'The Five's questions for GOP candidates ahead of debate

You can't return us to greatness, if you dismiss what make us great


This is a rush transcript from "The Five," August 4, 2015. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Greg Gutfeld along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Juan Williams, Eric Bolling and a traffic cone as your TP, Dana Perino -- "The Five."

Donald Trump went to Facebook yesterday and asked a simple question:


DONALD TRUMP, 2016 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'd like to ask all of the candidates that are politicians and really non-negotiators, people that don't negotiate jobs and lots of other things, how are you going to make America great again?


GUTFELD: See, that's smart. Prior to the debate, he's assuming his role in "The Apprentice." He asks, and the candidates answer. All that's missing is the boardroom table. But it's a great question: How do you make America great again? A better question: What makes America so great, anyway? If you can't answer that without succumbing to jaded cynicism or shallow clichés you're sunk.

America needs a storyteller who can sell America, who doesn't mock with already mocked by our foes and who believes what we all believe, without the platitudes and progressive shame. Our story matters as we face a competing story from ISIS. Their tale? It's come fight the infidel or die. That's a compelling story and it shows how evil can flourish in the desert, the culture, the abortion clinic. Evil rises in the absence of good. A leader should see how our story since Vietnam has been chipped away by disbelief, an American agnosticism that isn't convinced of greatness. From taunting veterans to promoting anti-western violent on campus, rather than fight evil, we now undermine the good.

And so you can't return us to greatness if you dismiss what makes us great: sacrifice, will and honor. That's important whether it's an "American Sniper" or John McCain's memoir. It doesn't matter. It doesn't appear in self-made myths or smug entitlement. We need a storyteller who gets that. To accept anything else means that our ambivalence is permanent and that making America great again is pure folly.

So I want to go around the table. Maybe I'll start with you, Kimberly. My question, if I could ask a question would be, how do you champion America in a way that unifies all America? What would you like to ask the candidates on Thursday?


GUTFELD: Kimberly?

GUTFELD: I would like to ask them, why they love America. Like what is it about this country that they think is special and unique, and what are they going to do to preserve it and to move it forward? That's my thing.

GUTFELD: That's like my question.

GUILFOYLE: Well, it was actually better and more artful.

GUTFELD: No. It was just faster.


GUILFOYLE: Yours was sort of verbose. But nevertheless, you answer the point.

GUTFELD: Meandering? Might was meandering.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: I like both questions.


GUTFELD: All right. Thank you for maintaining (inaudible).

GUILFOYLE: Happy Five, table.

GUTFELD: Juan, if you had a question what would it be?

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: I guess it would be about, you know something substantial like you know, how we deal with the fact that so many people feel like they can't get ahead in the country anymore and like they're, you know treading water when it comes to bringing money and sending kids to school and all the rest.

GUTFELD: You have a problem with treading water?

WILLIAMS: Yeah because you know a lot of people are treading water at a pretty low level, like could drown pretty soon. So we don't want that to happen.

GUTFELD: Well, that's a downer.

WILLIAMS: But let me just say.

GUTFELD: Eric? Yes?

WILLIAMS: I mean these are serious questions.


WILLIAMS: I don't think -- by the way, how do you make America great again? Talk about an empty question.


GUTFELD: It's an empty question if you don't have an answer.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah. You know Juan.


GUILFOYLE: That's why because you could fill hours with the answer to that question.

WILLIAMS: No. You know what it sounds like?

GUILFOYLE: Yes, you can.

WILLIAMS: You know what it sounds like? It sounds like somebody who thinks oh, we were great in the 50s and we ought to get great like that again. That sounds so silly.


GUTFELD: But you bring up a point that it's not a new question. It's hearkens back to the days of Reagan. But let's get to that later. Eric, what question would you ask?

ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: So I think, for me the question would be sitting at that debate going across the board maybe starting left to right instead of middle would be -- jobs. Everything matters. Security matters, the border matters. I think what matters most touching on what Juan said, how are you going to make more than 150 million people working in America? How are you going to make 200 million people working in America? What are you going to do specifically to create a job? Now a lot of them, including Donald Trump said. I need to bring -- we need to bring jobs back to America. But specifically, how are you going to do that? What exactly are you going to do to China or Mexico that it would be a job creator here? And I want specifics.

GUILFOYLE: Have to offer incentives. That's the thing.

BOLLING: But what.

GUILFOYLE: You have to decrease taxes. You have to deregulate. You can't punish small businesses and entrepreneurs.

BOLLING: That is what we will probably get from every single one of them back.


BOLLING: We want more specifically. What do you need, to what rate? You want to reduce taxes? Exactly what rate are you going to reduce?

GUILFOYLE: Change the whole tax (inaudible).

BOLLING: Is it corporate taxes? Is it personal income taxes? Is it capital gains taxes? And to what level, A, and number -- and two, what exactly you going to do with China? Are you going to put up protective walls? Are you going to put up trade barriers to China? I mean, these are questions that need.

GUILFOYLE: All right.

BOLLING: Specific answers.

GUILFOYLE: Got to reform the IRS. I think you should do a fair tax. A whole bunch of great answers out there things that would work that would help stimulate the economy, that would create a robust job environment and would include -- encourage businesses to come here instead of exporting America. We don't want to see jobs go overseas. We want people to manufacture and build here. How do you do that? You can't do it when our taxes are higher than everybody else and it's a frightening corporate environment. Nobody wants to do business here. Why would they? They'd be fired from their job.

