Reaction to Bill O'Reilly's interview with Leon Panetta

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," October 8, 2014. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: All right, that's the press conference from Frisco, Texas with fire chief and the mayor of Frisco, Texas commenting on a possible second case of impossible, or make that point, possible second case of Ebola in the area and Kimberly, let's bring it around very quickly, they're clearly trying to calm the American people are a little bit nervous when we see things like this.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: That's a tough sell, especially when they don't know all the facts and circumstances. So they want you to believe in them, trust them, not to panic, which I do think is important. They have to communicate that in a way that is credible, while at the same time being very vigilant to make sure they're on top of this, and I think he tries his best to convey that.

BOLLING: Good idea to get out there right Bob?

BOB BECKEL, CO-HOST: Oh sure, but you know the decision was made obviously at the top level, as -- I mean including in the TV industry was not try to frighten people. I did this idea was not to build these things out of control -- out of proportion. However, for the American people, when they're told that, not to worry, there nothing that -- it seems to me that the next day we have something. And so we has to keep a perspective here that's both a balance that we won't to scare people and at the same time, we have to bring the news and so they you come. (ph)

BOLLING: You know, Dana, I -- just before this Tom Frieden, the CDC director. Has said -- you know he came to the podium as well and started to clarify some other things that they were talking about prior. Do we have confidence in them? Should we have confidence -- I guess we should, but do we?

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: I don't think we have a choice, OK? So we have to call in to them and we have to wish them well and we hope to -- I think that they understand that they are under a lot of scrutiny, they got to do two things right now, so he does -- he is also -- the director, so he has to manage it, he's also doctor. And what I like about Dr. Frieden's commentary is that he went to Liberia, he's sought first hand, so he's got some credible eyewitness accounts that he can talked about in any other passion for when he came back. It was his briefing to the White House, to the president in a situation room, they -- really started to get things moving and then the president, two weeks later went to the CDC. History will have to decide how much -- how late that was. I am curious about one thing communications wide that it's not from the CDC it's actually from the White House. On Friday, the White House said that they are not considering any sort of travel ban. And I thought how can you not even consider it? Ok, then Monday, the president does an event in which they -- the pool spray, the press comes in and he says, "Well, there might be some changes in travel." OK, when the president of the United States said, that you need to have to be specifics because that spends the next -- that require the next 48 hours, for there to be even more concern in confusion. Now today, we find out that this coming Saturday, there might be increase screening and temperature taking at JFK airport.


PERINO: And so I, there's sort of inching their way towards more of a strategy and a plan. Maybe they've got everything under control.

BECKEL: It may be careful to use that first surgery line like.

PERINO: Which one?

BECKEL: Spray usually the spray, the rest of us don't know what they mean.

PERINO: Pool spray?

BECKEL: Yeah, pool spray. It sounds like everyone is coughing at the same time.

PERINO: No, they would -- the pool came in.

BECKEL: I say.

BOLLING: That -- so Greg, Dana points out the -- they're going to pick five airports in the United States to add additional screening. How about all airports in the United States have additional screening?

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Their argument for a no travel ban is that, if we don't stay in these areas things get worse for those countries, which is basically saying he want to get something done, you have to rely on the United States, our presence is necessary. However, what I don't understand is why -- we -- why can't we have a travel ban but still allow business and medical to go there. I don't understand why one causes the other. I mean, you can do both.

BOLLING: All right, let's move on. GUTFELD: Don't panic.

BOLLING: Another big story today. Last night Bill O'Reilly hosted Former Defense Secretary, Leon Panetta for a wide ranging interview, O'Reilly brought his a-game drilling Panetta on President Obama's decision making, a blistering round of questions on Benghazi and finished with the revealing line of questions surrounding Hilary Clinton. We've got a lot of sound bites to get through, so let's start with this one, Panetta on President Obama as a leader.


LEON PANETTA, FORMER DEFENSE SECRETARY: I think the big picture is that, this is a president who I think wants to do the right thing for the country. The real question is whether or not he's willing to.

BILL O'REILLY, THE O'REILLY FACTOR SHOW HOST: So did you (ph) do our enemies throughout the world fear us?

PANETTA: I think they're getting a mixed message as to whether or not the United States will stand by its word. I'm a guy who believes that Barrack Obama by virtue of what I've seen, by the time I was there, has the guts to do the right thing. The real question is, will he make the decision to do it?


GUTFELD: Yeah, will he?

BOLLING: Greg, the facts.

