls come from weird-sounding places like Quinnipiac?

EARHARDT: Quinnipiac.

GUTFELD: You know -- why can't it be called Johnson?

BILA: They're trying to sound.

RIVERA: Those Quinnipiac monitors.

GUTFELD: Don't make a joke, all right.

RIVERA: Good small colleges.

GUTFELD: Trump dominating at 30 percent.

BILA: Right.

GUTFELD: All other candidates are way far behind. And he beat everybody, but there's one weird standout and it's Ben Carson.

EARHARDT: Yeah.

GUTFELD: If he's head-to-head with Ben Carson, Carson creams him at 55-36. That's the one matchup.

BILA: Yes.

GUTFELD: That's different. Why?

BILA: Both outsiders.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

BILA: And what's stunning about it is their delivery is polar opposite. Ben Carson is so soft spoken.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

BILA: And has this very stoic demeanor. And he's -- you know, he's not combative.

RIVERA: I have a different take, totally.

BILA: But he's also a regular guy. He's a doctor. He comes from outside the political sphere.

RIVERA: I'm reminded of David Dinkins, the first black mayor of New York City, who -- when people were polled was killing Rudy Giuliani in their second matchup. And then when Election Day came, it would came, obviously, Giuliani beat Dinkins. I think a lot of republicans polled by Monmouth are giving the politically correct answer. And I really -- I hate to say that Dr. Ben Carson is.

(CROSSTALK)

RIVERA: I think it's all about being the black neurosurgeon, brilliant guy, the.

GUTFELD: You feel that way about Obama? People voted for Obama because he was black?

RIVERA: Black -- Obama was the least black guy you could possibly have.

EARHARDT: See, I haven't heard anyone talk about his race. I've just heard people say, he's very smart. They like him because he's anti-establishment. He is different from someone that we've had before. I haven't heard anyone talked about race, have you?

BILA: I haven't

EARHARDT: During parties?

BILA: No.

EARHARDT: Among.

RIVERA: Well, because he is so soft spoken, then why do you think he is getting 18 percent.

EARHARDT: Because he's more like.

RIVERA: Three times more than the others?

EARHARDT: Because -- I'll tell you. Because he's more like the other candidates, so if you're originally going to vote for Jeb Bush or Ted Cruz or any of the other candidates, and they're not in the race anymore and now it's between Carson and Trump, they're going to vote for Carson because he's more like the others. Does that make sense?

RIVERA: More likable maybe?

EARHARDT: Maybe does.

BILA: He is very likable.

EARHARDT: Maybe does.

GUTFELD: And if he becomes president, you don't need to have a presidential doctor because.

RIVERA: Or a brain surgeon.

GUTFELD: He's a doctor. Yeah.

RIVERA: What is this, a brain surgery?

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: It cuts one job right there. All right, I guess we got to move on.

Ahead, the guy who set up Hillary Clinton's private e-mail server will be spilling everything to Congress next week. J.K., he's pleading the fifth, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BOLLING: Lawmakers want to know what he knows about Hillary Clinton's private e-mail server, but Bryan Pagliano will be dodging questions next week at a House hearing. A former State Department aide, who set up Clinton's server, is going to plead the fifth to avoid incriminating himself, a silent admission of guilt? Chuck Todd thinks so.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHUCK TODD, MEET THE PRESS SHOW HOST: In the court of public opinion, when you plead the fifth, as far as the political world is concerned, then you're already admitting to some potential wrong doing, regardless of the legal part of this. And this is what makes this investigation so potentially damaging to Hillary Clinton.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLLING: Another one of Clinton's aides is also evading questions. Someone get her press secretary Brian Fallon, a dictionary, quick.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN FALLON, HILLARY FOR AMERICA PRESS SECY: The Justice Department, in addition to having the electronic form of the PDFs that was provided to the State Department, they also now have the server. So I don't know what the FBI is going to do with it, but they very well may seek to.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: The wiped server.