WILLIAMS: They think that nobody wants to do business in an America?

GUILFOYLE: Well, on a large scale.


GUILFOYLE: Because of the punitive tax structure.

WILLIAMS: This is just -- let me just tell you.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, it's true.

WILLIAMS: You're buying into.

GUILFOYLE: That's why people are.

WILLIAMS: Point of view of America, that just not true.

GUILFOYLE: And no. No.

WILLIAMS: America is the number one place in the globe, on the world to do business.

GUILFOYLE: That's not what I'm saying.

WILLIAMS: Everybody wants to do business.

GUILFOYLE: If you want to combat it with some kind of sophomoric argument.

WILLIAMS: Oh, that's not sophomoric.

GUILFOYLE: Do your best.

WILLIAMS: Go right ahead, love.

GUTFELD: Dana, welcome to the show.

PERINO: Thank you. This -- actually, to that question about specifics on -- at least on the economic question and taxes, Senator Rand Paul has actually put the most detailed plan forward and really shows that he's thought it through. And so somebody like Rand Paul would actually be able to say, I actually have a specific plan so you could look at that. Here's a question I would ask, though. Can I ask you?


PERINO: One is would be -- a lot of voters I think are tuning in, not to just see how they're different from each other, but they want to know how would you beat Hillary Clinton? And so I think that would be a question. How would be beat her? Like what is -- why is your message going to win out, because I get back to that reality issue and its part of my second question. Any candidate, democrat or republican has to win 270 electoral votes. You take California and New York off the table, and now you've got - - pretty much, you got to win. If you're a republican, you got to win every red state, but you also probably have to flip a blue state. And what is your strategy? And which state would it be? Which one can you flip? Is it Pennsylvania? Is it Iowa? Or is it Colorado? Where do you think that you could win?

GUTFELD: Hmm. Those are good questions.

PERINO: Thank you.

GUTFELD: Wow. I want to talk -- I want to show this piece of tape of Donald Trump. He is doing very, very well because he's capitalizing on a rejection of politics. But this is nothing new in his world, and the idea of saying making America great again, hearkens back to the late 80s. I want to show this tape of him talk about how America needs surgery.


ANNOUNCER: Some thought he should run for president. Trump considered it.

(UNIDENTIFIED MALE): Would you really like to take over and run the country as you have run your organization?

TRUMP: I would like -- I would much prefer that somebody else do it. I just don't know if somebody else is there. I don't know if we have the kind of advocate that you need. We need major surgery. This country needs major surgery.

(UNIDENTIFIED MALE): Are you the surgeon?

TRUMP: I think I'd do a fantastic job.


GUTFELD: So Kimberly, here's what's interesting.

GUILFOYLE: He's consistent.

GUTFELD: He said that in June 1989. That was 5 1/2 months after George Herbert Walker Bush was in -- sworn in and eight years and five months of Reaganism (ph).


GUTFELD: Basically, if you include Bush.

WILLIAMS: Good point.

GUTFELD: And the economy was doing great. We had 60 years of economic expansion. So it tells you that his message is basically the same whether it was Reagan or Obama, right?

GUILFOYLE: Well, I guess. I mean, you're pointing out the timeline in terms of when he was saying these things. But I think he's been very consistent throughout his life and his career.

GUTFELD: He hates everybody.

GUILFOYLE: No. He thinks that he can do it better. I mean, but aren't we always looking for someone that can improve on our current circumstances and conditions?

GUTFELD: But he felt it.

GUILFOYLE: Isn't it OK to retire? Retire to try to come up with innovative ways.


GUILFOYLE: To create jobs, to stimulate the economy, to make Americans feel great again?

GUTFELD: But -- can I ask you?


GUTFELD: When he said that America needs serious surgery after Reagan? Doesn't that bug you a little bit?

GUILFOYLE: Well, listen. I was very pleased with Reagan. I would go back and I would vote for him again and again. Is there a way we could bring him back? And I would vote again for him. That's my personal choice. But I like someone that has a vision and the passion and patriotism for the country. I like someone that has a strong sense of economics and of the business community and how to stimulate the economy. So I'm looking for that in a candidate. I'm going to listen to what they all have to say.

GUTFELD: I thought there was a pretty good explanation of why, you know, it's OK for him to say that about Reagan and President Obama. But I still believe that that shows that he doesn't distinguish between the two in my mind.

WILLIAMS: I think that's right. I mean, I think it's about Donald Trump. It's not about politics. And it's certainly not about established politicians whether it be Reagan or Obama. I was so fascinated. Now you point out, he has doubled -- doubled support in the last two months according to the Wall Street Journal poll, they got the Fox News poll out today.

GUTFELD: I got a Fox News poll right here.


GUTFELD: Since you brought it up. Trump's at 26 percent. Bush at 15.


GUTFELD: And quite a jump since mid July.

WILLIAMS: It's unbelievable. It's unbelievable for all the people who said he was going to go away, that he would never last. He -- it's unbelievable. Let me just say, this -- in response to what Kimberly was saying, you know, it says here in the Wall Street Journal poll, that half of republican primary voters said they want someone who agrees with them on the issues. But about a third, Greg, say it doesn't matter if you agree with me on the issues. They just want someone who's strong.