GUTFELD: Well, you know what's getting tiresome is how Panetta and all these Obama staffers treat the president like his a promising high school senior. If he get only -- if he only applied himself, he could get into a decent college. But no -- he's not character in an after school special. He's the president of the United States. And what Panetta is describing is a movie that everyone's already seeing it's called the, "Titanic" and its tragedy. We already know these things we've been talking about it for years.

BOLLING: You know Bob, Bill O'Reilly leaned on Panetta pretty hard there. I haven't seen him do that in a long time, and you know, he got -- he got exactly what we've all suspected. He got -- Leon Panetta saying, "I'm not sure the president has it, what has it takes to be the leader."

BECKEL: Well, I think that's probably what Leon believes. I mean, I think it's the -- this is as Greg said, this is not new and I had a Leon's closes friend, blistered me about my comment on some -- but I'll -- just say I'm going to say what I think and that is, Leon is selling a book, we have got to keep it in that context. He had opportunity to make this public before. But, there is mounting evidence that the president was -- did not -- it's not a question of leadership, it's not wanting to exert the leadership because he sees his policy choices broader and less militarized than other people do. And I think he's chosen the former not the latter.

BOLLING: K.G. I want this because have a question for Dana on this next sound bite. But, weighing on this, so what if he didn't do it before.


BOLLING: At least we're finding out now.

GUILFOYLE: Look, I want to hear the truth. It's always a convenient time for the truth. It's always the right time. I don't care if he makes money off this book or not, if he does, fine. I want to hear the truth. I want to know so that in real time, we can make great decisions for this country that will impact the future. I'm glad that he had the courage and he didn't sit there like the rest of the people that mainstream media, and give Obama a pass. What's going on in this country is too important, so when people like Bob criticize him and say, "Oh, he's selling books." It doesn't dismiss the content, that doesn't do anything, doesn't mean it's not true.

BOLLING: Let me move on to this, because this whole back and forth of Leon Panetta lately didn't sit well and doesn't sit well with some Democrats. Bill Burton, former deputy of White House press secretary retaliated on CNN calling Panetta small and petty.

BECKEL: Really?

BOLLING: It's kind of sad that in his twilight, he's done such a desirable thing by at a time -- by being after the president that he served at a time with a lot of different instabilities around the world. This president has shown his leadership time and again. He is moved this country in the right direction and you know, to attack his leadership by think is small and petty. So CIA director, defense secretary, small and petty, is Burton just delivering the defensive attacks that the White House can't deliver themselves is.

GUTFELD: They picked him?

PERINO: I mean he is -- I mean Bill Burton serves as an effective advocate and a surrogate for the White House. I do think that small is kind of offensive, it take personal offense to being called small. But here's the thing about this, Leon Panetta is not in his 30's starting out in his career that got from sort of like -- nugget of information that he's trying to use to sell a book. He is 76-years old. He has -- not only the things that you mentioned in terms of CIA director and secretary of defense. He was also the OMB director. He has been the chief of staff of the United States. He has one -- he has run in one office. He is actually -- I think that time of the book, I question as well. Bill Burton suggests that Leon Panetta is dishonorable. I can understand saying that, "The act of doing a book while the president is still in office is dishonorable act." But Leon Panetta is not dishonorable, and that's what the White House get itself into a little bit of a corner. Because the credibility and gravitas of a Leon Panetta, whose word echo the same as Secretary Clinton her book, and secretary gave him his book and things that you read from General Petraeus. Also remember, Mike McFall leaves the ambassador ship in Russia because he says he can't agree be the policy. Our ambassador in Syria left because he said he can't abide by it, and also Michael Flynn of the Defense Intelligence Agency. You have the entire national security apparatus suggesting that the president is not making good decisions and not listening to the people he has in place.

GUILFOYLE: It's a consistent threat.

BOLLING: Am I being crazy that the anchor conspiratorial think that Valerie Geller, someone else in the White House picks up the phone to Burton and says, "Look, we got a problem here, can you help us put it down on Burton," hits the CNN and hits the talk show and says, "Look, let's be little or call Panetta's small."

PERINO: They say they want to try to defend the president and yes, that's exactly how it works.

GUTFELD: But you know who -- you know who backed up what Panetta is saying is President Obama, set a fund-raiser was it last night any, or I was maybe it's could not.

PERINO: Or could have been any day.