FALLON: Perform any type of operation on it, and if they do.

KEILAR: The wiped server.

FALLON: That would be.

KEILAR: Right, Brian?

FALLON: If -- I don't know what wiped means.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLLING: Oh, OK, counselor, what in the world -- why would Mr. Pagliano plead the fifth, if he wasn't either trying to protect himself or Hillary Clinton?

RIVERA: Well, I think that -- remember where he is going to give this testimony, in a very, very highly charged partisan environment, with the democrats on the panel are sympathetic to his decision to invoke the fifth. I have two words to describe what Brian Pagliano is doing. Lois Lerner. Remember when the embattled IRS chief, they're in the midst of the scandal, invoked the Fifth Amendment? Everyone said, "She's guilty. She's gonna go to jail. It's only a question of time." Where is Lois Lerner now? She was allowed to retire. She has her pension. She's still a lawyer, never any criminal investigation. She's been held in contempt of Congress. Who cares, so as Eric Holder. Are the republicans in Congress? I think that it's a -- I have said and I firmly believe, the scandal is a big waste of time.

BOLLING: I don't -- I would vehemently disagree with that. But is he -- Pagliano, protecting himself or protecting Hillary?

GUTFELD: He's probably going to protect himself until -- and then he'll be thrown under the bus. Every single person in this scandal will be thrown under the bus before they finally get to Hillary, because Hillary, be hiding in the bus.

RIVERA: She's testifying.

GUTFELD: But the point is, what if -- they keep talking about how this is the drip, drip, drip scandal, but the drips aren't the e-mails. It's the e- mailers. The drips are Hillary, are Huma, and sit in an incompetent class of careless cronies, who basically put our security at risk. Even Snowden, who I am critical of, Snowden came out and said that what Hillary did, put this country in severe vulnerability.

BILA: That's a big.

RIVERA: So now you're quoting Snowden as your authority?

GUTFELD: I know was that mean. I am a hypocrite.

(LAUGHTER)

GUTFELD: I am a hypocrite.

RIVERA: You really hate Hillary.

(LAUGHTER)

BOLLING: So before we get.

(LAUGHTER)

BOLLING: At Snowden -- Jed, is failure to report a leak that is classified is in itself, illegal?

BILA: Yeah, of course.

BOLLING: Maybe.

BILA: I mean, she's a disgrace, look, and the consequence for Lois Lerner is that many people in the country thought she did a horrific disgrace for human being, that wasn't transparent. Maybe that.

GUTFELD: Maybe republicans.

BILA: Maybe that worked out for her.

GUTFELD: Well, I felt -- I feel that way.

BILA: She kept her pension and what not. But the difference is Hillary Clinton is trying to win the presidency here.

RIVERA: She will be (inaudible).

BILA: So what you don't want is you don't want someone now, coming out and saying, "I plead the fifth" which shows a lack of transparency, reflected on a woman who's already hasn't been transparent. She didn't want to hand over the server. She hands over the server, it's wiped clean.

RIVERA: Transparency by avoiding the inconvenient truth that Hillary Clinton urged this person to testify?

BILA: She should -- absolutely.

RIVERA: And Hillary Clinton, will herself be testifying?

BILA: You know what? She should be begging him to testify.

RIVERA: She -- I'm sure.

BILA: She absolutely should.

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: There's an old saying, if you have nothing to hide, then don't hide.

EARHARDT: Yeah, exactly. It's like why doesn't he want to talk? Why doesn't he just say there's nothing to hide.

RIVERA: I think.

EARHARDT: What are you gonna say? He's.

RIVERA: I -- here's why. So he's being testified -- he's being questioned by Trey Gowdy, a former D.A.

EARHARDT: Right.

RIVERA: From South Carolina. So Gowdy asks him, "Give you an example. Are you talking about the e-mails and everything?"

EARHARDT: Yeah.