GUTFELD: That's who.

WILLIAMS: Who's got a powerful image.

GUILFOYLE: Precisely.

WILLIAMS: Who's going to make tough decisions. And I don't know what that means.

GUTFELD: It means you don't have to be a conservative.

WILLIAMS: You don't have to even be a conservative. So that --


WILLIAMS: It doesn't matter what comes next?

GUTFELD: Yes, it doesn't matter.


GUTFELD: The end of ideology, Juan. Maybe that's a good thing, Eric. We don't care about conservatives or liberals, just being blunt.

BOLLING: Again, I would like to see more contexts around that. I'm not sure what was talking about. They could have been talking about immigration. I have no idea. I don't -- I didn't see the full access.


BOLLING: I don't have access.

GUTFELD: There's a good context.

BOLLING: I'm not suggesting it was, I'm just wondering what was it? What they are talking about? We're talking about defunding.

GUTFELD: A reporter just asking if he was running for president, if he would run for president.

BOLLING: I'll tell you, so he do ask the guy who may like to run for president at some point what's going on in the country and he says, I think I could do a good job. I don't think that was too outlandish. We came off Reagan years, went into Clinton years. Things were getting better, I see, I understand that. Trump's negatives are going down dramatically. A couple of weeks ago -- six weeks ago, 59 percent said no matter what, I would not vote for Donald Trump. Now it's too late, most recent poll down to 33 percent. Half of the people have switched that view.

WILLIAMS: That's correct.

BOLLING: His fuel is rising. Well, what he is doing is he's speaking not like a politician. He's speaking like real people. They're mad at D.C., they're mad at what's been going on. They don't want it anymore. And the biggest thing he's got going for him. I'm telling you, is that he doesn't need their money. He doesn't need the donors' money. He doesn't need the RNC's money. He doesn't need anyone's money because he has so much. Last Saturday, there was a big meeting in the west coast in California and many candidates were sitting there talking to big donors, hundreds of donors, five or so candidates. And Trump said, you know what, I don't need to be here. That means I don't need to speak for them if I get their money.


GUTFELD: He's the donor.


GUTFELD: He's usually the donor.

WILLIAMS: That is a good point?


BOLLING: Which is good business, donate.

GUTFELD: Donated to Hillary.

BOLLING: Donate. Donate to whomever.

GUTFELD: And he helped Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi?

PERINO: I think there is appeal to that for some voters that they like it, that he wouldn't have to go out that he could just fund himself, but I also think it works the other way. To somebody like Scott Walker, blue-collar background, it doesn't have a lot of money. He's not going to be a self- funder. But in America, you have to go out and you got -- it's actually it's harder to have to convince somebody that you're worth giving money to. I think, like I -- what's one of the reasons that frankly, a lot of women haven't run in the past. Is that they're not really good.


PERINO: But traditionally is saying -- of asking. Like, let me convince you that you should give me money to run. It's hard -- it's easier to be a self-funder, than it is to actually have to go out and ask for money. The other thing is -- can I say in 1989, 5 1/2 months into George H.W. Bush's presidency, it's when a lot of people were actually positioning already because there was no heir apparent.


PERINO: 41 was heir apparent to Reagan. He won. After that, that a whole that next primary in the year when George H.W. Bush ran for re-election. It wasn't much of a primary, but they -- everybody was gearing up because they wanted to challenge him.

WILLIAMS: And one last thing.

GUILFOYLE: There's some context.

WILLIAMS: Jeb Bush is hurt in the Fox poll. Or not hurt in the Fox poll by Trump. But in the Wall Street Journal poll, he's hurt. And Cruz seems to be right in position. If anything happens to Trump, Ted Cruz.

GUTFELD: He's going to cook more bacon.


GUTFELD: What he's going to do. I can't wait for the debate.


PERINO: I can cook your bacon.

GUTFELD: Oh, I love bacon. No, it's like the start -- it's like that opening break shot of the game of pool.


GUTFELD: The first debate because it gets the air.


GUTFELD: Spreads things out. Hopefully some will sink.

WILLIAMS: The poet.

GUILFOYLE: Oh my, God.


All right, ahead. Hillary Clinton is hoping women voters will help her become the first female president, but her support is fading faster than my weekend tan. Dana's got the numbers next.


PERINO: Today, Hillary Clinton launched her first TV ads of 2016 that depict her as a fighter who will work hard, especially for women and children.


HILLARY CLINTON, 2016 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When I think about why I'm doing this, I think about my mother, Dorothy. When she needed a champion, someone was there. I think about all the Dorothy's all over America who fight for their families, who never give up. That's why I'm doing this. That's why I've always done this for all the Dorothy's.


PERINO: Yet her support is slipping fast with women, according to our new Wall Street Journal-NBC Poll, white women in particular. In June, 44 percent of white women viewed her favorably. In July, that number dropped down to 34 percent. Clinton's communications director doesn't appear to be concerned, saying the candidate still beats republicans in head-to-head matchups.


JENNIFER PALMIERI, CLINTON CAMPAIGN COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: She is beating everyone. And her gender gaps are 10 to 11 points depending on who the candidate it is. So we still have a lot of campaigning to do and she still has a lot of arguments to make, but I do think that the coverage of these polls doesn't reflect the fundamental truth. I think people most would be really surprised to hear that she actually continues to -- to do, to perform better than these republican candidates.