GUTFELD: Could have been any day. He said how the perception is that the world is spinning out of control. Who is doing the spinning? We all feel that way, it's because President Obama as advocated the role as leader in favor of being a crisis manager. It still longer a president -- he's no longer a president he's like a guidance counselor. All these problems keep happening and it was, wow, he feels like the world is out of control. Join the party that's we've been saying.

PERINO: Right.



BOLLING: Can I go to Benghazi guys, I want to -- can we move on.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, just real quick. I want to say, I just feel it think it's admirable to kind of cling desperately to diplomacy. I understand to go start fair and then move forward. But I think it's his hesitancy that is put us behind in so many situations instead of out and front.

BECKEL: I just want to say very quickly. It is the suggestion that somehow the president of the United States is responsible for this thing out in control as he say -- he's not right and maybe in about what you mean to say. But I think that suggest as many people do if he's not, if there'll be a different president, the world will not be in the situation as today. I think he's frankly not provable.

GUTFELD: I think, I've sat in what.


GUTFELD: I sat and wonder what the world would be like if there was a different president than President Obama. I think -- what I was describing is that decline is destiny, under Obama. That is his fulfillment of his ideology, is a smaller, a smaller more manageable country decline its destiny in his mind.

BOLLING: Let's get the parts to the (inaudible) he turns the focus to Benghazi, specifically those very important talkie points to comments delivered by Susan Rice and Hillary Clinton, which were known to be false.


PANETTA: When I told the president was that the --that there was an attack that was going on in Benghazi.

O'REIILY: Did you use the word terror attack?

PANETTA: I used the word attack, that there was an attack by terrorists.

O'REILLY: The U.N. Ambassador Susan Rice goes out, after you and Dempsey told them it was attack by terrorists. And said no, no, it was spontaneously. When you heard Ambassador Rice say that, what went through Leon Panetta's mind?

PANETTA: I thought those talking points frankly were not on point. With the kind of weapons that showed up, there's no question in my mind that it was a terrorist attack.


BOLLING: And don't forget there in a Super bowl interview, the president dies to reflect (ph) in it and denied that he was told by Panetta that it was quote, "A terror attack." He said there was attack probably by terrorist. Go ahead Bob.

BECKEL: Well, I think people around this table had given down without the credit -- credibility and certainly he deserves it for telling the truth and mean straight forward. We left out of this interview with Leon Panetta his absolute certainty that Hillary Clinton did not know and was not responsible for the security at Benghazi and that for some reason found its way on the cutting room floor here.


PERINO: However, Bob, can I? OK, but I'm glad you brought that up. Because -- I'm glad you brought that up because that's an important point. There's a follow-up question in which Leon Panetta said, "Yes, if I had been in that position, and I had not been given that information then yes, I would have been upset and I would have done something about it." Which is actually a question of Hillary Clinton's leadership which is, something the inspector general of the state department put out a paper report upon this week, and we have the chance to talk about it here because, there is so as much as other news. But that is the important, but I don't think it was actually that complementary to Hillary Clinton what she said.

BECKEL: No, I think she said it, she said to bite on the regulatory procedure at the state department. And she should be.

PERINO: Of course she is. She was the chief of staff that only the director and the secretary of defense inside out (ph)


BECKEL: I think this is a reasonable discussion, I think what you're seeing is right, and Leon may have well done it differently. But what he did say was that he did not think that she was responsibility per se for these particular events.

PERINO: But they didn't say it was negligence.

GUTFELD: But once again, we've learned who pushed the video which was President Obama which reflects his obsession with Islamophobia.


GUTFELD: And yes. At the expense of actually facing the urgent threat of terrorism, he decided to focus on Blackophobia and gain a filmmaker.


GUILFOYLE: So how is that? That is something to put us in a worse position. It's dishonest and its very core.

BOLLING: So, K.G., President Obama literally did sit down on O'Reilly and say, "No. I wasn't told then." And O'Reilly cornered Panetta and said, "Did you tell him?" He said, "I kind of told him."

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, but that's what happens in court, I love it. It was like a legal moment with a cross-examination and you put it together and you put the facts next to each other, who you going to believe? What's credible? What comes out on top and what we heard here from Panetta, which I think Dana, was very credible talking about Hillary Clinton, and then Bobby said, "I know Hillary Clinton, I've known her for a long time, and I think that she had the information of there was a security problem Benghazi.

BECKEL: She would've done excellent.

GUILFOYLE: That she would've done -- that helps her --

BOLLING: You know, you guys has transition to this final piece of sound that we have from last night, Hillary -- this is all about right watch.