RIVERA: He says, "Have you ever hired an undocumented immigrant?" No. Then they -- you now have lied -- I'm making this up. Now you've lied to a federal official. And that is the crime that they always go down on. It's not the.

BILA: To make -- still lie?

RIVERA: What they're lying about. It is the perjury is you cannot lie.

BILA: So don't lie.

RIVERA: To a federal official.

EARHARDT: Here's the thing.

BILA: So don't lie.

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: Geraldo, first of all, you can lie under oath at a congressional hearing. And you can change your testimony afterwards. So he could lie if he wanted to.

RIVERA: If they do.

BOLLING: And they do all to Congress.

RIVERA: If there was a criminal investigation, what you do is you give him immunity. He's not the target. You don't care about Bryan Pagliano, you care about Hillary Clinton.

BOLLING: That's your thought.

RIVERA: But there is no criminal investigation. So they can't give him privilege from, you know.

BOLLING: They can still -- they can still alter that.

RIVERA: They can give them immunity.

BILA: It's not gonna matter.

(CROSSTALK)

EARHARDT: She jeopardized national security. So if you want to go to the polls and you want to vote for a president, that has jeopardized national security, you have individuals who have died as a result of Benghazi. This is serious. This is not about e-mails and servers and her gmail account or whatever account it is. These are people's lives. This is our country that we love, that our forefathers or our grandparents fought in World War II, to protect this country. It's serious. So voters get to decide.

BOLLING: And stay right there.

EARHARDT: OK.

BOLLING: Because this is important. Let's not forget legal for a minute. Let's talk about Hillary -- Hillary Clinton's character. The State Department aide who worked for Hillary Clinton, helped set up and maintain her server, but back in March, Clinton told us the server she used was set up by her husband Bill's office. So which is it, madam secretary? Which one?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The system we used was set up for President Clinton's office and it had numerous safeguards. It was on property guarded by the secret service and there were no security breaches. So I think that the use of that server, which started with my husband, certainly, proved to be effective and secure.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLLING: So no matter what the legality of it is, she broke the law. She didn't break the law. Clearly, her story keeps changing. It was Bill's office that set it up.

EARHARDT: Right, right.

BOLLING: And there's Pagliano who set it up.

EARHARDT: And no one pleased her. This is saying.

BOLLING: Eventually, the voters have got to see she's lying about something.

EARHARDT: No one believes her. First of all, did you see how she read that script? It's like, um, my, um, husband is, um -- I mean, she this is all scripted for her. And she used to say what months ago she said that her husband -- she didn't want to release all these e-mails because she had been e-mailing with her husband. Then he comes out and says, "I've only sent two e-mails in my life." She's lying repeatedly.

BILA: She's lying.

EARHARDT: Repeatedly.

GUTFELD: Maybe to help their marriage, they're trying to do more things together, like abusing servers.

RIVERA: I think the character just aims -- you know, I love you beyond the beyond. But to say that she threatened the national security of the nations is to reach a conclusion, that you don't have a factual basis. Nobody does because we have no idea. And what -- maybe it was my bra is too tight or my socks are dirty.

(CROSSTALK)

BILA: What should they've been communication on private person, anyway.

EARHARDT: Geraldo, the investigators have proven 57 of the threads were born classified. And what that means is it was foreign government -- it was foreign information and 57 of these e-mails, that in and of itself is classified information.

RIVERA: If have you or anyone that you know.

EARHARDT: She should know that.

RIVERA: Seen one e-mail that imperils.

BILA: Does not.

RIVERA: The security of the nation or anyone?

EARHARDT: No because.

BILA: Does not.

EARHARDT: Start releasing these e-mails.

(CROSSTALK)

RIVERA: Going back to what Greg said about the drip, drip, drip.

BILA: It doesn't matter.

RIVERA: That is the brilliance of this scandal. It will result in nothing, but getting to that journey.

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: Because you know what?

RIVERA: Will wear her character down.