PERINO: True. And right now, Kimberly.


PERINO: Pretty much has to run against herself because she doesn't have any serious competition. And there are 17 republicans to fight against, so she can't really pick one. But I would say that her campaign has to look at a poll like this and say there are some serious warning signs.

GUILFOYLE: Of course. I mean, nobody likes it when you have -- you are slipping in the polls, you're losing traction, you're losing momentum. Trump is hurting Hillary because she's losing air time. She's losing talk time because he's driving the bus and it's very little about Hillary Clinton. So she has to stay sort of in the mindset but not get out there too much where she makes more problems for herself. But if I were on her campaign and I would be concerned about the numbers for sure. But you know, on the other side, think about it. So many people are intimidated by the strength of her candidacy and sort of the inevitability of this coronation of Hillary, that she's really got nobody running against her other than Bernie Sanders. Republican side, everybody is like hey, anybody could win. This is, you know, all hands on deck. You got 17 candidates.

PERINO: So her unfavorable numbers are going down, Eric, but those that could actually be -- with an ad like this, if she can maintain it, she could maybe get some of those women back. And in fact, I would point out its also married white women in particular.

BOLLING: So her unfavorable favorable is widening. She's 19 points under water in that. Her positive, negative is -- she's 11 points underwater. Can I point out when she does an ad like that? You see the stark difference between Hillary Clinton on tape and Hillary Clinton live.

PERINO: Authentic, right?

BOLLING: Because they are very different people. That's why she's going to be on tape more and less out in front.

GUILFOYLE: You're right.


GUILFOYLE: She's much better.

BOLLING: Much better. But still -- but at some point.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, so much.

BOLLING: She's going to have to -- at some point she's going to get after - get to the microphone, get to the camera and start talking. And that's when he just -- that's when that connect -- that connection doesn't happen anymore. She's at 51 percent of likely voters, not down from a 65 percent a few months ago, right? 51 percent with three people -- is Martin O'Malley still on the race or not?

PERINO: Yes. He did.


BOLLING: He still did, 51 percent with three people in the race is far lower than Donald Trump at 23 or 26 percent with 17 people in the race. Do the math, 17 people, 100 divided by 17 comes around - comes up to around 6 percent. That's what if everyone was divided equally. Trump's doing at 24, 25. Three people in the democrat side, 33 percent like -- should be, right? And she's doing 50.



BOLLING: No, my point is 51 percent is pretty lame if you're one of three and one of them is hardly in the race.

PERINO: OK. I agree. Kennedy.

GUILFOYLE: That numbers.

PERINO: Today, on her show she -- I heard her talking. She said that Hillary has anti-charm.


PERINO: So like when she talks it's like going the wrong way.

GUTFELD: Yes. She's like the equivalent of the political equivalent of coconut water. The more you try, the less you like it. She's got two problems. She's got e-mails and females. One disappeared and the other is disappearing as we speak. And it is because the more you see of her the less you see. She's like a mirage. And her support -- if you look at her support right now, it has the passion or rather the ambivalence of a fire drill. It's the exit. It's the only exit they have right now. So they're walking in that direction. But if somebody -- if somebody offers them another option, they're going to go that way.

PERINO: Like stay at your desk?


PERINO: I don't have to get up and leave?

GUTFELD: Yeah. That's terrible.

PERINO: Juan, do you think that she needs someone to run against be so, so that she can actually have something to fight? So that she's not kind of fighting her own reputation?

WILLIAMS: Well, I'm just going to give you conventional wisdom which is that, you know, it's going to make for a better candidate if she has someone who really pushes her on the democratic side, helps her to refine her vision. She's -- in essence, running against the mirage of Elizabeth Warren because she's been going to the left on so many issues to try to cater to that kind of populist base, Bernie Sanders being the closest representative. So I just want.

GUILFOYLE: So if would you like Joe Biden to get in with that (inaudible)?

WILLIAMS: I'm a fan of Joe Biden, so he might help, but I don't think Joe Biden is going to get in. But I just want to speak to the larger issue here. Let me tell you something, everybody is talking about her negatives. Her negatives are not anywhere close to Donald Trump, so OK? I'm just saying -- and let me just add one other thing, she is.

BOLLING: I'm talking about her negative, positive.

WILLIAMS: Right. She.

BOLLING: It's underwater by 11 percent.

WILLIAMS: She is running against all of the media stories. Including and I think this will thrill Greg Gutfeld.


WILLIAMS: The New York Times.


WILLIAMS: She's running against everyone said, oh, the e-mails, this and that. And I think, look, she comes across as she plays by her own rules because she's a rich woman and she can do what she wants. So there's a lot of negative energy out there.

GUILFOYLE: But you know the bacon from another pan?

WILLIAMS: But she is still.

PERINO: We got to go.

WILLIAMS: Really popular among democrats.

PERINO: We got news.

WILLIAMS: Don't forget that.

PERINO: We got news to get to, maybe. I don't know. I think so. I mean, a lot, stick around.

Should the government be shut down over Planned Parenthood? We'll debate that as the fifth undercover video was just released today. The Five returns in a minute.