PANETTA: I think it's unfair because if I know Hillary Clinton, if she knew there was a security problem in Benghazi, she would have done something about it.

O'REILLY: Then why didn't she know if the cables exist telling the state department, "Look, we need more people here. The British had been attacked there."

PANETTA: I don't know that bureaucracy, I know the Defense department, I don't know what happened at the state department. But I know one thing that she had known that there was a problem at Benghazi, she would have done something about it.


BOLLING: So that would refute the kind of what you were just the point you were making there, Bob.

BECKEL: You're not supportive of what I said.


GUILFOYLE: I have point.

BOLLING: She's trying --

PERINO: What's the point in there?

BOLLING: Is he not trying to -- I don't know -- provide some padding for Hillary Clinton.

PERINO: He is, he's giving her some padding, but this is the follow-up question I would have asked. If that's true, let's just give her the benefit of the doubt I'm not (inaudible) for the sake of this conversation, she has the benefit of the doubt. She doesn't know about the cables, OK. But that night happened then she was going on the Sunday shows but she has said not to go on Sunday show and sends Susan Rice. Susan Rice tells the lie that it was a video that caused it, but Hillary Clinton repeats it at Dover air force base days later. So to me, that suggests that either she was part of the cover-up or she still doesn't even know about the cover-up and she's either complicit in the lie or she didn't know anything about the lie or she's this innocent person that's caught up.


BOLLING: Can I ask you some Bob, as the political strategies that you are, is this Leon Panetta auditioning for something in the Clinton administration?

BECKEL: It should.

BOLLING: Is that Hillary Clinton?

BECKEL: No, I think it's she's going to go back to grow raise which she should be doing. And it's.

GUTFELD: Well enough.

PERINO: He's 76. I mean --

BECKEL: He's done and He done it well, all his jobs he's done. But we also to care about motives of people here, somebody decided to give us a piece of research for generally calling Bill Burton a goon. Now that is a very sophomoric thing to do.


GUTFELD: So for talking about Hillary -- the upcoming election, America has to learn that with Obama you got what you paid for, you voted in cool at the expensive real world expertise, we got Ferris Bueller when we needed to die hard. People need to remember that in 2016.

BOLLING: We cut before we go.

GUILFOYLE: No, I can occur it's about leadership and accountability and honesty to the American people, someone who is not afraid to ask about that.

BOLLING: We going to go, time come for us to have a break. Coming up, Gates, Hillary and Panetta and now hold on to your hats, Jimmy Carter is blasting the president's Foreign Policy stay tuned for that one next on The Five.


PERINO: One by one, former aides of President Obama are coming out to critique his foreign policy, and now a former president is joining the chorus. Here' Jimmy Carter.


JIMMY CARTER, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: President Obama isn't hard to figure out exactly what his policy is changes from time to time. I noticed that both of the secretaries of defense, after they got out of office have been very critical of the lack of positive action on the part of the president. There's been delays sometimes he draws red lines on the sand and here it is, sometimes he doesn't go through with it.


PERINO: And then a pattern of previous presidents campaigning in their second midterm election trail for President Obama is cold and lonely. Here's the cover up today's New York Times, features an article about how is party has been Jim have been (ph) this election. Bob, let's start with you and Jimmy Carter, since that was your former boss. Jimmy Carter has been a former president that really does continue to seek the craiglight (ph). Now he was doing a fund-raiser that you could hear the hammering in the background, I assuming it was habitat for humanity. But, as the President Bush said last week, being president is a hard enough jobs and you don't need former presidents piling on, necessarily. But do you think the White House -- the current White House even cares what Jimmy Carter said?

BECKEL: Well, I'm going to assume that many Republicans and others don't. But let me just say that I think of all the people who have sought, Bush probably the best and his dad, but Jimmy Carter has not exactly like he is. If he had, you know, people don't give him credit for eradicating diseases in Africa, they don't give him credit for the place he's done, the things he's done but.

PERINO: I just said it he was at a habitat for humanity event.

BECKEL: No, no, I know. But I'm saying in general, even in thing he does good works on, he tries to do -- that bible studies every week. He tries to do the idea that you don't take credit for things you do. I don't think he sought the great live and I'm sure he was sought out here.

GUILFOYLE: All right, well, are we going to say about the content.

PERINO: Yes, can we talk about the content?

GUILFOYLE: I is love -- I'm into content. So here's the deal.