(CROSSTALK)

RIVERA: People say, she'll be like an ice -- an ice sculpture who melts.

BOLLING: That's liberal.

RIVERA: By the time.

BOLLING: My friend.

RIVERA: There's nothing there.

BOLLING: My good liberal friend.

(LAUGHTER)

BOLLING: Who claims to be a republican, are cutting her slack when she says Bill Clinton's office set it up and then Pagliano set it up. We don't know.

(CROSSTALK)

RIVERA: When I'm a member of the Trump administration, I'll see if I can get you a job.

EARHARDT: Democrat that (inaudible).

RIVERA: As secretary.

EARHARDT: Geraldo, you say that she did nothing wrong.

RIVERA: I can say that no one has shown me any evidence of wrong doing.

BILA: Well maybe it's in those e-mails that she decided she wasn't going to hand over.

RIVERA: What I'm doing.

BOLLING: I'm getting nailed at.

(CROSSTALK)

BILA: When we find that out. Why did she destroy the server?

BOLLING: We've got to go. We need police to keep us safe, but many officers don't feel safe themselves, anymore. And police departments are actually having a hard time finding recruits. We're going to talk about that next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

EARHARDT: Welcome back to "The Five." Thanks for joining us.

Police departments all across America are now struggling to recruit new officers after a string of cop killings. Many officers already on the job, they're scared to do their jobs anymore. Here's Sheriff Mike Lewis from Maryland.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHERIFF MIKE LEWIS, WICOMICO COUNTY, MARYLAND: You bet it's open season on law enforcement across this country. American law enforcement right now are under siege. We recognize it. We see it everywhere we go. And you can rest assured, as you well know, this all started on the false lie, this premise down in Ferguson, Missouri, "hands up, don't shoot. Black lives natter." All based on a lie. We all know it's a lie.

Everybody's scared to death to do their job, scared to pull the trigger.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

EARHARDT: One retired Marine is condemning Black Lives Matter demonstrators for their anti-police rhetoric. He says they're only creating more racism and division.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL WHALEY, RETIRED MARINE: The Black Lives Matter movement, they only protest when a white officer kills a black person. This racism has -- that's going to have to stop. Because black people, white people, we're not enemies. Look at Martin Luther King. Would Martin Luther King want people to riot in Ferguson? No, he would not. Would Martin Luther King want people to riot in Baltimore? No. Martin Luther King had a dream.  Now it's time for us to turn that dream into a reality.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

EARHARDT: All right. So let's discuss this.

Eric, you look at recruitment numbers, and they're down now. Officers, they're just not signing up for the job anymore. Low pay. They're also -- it's hard to become an officer. The application process is difficult.

But also, if you look at, like, Philadelphia back in 2008, there were 357 new recruits in that year. And just last year half of that, 190. New York is seeing numbers drop. L.A.'s seeing numbers drop. Why is that? Is it a direct result?

BOLLING: I think it's all -- everything we outline right there. The Black Lives [SIC] movement is disrespectful to law enforcement. Mayors, liberal mayors around the country are disrespectful to law enforcement. De Blasio telling his son of color to worry about how he confronts the NYPD.

On the bigger -- on the grander scale, President Obama has ample opportunity to come out and say, "Enough is enough." There's cops being killed in Houston. There's cops being killed in Fox Lake, Illinois, where they haven't had a homicide in five or six years, cops being shot.

The respect for law enforcement is plummeting. And the leaders we turn to, the mayors, the president, are nowhere to be found. Backing, they should be backing these people. They are the most important frontline to keeping law and order in America. Military, cops and fire should all be respected, not disrespected.

BILA: And then you have the role that some in media play, which is that this stuff plays out. And these guys are -- guys and women are criminalized before we even know the facts. So if they're attacked, you know, they have to worry, "OK, I'm being attacked because I'm in uniform.  I may lose my life. Then if I've done nothing wrong and manage to survive that, the media is going to make me into a criminal before they even have any of the facts."