GUILFOYLE: The Senate failed to pass a bill to defund Planned Parenthood yesterday, setting the stage for a potential government shutdown this fall. Two republican presidential candidates say they're for a shutdown if necessary.


HUGH HEWITT, RADIO HOST: If it comes down to closing the government down, or funding Planned Parenthood, what should the republicans in the Congress do?

CARLY FIORINA, 2016 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I apologize for not answering your question. They should close the government down.

HEWITT: It's the only way to get rid of Planned Parenthood money for selling off baby parts is to shut the government down in September. Would you do that?

TRUMP: Well, I can tell you this, I would.


GUILFOYLE: Planned Parenthood supporter Elizabeth Warren lashed out at republicans before the vote.


ELIZABETH WARREN, MASSACHUSETTS SENATOR: I come to the senate floor today to ask my republican colleagues a question. Do you have any idea what year it is? Did you fall down, hit your head and think you woke up in the 1950s? Or the 1890s? Should we call for a doctor? Because I simply cannot believe that in the year 2015, the United States senate would be spending its time trying to defund women's health care centers.


GUILFOYLE: Senator Warren calls them women's health care centers, but a new fifth undercover video shows the group is in the business of selling the body parts of aborted babies.


MELISSA FARRELL, DIRECTOR OF RESEARCH, PLANNED PARENTHOOD GULF COAST: So if we alter our process and we are able to obtain intact fetal cadavers, then we can make it part of the budget that any dissections are this and splitting the specimens into different shipments is this. I mean, that's -- it's all just a matter of line items.


GUILFOYLE: Oh, just all it matter of line items, Dana, and you had some pretty strong.

PERINO: I'm just.

GUILFOYLE: Reaction.

PERINO: I'm sickened -- I'm just -- I'm sickened by it, by the substance of it. And I also think that Senator Warren should be called out for something. Senator Joni Ernst is the first woman to be elected from the State of Iowa. She is the one who has led this legislative effort. She is a mother, a grandmother, someone who fought for this country and has dedicated her life to public service. It is unconscionable for me -- for both -- Warren and Hillary Clinton to dismiss as some sort of republican war on women, when it's actually an effort -- legislative effort being led by a woman and it doesn't take away any cent of women's health care funding. It actually takes it out of Planned Parenthood and into health care community centers as they've done successfully in other states like New Jersey. So I think that she should actually -- I think she owes Senator Joni Ernst an apology.

GUILFOYLE: Absolutely. All right, so Eric, what do you think?

BOLLING: So Heritage has a web site called The Daily Signal, it's fantastic. They put out a thing today that showed that there are 9,000 federally qualified health centers in America, providing services to 21 million Americans every year. And guess what? None of them provide abortion services.

There are only 700 Planned Parenthood centers. That said, not any single one of the Planned Parenthood centers offers legitimate mammography services. Meanwhile, there 8,000 of the 9,000 center that do.

So this strawman argument of, if you defund Planned Parenthood specifically, you're depriving women of health services, is ridiculous and is shot down. Read that piece.

Two questions. If women knew before they had an abortion that their fetal body parts or tissue, whatever you want to call it, Juan, were going to be sold off to a third party, would they all agree to do the abortion? My guess is probably not.

And No. 2, what kind of society do we live in where baby body parts, babies are more valuable dead than alive to a group like Planned Parenthood? It's -- it is disgusting.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, it really -- And Juan, you still seem to be confused.

WILLIAMS: I just -- you know, I listen because I'm very sensitive to the idea. I mean, I respect people who oppose abortion. But I just think this is a misguided conversation. It's a political...

PERINO: Actually, this conversation is -- this actually has -- no one has said that they oppose abortion.

BOLLING: No. What Eric just said, for example, was, "Oh, you know, this is people who are somehow not providing health services for women and that it can be done just as easily"? And then you're going on about...

BOLLING: That's against the argument that says if you defund Planned Parenthood, women won't get services. Not ban abortion.

WILLIAMS: Planned Parenthood is in areas of the country where there isn't...

BOLLING: There are centers...


WILLIAMS: There aren't services available. And you've got to remember, you know, this is an old conversation. It's the federal government that uses fetal tissue for scientific research. We fund it. If that's the argument, have that argument. But don't have an argument about abortion unless you just want it for a political issue.


PERINO: Nobody said -- no.

WILLIAMS: Dana, you said...

GUILFOYLE: You're trying to conflate the issue, because you don't have a leg to stand on.

WILLIAMS: I've got two.

GUILFOYLE: That's the problem.

WILLIAMS: Let me just tell you, Dana, you said this is Joni Ernst, who's a woman, a veteran, wonderful person. I would concur. But don't forget: the other two sponsors are Paul and Cruz. Both running for president, both using this issue, because it has stirred the Republican base.

PERINO: Unfair.

GUILFOYLE: You know it's just sad that you can't embrace the immorality of it.

PERINO: And what you just said, you're against abortion? Nobody is saying, "Let's repeal Roe v. Wade" in this legislation. It's specific to Planned Parenthood, and it doesn't take a dime away from women's health funding on the federal level.

WILLIAMS: I think that what you have is people, especially people who are against abortion, who have had -- and they say this -- a long-term goal of getting rid of Planned Parenthood.

PERINO: That's so wrong.