BECKEL: I'm sorry.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah. It's not easy for President Obama when you have a president like Carter, in giving his ideology and his political leanings to come out and make these comments against the president of the United States, I think it's a sobering moment, it's not a high point for the president and again, begs the question, are you going to sit there and criticize people like Panetta when you have former presidents saying the same thing, it's not President Bush saying it, it's something that plays for the same team. I think it's significant and I think his comments were actually right on point.

PERINO: If ever you like this or are you want to go on the next topic.

GUTFELD: Well, you got -- I might, you got to worry when Carter is to your right. It's Carter's most famous battle was with a swamp rabbit. If Carter was a half less, that makes Obama half full.



I'm sorry, Bob, I didn't mean to bring up that memory.

PERINO: Let me ask you this, Eric, Washington post columnist David Ignatius writes -- he writers a lot about foreign policy and about inner workings of the administration. He thinks that in this second term, the president needs new energy and talent to refurbish the second term, he mentions the George W. Bush often for some shake-up in 2006, but a lot of people who they might be able to pick, have already left for Clinton's world and they want to preserve their ability to work for Clinton. One-third of the political appointments at the department of defense are still vacant.

BOLLING: You know, we have been saying -- we've been talking about this for six years, that there's big ideological and personal, social divide between the Clinton camp and the Obama camp. And boy, is it exacerbating now.

GUILFOYLE: It's real.

BOLLUNG: It's real. It is real.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, it's real.

BOLLING: This latest round with Panetta isn't proof. I also think Panetta is doing because he's trying to push attention over to Hillary Clinton away from President Obama. PERINO: I think he's concerned and he wants them to do the right thing. I don't think he's trying to help President Obama --

BECKEL: Let's keep in mind that half the federal judges that have been appointed by Obama are being stalled by Republicans. Let's not get a holier than that on this one. I lot have, agree a lot of people have not been reappointed or want the job. But, you know, if you're still looking weary, if you done a democratic consultant, and you look where Obama is now and I was still in the business of advising people, I would say get by away 10 miles away as you possibly can, it's about survival of your job. And you.

BOLLING: Away from Obama or his policies?

BECKEL: Well, both.

BOLLING: Thank you. Thank you for finally saying that.

PERINO: But Greg, if you had a imagine that --


PERINO: And now he's going to watch his back.


BECKEL: I have been advised to keep quiet. But I just want to say this that is a very unfair thing to say.

BOLLING: If I see something about President Obama, what's going on in the country, I don't like him or I have a race --

BECKEL: Don't say something about it.

BOLLING: In all I really care about, most conservatives really care about the policies not the guy.

BECKEL: That you, that is --

PERINO: OK. Can we get Greg the last one.

GUTFELD: I'm actually going to defend President Obama. I think it's unfair the critics are unfair to Obama because they used him when his popularity and his charisma helped them but now they're deserting him over his policies. When -- they're hypocrites because they knew what he believed in from the start. And now they're deserting him because he is no longer helpful to them. They are the mean girls because they used him when they needed him and now they're deserting him.

BECKEL: Exactly what happened to George Bush, you have a very few Republicans in the mid west to the north east just to supported Bush about the war in Iraq they jumped away from him, did not invite him in and that's politics. I've accept it. I'm sure he accepted it. I'm sure Obama accepts it.

PERINO: We need like 20 more minutes for that block, but we don't have it, because next Lois Learner doesn't like being targeted. The former Irish official tries to escape an ambush by a conservative activist. Now he's become the target of critics and Greg explains why ahead.


GUTFELD: So as a stable Mabel at the cable table, it's easy to feed red meat to viewers who already agree with you. But to win people over to your side, you must explain your perspective, persuasively with charm and facts. You need to convert, not confirm; that should be your motto.

These days, with distractions piled upon distractions, and the left winning minds from celebrities, symbolism and sentimentality, it's not enough for you to be right. You must be persuasively right.

Here's what doesn't help: chasing Lois Lerner down the street.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chance to apologize, Ms. Lerner. You didn't hesitate to target conservatives, yet you're hesitating to speak. Why? You don't like being targeted, do you? You targeted conservative groups. Is this an apology? "I'm sorry I used as my position as a government official to try to crack down on political dissent"?

LOIS LERNER, IRS: I just want you to leave me alone.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why should we leave you alone?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's trying to get in the house. She's not going to answer questions.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't want her in the house.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I wouldn't blame you. I wouldn't blame you. I wouldn't want her in my house either. It might bring the government after you. Any idea where those missing e-mails are?

Are you going to try another house?