So even if you're in the right, even if you've done nothing wrong, your whole life is potentially ruined, and you have to pick up the pieces.

And then you have, you're right, De Blasio and the administration. Where's President Obama coming out and showing some support for law enforcement?

I think law enforcement officials have a really tough job. They go into really difficult communities, and those are the communities that are going to suffer without them. And when they feel that they are -- have an administration above them that doesn't support them, that will selectively come out and talk about Trayvon Martin or talk about Michael Brown but not give a little praise to the people out there protecting people in very difficult communities, risking their lives every single day, I think that's a big part of the problem.

EARHARDT: Yes, I'm glad you bring that up. Because Sheriff Mike Lewis who we just heard from, he also says the president does not have the cops' backs. And he thinks that's the problem. Condemning the death of Trayvon Martin, condemning the death of Michael Brown, not standing up to denounce the killings of these cops. Do you think the president needs to do more?

GUTFELD: I think so. But I think that this is actually not a recent phenomenon. I think this is a direct result of a combination of a campaign of academics, media and activists who've for decades tried to segregate the police from the communities that they protect and serve.

Because once you unravel law enforcement from a radical point of view, whether it's Occupy Wall Street or Black Lives Matter, once you unravel law enforcement, then society itself becomes vulnerable to chaos and to dis- rule. And then you have revolution.

It's on us, though. Not just -- not just the media that's at fault. Us as citizens. Because where are we? I mean, we don't go out there and march when a cop is shot. We don't go out there. So we're the hypocrites, too.  Because we sit there and go, "Dammit, why isn't anybody supporting the police?" We only do this on the show. You've got to go out there.

RIVERA: I -- I don't disagree with anyone at the table in any of these points. But I think you're missing the big picture. What is the big picture?

There are two ethics. One is the salary stinks for the job; and all these regulations and all the scrutiny and all of the politics involved. You know, you start at 25, 30,000 a year in New York. Are you kidding me? So where are you going to live, first of all. You have to live upstate. You have to live out on the Island. If you're in Los Angeles, you've got to live way in the -- you know, the inland empire to be able to afford that kind of salary.

And secondly, why don't you have enough Latino or black cops in cities where that is, you know, appropriate or called for because of the makeup, the demographic makeup.

GUTFELD: New York does a great job. New York has done a great job.

RIVERA: But even here. Because the stringent regulations that you mentioned, that Ainsley mentioned, you can't have a criminal record. You can't have a -- you know, you need a high school diploma or more in many jurisdictions.

I think there are pragmatic reasons also. I don't in any way minimize some of these political things. And the president could have extolled the virtue. And I think that that's what we do. You don't get paid much to be a G.I. either, but you say they're great, and they're wonderful.

BOLLING: Quick thought.

RIVERA: We pat them on the back.

BOLLING: Look what -- here's the liberal mindset. Pay every worker in America $15 an hour. Pay everyone 30 grand a year, whether you're frying up burgers, flipping burgers, you flunked out of high school. You got a cop, as you point out, who starts, gets shots at for 25 grand a year.

RIVERA: Yes, it's ridiculous.

BOLLING: It's upside-down.

RIVERA: It is upside-down. It is upside-down.

BILA: Agreed.

EARHARDT: We don't feel safe anymore. Not at the movie theater, not at Bible study. It's crazy.

All right. Coming up next...

RIVERA: I've been going to -- I mean, me and Eric, we were at the -- do you go to Bible study?

EARHARDT: I do go to Bible study.

BOLLING: I go to church every day.

RIVERA: You go to church every day?

BOLLING: Every single day.

EARHARDT: Good for you. God bless you. Pray for us.

BOLLING: I do.

EARHARDT: A big Deflate-gate victory for Tom Brady. A judge lifted his suspension today. We're going to tell you why and what we think of the ruling coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BILA: The NFL won't be able to bench one of its biggest stars for his role in Deflate-gate. Because today Tom Brady's four-game suspension was thrown out.