WILLIAMS: They just hate on Planned Parenthood. And you know what?

GUILFOYLE: Nobody's trying to get rid of Planned Parenthood. They're talking about defunding from federal moneys to support it. But it can be privatized.

WILLIAMS: There is no federal money paying for abortions.

GUILFOYLE: So you say. But you're not even aware of the facts, the circumstances, what's happening here, because you fail to acknowledge what's going on, that they are actually selling fetal body parts. Not fetal tissue. You're not understanding what's happening here, because you don't want to admit it -- Greg.

GUTFELD: This is all about one simple exercise. Disguising evil as -- in euphemism. For example, if you listen to somebody like Barbara Boxer, when they fall it fetal research, they aren't calling it what it is.

Imagine if you were to experiment on the bodies of Death Row dwellers. Would you be able to call that inmate research? I don't think so. You would have everybody after you. Every lawyer.

When the argument for fetal tissue begins with or ends with the consequence, "It's a shame to let it go to waste," you are then making a moral case against abortion. Because in order to let something go to waste, you already consider it valuable. You can't let something go to waste if it's waste.

So when you decide that fetal research is important, that means that you, in your soul, admit that it is of value. It is of value. It is important. If it has a beating heart and you're using that tissue, it is not a waste.

Now, this is not actually about defunding. It's important to approach the immoral subject and win it as a moral case in the town square. I don't care about the defunding. I care about getting Planned Parenthood, and getting the supporters into a town hall and actually debating this and framing this as you would frame slavery. Because what you're doing is you're defending people who cannot defend themselves.

You could argue, because there's a beating heart and there is a DNA, that these are living creatures who don't have a voice. It's worse than slavery. This is something that, if you wanted to fight a war over, you could. Because it has every bit of the emotional value and the factual, biological value that you're dealing with.

Again, unless you view unborn children as recycling, it's not waste. It's actually real.

WILLIAMS: So when a woman says that she wants to have an abortion, you would say?

GUTFELD: I would say there's nothing I can do about it.


GUTFELD: However, what I can say is, "You do not have the right to decide whether or not the heart or the liver goes anywhere just to appease your guilt and to make the decision."

WILLIAMS: Oh. Because Eric was saying earlier that the woman doesn't even say, "You know what? Even though I'm having an abortion, I would like this tissue to be used for some good purpose."


BOLLING: ... who have abortions, if they were told...

WILLIAMS: Guess what? They sign. They sign and say, "We would like..."

GUTFELD: ... not much different than actually...

GUILFOYLE: We're going to have a lot more on the investigation. OK.

All right. We have a new announcement. At 6 o'clock -- 6 p.m. Eastern you're going to hear from Bret Baier, Chris Wallace and Megyn Kelly, who will be making the big announcement, which top ten candidates will make Thursday's primetime presidential debate, hosted by FOX News and Facebook. We'll also learn which seven candidates are going to be in the 5 p.m. Eastern debate this Thursday, as well.

So big announcement. You want to catch it. Keep it right here on the FOX News channel.

Much more to come on "The Five." Stay with us.


WILLIAMS: Two people were shot and killed and nine others injured last month in a theater in Louisiana that was playing the movie "Trainwreck." Now one of the film's stars is teaming up with her senator, who's sort of a cousin, to push for gun control. Here's Amy Schumer.


AMY SCHUMER, COMEDIAN/GUN CONTROL ADVOCATE: We'll never know why people choose to do these painful things. But sadly we always find out how. How the shooter got their gun. And it's often something that shouldn't have happened in the first place.

The critics scoff and say, "Well. there's no way to stop crazy people from doing crazy things." But they're wrong. There is a way to stop them. Preventing dangerous people from getting guns is very possible. These are my first public comments on the issue of gun violence, but I can promise you they will not be my last.


WILLIAMS: You know, this is so interesting to me, because more and more people are saying they just don't believe in gun control in the United States. It's particularly true among Republicans. You've seen those numbers climb. But overall, people are just like, "You know what? We can't do anything, so just let everyone have guns." What do you think, Eric?

BOLLING: I think it would be a safer place if everybody had a gun. Remember the county in Georgia where everyone is required to have a gun and the crime rate plummeted?

My issue with Amy Schumer is that she's right on certain things. Like, she wants to fund mental health research to a greater degree, which is part of Senator Schumer's bill, or a legislation idea, which is great.

But the other part of, you know, sending information into a federal registry, that's the part that we would push back on. So in some areas she's got the right idea.

WILLIAMS: Let's explain to the viewers...

BOLLING: She's a comedian. She should stay with the comedy.

WILLIAMS: Her idea and Senator Schumer, who's her father's cousin, the idea is submit records on felons, spousal abusers and the mentally ill for federal background checks. Penalize states that don't do it. Encourage the Justice Department to survey states that have (UNINTELLIGIBLE) with involuntary commitment to mental health facilities. And restore congressional cuts to mental-health programs. So K.G., what's wrong with that?

GUILFOYLE: Look, I would have to go do an in-depth analysis on it. But I think there are some really good points of merit, as we have mentioned already. That sure, that we should have some more funding and take a closer look at mental health providers and make sure that we are providing adequate services, that we have better diagnostic tools to analyze and predict when someone is suffering from mental illness that could also turn to violence. Educating the public about it.

And also doing some public service campaigning to dismiss and kind of eradicate the stigma associated with mental-health issues so that people who are suffering don't do it in silence, that they actually communicate it and try to have family and friends reach out. So it's not something, a matter of shame that only hurts the person further and the community at large.

WILLIAMS: What we see, though, Dana, is in the polling, a majority of people -- and gun owners included -- favor background checks. But you don't hear that from the NRA.

PERINO: Well, that's one of the reasons that Chuck Schumer was smart to try to get somebody like his cousin, Amy Schumer, very popular and also personally touched by what happened in Louisiana at the movie that she is the star of. So I can understand that.

Today I think the National Institute of Health announced that it was like one of six people in America have reports of having some sort of a mental illness.

So what I would recommend that the senator try to do, is that if he thinks he can't get the gun control portion passed this year -- and he probably cannot -- he might as well go forward and hive that off and do the mental health piece.

WILLIAMS: You think there'd be support for that? You think there'd be support for that?

PERINO: Yes, yes.

WILLIAMS: That's interesting. So let's go to somebody who's mentally stable -- Greg Gutfeld.

GUTFELD: Thank you.

I am very skeptical of emotional appeals. They come off as very powerful, but they're never rooted in facts.

However, I -- you know, this is different. This is actually something that is -- that has -- they're looking at the best standards for involuntary commitment, which is super important. Restoring cuts to mental-health programs, which is very, very important. And I think that's where you start.

Because when you look at this, what is the overarching thing in common? Mental illness. And also I mean a lot of these people are losers. But a lot of them are mentally ill.

I know that she's a comedian, and we always like to call out celebrities when they have an idea that's different than us. And then we like -- we like celebrities when they agree with us. I happen to think that, if it passes this test, does it target law-abiding citizens or does it target those who commit the crimes? This one actually tries to target those who commit the crimes. That's helpful.

WILLIAMS: Wow. Did you see that, America? I think that was three out of "The Five" or the four conservatives on this panel they were for something like what Amy Schumer wants.

GUTFELD: Not actually gun control, though, Juan. It's actually people control.

WILLIAMS: I didn't say gun control. I didn't say -- I said what Amy Schumer wants...


WILLIAMS: ... which is you know, checks and methods.

OK. So even better stuff coming up. Want to see President Obama prep Donald Trump for Thursday's debate? Can you believe that? Stay tuned, because it's coming up on "The Five" next.


BOLLING: Well, we have some exciting news. Don't go anywhere. Because coming up right at 6 p.m. Eastern, Megyn Kelly, Bret Baier and Chris Wallace will make the big announcement which top ten candidates will make Thursday's primetime presidential debate hosted by FOX News and Facebook. We'll also learn which seven candidates will be at the 5 p.m. Eastern debate on Thursday. I'm super pumped, and I hope you are, too. So stick around, stay tuned.

And speaking of the debate, Jimmy Fallon rolled out his hilarious Donald Trump impression with a special call from an unexpected debate coach.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, you've got the debate coming up this week. So...


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let me hit you with a sample debate question, all right?

FALLON: Go ahead.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Here we go. How are you going to deal with immigration?

FALLON: Build a giant wall.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. What about the economy?

FALLON: Build a giant wall.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's your favorite Pink Floyd album?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Dark Side of the Moon."


BOLLING: Well done, well done, well done. You got it. Let's bring it around. Greg, that was a little fun.

GUTFELD: Surprise twist at the end. I enjoyed it.

PERINO: I loved it. Did you see his weave?

BOLLING: What, do you think "SNL" is going to go big on the debate?

PERINO: I don't know. Are they on hiatus?

BOLLING: I don't know.

PERINO: I wish they'd do -- if you are, can you just please come back for one show? I want to see this one.

GUILFOYLE: One night in Bangkok?

PERINO: You can't play that song again, by the way, because it will get in my head for hours.

GUTFELD: You know what that's about, don't you?


GUTFELD: Look it up. Something happened that night.

BOLLING: Juan, you want to weigh in?

WILLIAMS: You're trying to embarrass this young lady.

Anyway, what happened to Donald Trump's hand?

BOLLING: That's Jimmy Fallon.

WILLIAMS: That's not Donald Trump?

BOLLING: He's that good.

WILLIAMS: He's excellent.


GUILFOYLE: There are some days where Juan really frightens me. I'm like, "Juan, are you serious?"

I thought it was very funny. The Donald looks like he has an amazing tan there. But listen, people are super excited about this debate. I cannot wait.

WILLIAMS: This morning you were doing a piece about bald men. So what do you think of the hair?

GUILFOYLE: No, I wasn't. What is wrong with you?

PERINO: She interviewed two bald men.

WILLIAMS: Oh, I see.

PERINO: But not about being bald. You need to watch "FOX and Friends."

WILLIAMS: But what about -- what about the hair? Do you like the hair, Kimberly? Is that Donald's hair or what?

GUILFOYLE: I can't even -- obviously not.

WILLIAMS: It's not.

GUILFOYLE: Because it's Jimmy Fallon playing Donald Trump.

GUTFELD: Does Juan not understand the skit?

WILLIAMS: I am trying to say that this is Jimmy playing Donald Trump.

GUILFOYLE: That's why you're so confused about Planned Parenthood.