New York Judge Richard Berman ruled Commissioner Roger Goodell went too far by issuing the punishment and criticized him for dispensing his own brand of industrial justice. Goodell says the league will appeal. Brady joked this week about his life since the Super Bowl.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TOM BRADY, QUARTERBACK, NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS: I spent such an enjoyable offseason.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RIVERA: That's pretty funny.

BILA: That's good stuff.

RIVERA:  He is not cleared, though. Let's be clear about that.

BILA: OK.

RIVERA: He's not -- he's not in the clear. I heard Donald Trump today say that Brady had been vindicated. He is not vindicated.

What they did was say that the process used by Roger Goodell overstepped his -- his contractual bounds and didn't give due process to Tom Brady.  The league is already appealing it and can be heard sometime later in the season or next season. It's not over yet. But he does get to play.

BOLLING: The original suspension of four games in my opinion -- I've said it here -- was a ridiculous thing. Look, I know you've got to play by the rules, but it's the most insane stupid rule in all of sports.

The rule -- the reason why Brady's suspension got lifted is because in the collective bargaining agreement there's a notice agreement, a notice clause in there. Tom Brady was never given proper notice that this could happen, this could be one of the punishments to him.

So if -- the NFL, in my opinion, will walk away from this right now and say, "Look, we tried the case. The judge overturned it. We're going to move on." Because if they start playing around with this notice rule, they're going to...

RIVERA: They won't.

BOLLING: Right, they won't.

RIVERA: They're not going to walk away.

BOLLING: You don't think?

RIVERA: I don't think they're going to walk away.

BOLLING: I think they will.

RIVERA: How can they? They've already appealed to the 2nd Circuit in federal court to vacate the judge's order.

BOLLING: Yes. But hey can let it...

RIVERA: Now they have to litigate it.

BOLLING: Then they're going to have to litigate every single penalty if they go forward like this.

GUTFELD: I have a solution.

BOLLING: Yes.

GUTFELD: Declare new England a sanctuary city for football. If you want to play ball, you go to new England; and then you can do whatever you want.

EARHARDT: you know, it's interesting that they were playing the Colts in this game. The is the -- what is it the AFC champion game. And they were talking about him deflating the balls in the first half of the game.

The second half of the game, the refs, they inflated these balls. They made them whatever the standard is. They still won the game 28-0 in that second half. And they interviewed one of the Colts players. And he said they deserve to win. They would have won if they were carrying bars of soap.

BILA: Right.

EARHARDT: It doesn't really matter if the ball was deflated. Now granted, if he broke the rules, that's a different issue. He destroyed the evidence or his phone, which makes it a little fishy. But the thing is, the law is the law. And if you don't have any evidence to convict, then he's innocent.

RIVERA: You must acquit.

BILA: Court of -- court of public opinion. How does this play out for him? Does the public forgive him? Do they think he's -- how does this play out?

RIVERA: Clearly New England...

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: Roger Goodell, he's had a tough year. From the Ray Rice stuff, and now this.

BOLLING: Ray Rice is so much more important than this. Ray Rice whacked his wife.

BILA: Different level.

BOLLING: You and I agree. That's a real reason for punishment.

EARHARDT: If the goal was to prevent this going forward, other players are not going to do this. So they (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

BILA: Yes, exactly.

EARHARDT: So it's a winner either way.

BILA: Lesson learned. Exactly right.

EARHARDT: Coming up, Donald Trump has been hammering Jeb Bush for speaking Spanish on the campaign trail. You'll hear Jeb's response coming up.

BILA: Oh, no.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

RIVERA: No me gusta (ph). My buddy Donald Trump has been attacking Jeb Bush for speaking Spanish, of all things, on the campaign trail. Trump did it again today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're a nation that speaks English. And I think while we're in this nation, we should be speaking English. And that's how assimilation takes. And that's how -- I mean, whether people like it or not, that's how we assimilate.

I'm not just talking about Spanish. I'm talking about from various parts of the world. That's how they will become successful and do great.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RIVERA: Governor Bush says that he is laughing off the criticism.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEB BUSH, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: People come to this country to pursue their dreams. Sometimes they start without speaking English. But they learn English. And they add vitality to our -- to our country.

And the fact that he would say you only can speak English is kind of ridiculous if you think about it.

I laughed. I mean, this is a joke. Part of it is you laugh because it's so bizarre, but it's hurtful for a lot of people. And Mr. Trump knows this. He's appealing to people's angst and their fears rather than their higher hopes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RIVERA: I agree with Governor Bush there. That's what he's doing. It's like don't speak the enemy's language when they basically got German removed from all the textbooks during World War I. Don't speak the enemy's language when they got Italian. There were thriving Little Italys where everyone spoke Italian. Then people were fearful of speaking Italian.

So you had the second generation didn't speak any Italian. The third generation has to learn it at school as a second language. I don't like this, Greg.

GUTFELD: Well, you know what? I am -- I am in 100 percent agreement about assimilation. I think when you come here, you've got to learn to speak the language.

However, after seven years of identity politics, I don't think the best thing for a Republican to do is to go after bilingualism. I think it's good to know another language.

But I think it -- this speaks to a bigger issue. I think it's time for Donald Trump to go deep and to reconsider these kinds of comments. Stop running as Ann Coulter; start running as Margaret Thatcher. Start running like a statesperson and treat things like assimilation, which is extremely important, as a serious topic. And don't say you've got to stop speaking Spanish. Treat it as serious as it should be treated and still be funny.

BILA: You can't sound like that guy at the dinner table when you go to Thanksgiving, one guy that says something and you're "Oh, no." You can't run for president and be that guy. His notion...

GUTFELD: He's doing it.

BILA: He's doing it. And doing well, so maybe I'm wrong. But this notion that, just because you speak Spanish somehow means you hate English or you don't want people to assimilate is ridiculous. I mean, this is America.  We're supposed to embrace diversity. The beauty of that.

RIVERA: Exactly. Isn't this the only the only country where ignorance of every other language is a virtue? I mean, it just -- it seems to me so unnecessary and so ungracious of a guy that has the ability to be very gracious.

BOLLING: Your point is well-taken. If you travel throughout Europe, they speak whatever language is local and also English or Spanish, another -- a second or third language. Here it seems to be that we are predominantly an English-speaking culture.

GUTFELD: I speak Pig Latin.

BOLLING: Or Pig Latin. But the fact is that Donald Trump can say the things, as Jedediah points out or whatever, and goes, "Wow, really?"

BILA: Then bump up in the polls.

BOLLING: Among Hispanics. He's leading among Hispanics.

GUTFELD: But it's Republican Hispanics, right?

RIVERA: That poll is very suspect. I don't trust it.

BOLLING: But wouldn't you think that there would be no indication...

RIVERA: The polls I see, "Washington Post" included, show three quarters of the Latino people have a deeply negative view of Donald Trump.

BOLLING: ... the beginning. But it almost doesn't matter what he says.

RIVERA: I agree with that.

BOLLING: It's going to go -- it's going to go left.

EARHARDT: I like the fact that he's diverse. I like the fact that he's smart enough to know another language. I think it's good for the Republican Party, because he's trying to appeal to a base that has not necessarily felt like the Republican Party has shown an interest in them.

RIVERA: Amend. Amen.

EARHARDT: What I don't like about it is, I don't understand it. So when I'm listening...

(CROSSTALK)

RIVERA: Learn a second language. (SPEAKING SPANISH)

EARHARDT: I'm a voter. I'm a voter. I'm a voter. If I don't understand you, I don't know your issues.

RIVERA: I just think that it's gracious, inclusive.

EARHARDT: Of course.