WILLIAMS: So the hair is all that counts. He's got to get the hair right.

PERINO: That's true. That's true. You can't do that wrong.

GUTFELD: You use Donald's hair.

WILLIAMS: Is that what it was? OK.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God.

BOLLING: All right. Before we go, though, we want to get to this Trump critic, Jonah Goldberg, who was on America's newsroom earlier. He and Bill Hemmer agreed on one thing. This is Trump's summer.


JONAH GOLDBERG, TRUMP CRITIC: You have to take him seriously these days when he's doing this well in the polls. I still don't think he's going to be the nominee. I still think that this is sort of a summer fad. But, you know, there were a lot of people who predicted he was all done or that he was never going to do very well, and they were all wrong.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, I mean, this is the summer of Trump, then, if that's the case.


BOLLING: Thoughts?

PERINO: He's -- Trump has received more network and print coverage than all the other 16 candidates combined in the last seven weeks. So yes, he's definitely doing the summer if Trump.

Also, on polls, remember GOP likely voters is not the same thing as GOP primary voters. It's a distinction. But only 18 percent of Republicans vote in primaries. It's not reflective of the polls.

BOLLING: Quick thought?

GUTFELD: Yes. It just shows you how boring other politicians are.

BOLLING: Yes. Well, I would agree with that. How about this? I never get to say it. "One More Thing" is next.


GUTFELD: "One More Thing." Eric.

BOLLING: OK. So in just three minutes and 45 seconds, Chris, Megyn and Bret are going to make the big announcement, the top ten candidates who will be appearing on the stage Thursday night and then the seven candidates who will be onstage -- I guess stage for the 5 p.m. debate, as well. Stick around for that.

Tweet me, @EricBolling. Or Facebook me and use the hashtag #WakeUpAmerica. Let's talk about what they should be asking the big candidates and all the candidates. I'm looking forward to this. I love this stuff.


PERINO: All right. Will you join me in meeting and congratulating your newest fellow American certified citizen? This is Chase Decker. He was born in Uganda in 19 -- I'm sorry, in 2013. My friends Ally and Josh Decker adopted him. They have three children or their own, as well.

If you look at now that big happy family there. That's Josh and Ally and their children.

Today when he got his certificate, he was asked, "Are you proud to be an American?" And Chase said, "Yes. I so American." And apparently he was waving that flag all day.

GUILFOYLE: Isn't he cute?

PERINO: Congratulations, Chase. We're glad you're here.

GUILFOYLE: Adorable.

GUTFELD: It truly was the best "One More Thing."

PERINO: I knew I was going to beat Juan today.

GUTFELD: Until this one.


GUTFELD: Greg's Sports Corner.


GUTFELD: One of the rarest sports events you'll ever see: pitting a squirrel with his head -- a skunk with his head trapped in a yogurt container fighting a police officer. Let's roll this disturbing tape shall we, America?

All right. In a spot shadow there, which looks like a giant egg, we have the skunk. His head is trapped probably in a Yoplait container. And you have a brave officer over here trying to get into that little egg. But he realizes the egg is -- and then he gets sprayed. And he runs over there. And the poor skunk is still trapped in that giant egg.


GUTFELD: That is life.

PERINO: OK. You win.

GUTFELD: Did I win? The child was adorable. But that's a skunk with its head trapped in something.

WILLIAMS: In a yogurt container.

GUTFELD: Yes. You've been there, Juan.

WILLIAMS: Amen. Got to watch out.

GUTFELD: Yes. And you've also let out a stink.

WILLIAMS: Yes, really. I'm totally capable. Speaking of time...

GUILFOYLE: Totally capable?

WILLIAMS: ... this weekend the twins had their third birthday party. They both insisted on Anna from "Frozen" cakes. The twins want the same girl. They didn't want Elise. And so this is what happened. And of course, people sometimes when they're three, they can't control their impulses. They just go and stick their finger in the cake.


WILLIAMS: That's what happens when you're that age.

GUTFELD: I hope you grounded them.


GUTFELD: I hope you ground them.

WILLIAMS: Absolutely. I told them, "Uncle Greg said you're grounded, girl." And then -- but then you know what? The thing about having birthdays with parents and grandparents is, it's no fun. So they just had their pals over. And then they started dancing. No adults allowed.

GUILFOYLE: So cute. They just jump up and down. So cute.

WILLIAMS: Just the girls, and they're going to "Uptown Funk," doing it.

BOLLING: You know what's fascinating? When you showed that clip of them communicating with each other, it was absolutely fascinating. We should do a segment on that sometimes.

PERINO: It's like talking to Juan about Planned Parenthood.

WILLIAMS: Yes. A different language.

GUILFOYLE: Nobody is understanding.

But I want to say happy birthday to the United States Coast Guard and thank everyone who is a member for their service. Celebrating 225 years of service to this country, ensuring maritime safety, security and stewardship along our shores and across the globe.

And also ask you to join me tomorrow morning again on "FOX and Friends." This time with Pete Hegseth and Steve Doocy. Be wonderful to see you all there.

PERINO: What a great career choice, is the Coast Guard.


PERINO: If you're thinking -- if you have a young person who's thinking about what they want to do, that's a good place.


GUTFELD: All right. Thank you for that.

That's it for us. Big debate 2016 announcement next.

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