RIVERA: We're all in this together. You know, Teddy Roosevelt said, "We all have to speak English." I think we do all have to speak English, but it's not so bad when you can also be kind.

GUTFELD: I think we should learn -- all learn Esperanto, which is the language of the world.

BILA: you don't know that?

RIVERA: Esperanto. (SPEAKING SPANISH) There you go.

Oh, they didn't understand me. I said "One More Thing" is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GUTFELD: Welcome back. Time for "One More Thing" -- Eric.

BOLLING: OK. So the political dance-apalooza. Yesterday, President Obama in Dillingham Middle School, Alaska -- check it out -- busting a move, dancing with the students. Having a little fun there.

But that reminds us of George Bush, George W. Bush in the White House in 2007. Take a look at his moves. And then Hillary Clinton, my favorite, by far -- my second favorite by far -- South Africa 2009. Clearly, my favorite of all time, if you haven't seen it, check out -- check out Karl Rove busting a move on stage.

RIVERA: I love that. That was funny.

GUTFELD: I had to have my eyes washed.

All right. After the show there's usually about 5 or 6,000 people outside just waiting, usually just to see me. They could care less about anybody else. I hate to say it. It's true. I'm sounding like Trump. Anyway...

RIVERA: People love you.

GUTFELD: People love me. I can't stand it. They just love me.

RIVERA: If we deny what you're saying, then you're going to come after us.

GUTFELD: Exactly. They always ask me how do I write my monologues? And I say, "Sheer talent." But also, I have little tricks and trades that I do to write my monologues every day. And now it's in this book, "How to Be Right." Order the book, go to my website, do whatever you want, and this will tell you how to write. Write well or good. How to write good.

EARHARDT: I'm impressed. Wonderful. All right.

Today at 6 p.m. -- you have a few more minutes -- the game begins. It's South Carolina versus North Carolina. It's our first game of the year.  And it's very exciting. Yes, there's the fight song. The South Carolina fight song. Go Gamecocks.

BOLLING: Got to be (UNINTELLIGIBLE)

GUTFELD: What's the sport?

EARHARDT: Only like two or three points.

BOLLING: Really?

EARHARDT: Yes.

BOLLING: That's it?

EARHARDT: Yes. Just wait. We always start this way, and we finish pretty well.

Football. Football, sorry.

GUTFELD: Geraldo.

RIVERA; Well, yesterday as I said, maybe you heard, I had a 45-minute interview with Mr. Trump. But what made headlines was my suggestion to him, because I thought that, if he saw ordinary Spanish-speaking people, that he might soften his views. He's being demonized. I think he's demonizing some of the folks in the Hispanic community.

So Donald agreed. He accepted my invitation to go with my wife, Erica, and his wife, Melania, to a Mexican restaurant together. I'm going to -- we're going to go. We're going to comir (ph).

GUTFELD: Taco Bell.

RIVERA: Taco Bell is -- no, that's for gringos.

GUTFELD: Yes.

BILA: Oh, wow.

GUTFELD: All right, Jedediah. And deal with some animals.

BILA: All right. I have some bad news. Someone stole Greg Gutfeld's lunch today. And we're going to show you who he is. His name is Scotty.  He is a wallaby. Where is he? We're waiting for him.

There he is. Look at him. Greg, sorry, but somebody had to eat. He is a baby. He was too small to take care of himself. He was rescued by the exceptional Kangaroo Island. They're taking care of him. It's taking a while. Look how tiny he is. He's up for adoption.

GUTFELD: What's the difference between a wallaby?

BILA: I don't know.

GUTFELD: A wallaby doesn't have a pocket. Right?

BILA: I think he does have -- I think he does have a pocket.

Regardless, I'm adopting him. And you all should. It's like what's the difference between a dog and cat. They both have feet.

GUTFELD: Look, I didn't do well in science.

All right. Set your DVRs so you never miss an episode of "The Five" that's it for us. "Special Report" is up next. I'm excited.  

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