GUTFELD: So it takes a special gift to make the least sympathetic bureaucrat on the planet look sympathetic. Seriously, that even made me feel bad for Lerner, and I can't stand her.

Look, she should be investigated, but you won't persuade anyone of that by hounding her like a Stuttering John version of Travis Bickel.

So what's persuasive these days? Here's a new ad from Americans for Prosperity, focusing on the 13 million young people who can't find jobs.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't know where things went off track. I thought I was doing everything right. And then I am -- I guess I lost hope. I had to move back in with my parents, after everything they've done for me.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's great work. Anyone especially want to share?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hi, my name is Dan, and I'm unemployed.




UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Big government is killing opportunity for young Americans. Don't they deserve the dream?


GUTFELD: Pretty clever. it offers no solutions, but it defines the problem clearly and cleverly, and that's a big start. See, there's a whole world out there facing a scary future brought to them by a president who resembles Inspector Clouseau with every passing day. So we need real solutions and not stunts.

But if you can't give us that, then maybe chasing ladies into strangers' homes is the next best thing. At least that's kind of funny.

All right. Before I go to you, Bob, I've got to say, the ad was written and directed, that second ad was written and directed by filmmaker Jonathan Kahn who's a buddy of mine, works at Breitbart, sponsored by Americans for Prosperity, who I've done a book event with in the past. They're also great people.

So, Bob, I know you want to -- you want to talk about the -- Jason's -- the logic of Jason Mattera's ad or stunt was that since Lois targeted the Tea Party, it's OK to target her.

BECKEL: Your friend who did that ad, having gone to AA meetings like that, every night, that's a very good subject to do it. I think it was very well done.

Let me now move to this Jason. Let me give a very special comment to him.

You're twice as young as I am. You're a punk; you're a coward. My name is Bob Beckel. I would like you to call me any time, any place, and let's you and I discuss, because you're a coward, you're a punk, you pick on people and you deserve to have your (AUDIO GAP) kicked. And I want to do it. So get in touch with me.

GUILFOYLE: All right, Bob. Let's just not...

BOLLING: Do you know Jason?

BECKEL: I know -- I don't know Jason, I care who Jason is.

BOLLING: Jason Mattera is a good guy.

BECKEL: That's not a good guy. That's like chasing some poor person...

BOLLING: Let me just tell you something. He's as conservative as anyone I know. You may not like what he did there, but I'm going to at least stand up and say, "Look, it's Lois Lerner. I mean, how many people would like to hear the answer to that?"

BECKEL: If you want to know my home address, I will gave it to you.

GUTFELD: I don't think -- Eric, I don't think ideology allows you to be rude. It takes...

BECKEL: You don't stand up for somebody like that.

BOLLING: No, I'm not going to stand up for Jason Mattera.

BECKEL: Oh, that's Jason Mattera?

BOLLING: I don't stand up for that tactic. It's none of my business. But the guy is a conservative who cares about the country.

BECKEL: Nobody cares about the country does something like that.

GUTFELD: I don't -- I can't use ideology to say that I like somebody -- Dana.

PERINO: Well, I think that -- I like what you said before. I believe that the best way to persuade people, that you're right, is facts, wit and charm. But also there's a lot of patience. A lot of people are getting a little frustrated with the slow pace of the investigation. Partly, that's Lois Lerner's fault. but I think patience is a better way to handle it.

GUILFOYLE: A better tactic.

GUTFELD: Eric, the point is that people want to know those answers is actually the right point. That's the right point. But I didn't get that.

GUILFOYLE: Well, the problem is, right, it takes away from the message, which is that this is a fair criticism; this is the woman that dodged the truth, hid behind the fifth, was not forthright with the American people. We do deserve answers. she is in a position where she is supposed to be accountable. So far the allegations against her, but I disagree with the tactics.

BOLLING: Andrew Breitbart was the victim of a million of these. They loved to just corner him somewhere wherever he was and stick a microphone and start peppering him like that.

GUTFELD: I get your point. I get your point, that it's almost like conservatives are catching up to the left. Right? They're catching up to the left. So they have to learn to adopt this good sense. And Breitbart was good at it.

BECKEL: That's an insult to Breitbart's history. That is an insult by a guy who was a punk and a lousy, lying Un-American Punk. He's not American. You don't do that; you don't chase your neighbors down. He's un-American.

BOLLING: Let him go fight ISIS.

BECKEL: Yes. That's fine, let's try it.


GUTFELD: This is amazing.

GUILFOYLE: This is so immature.

GUTFELD: I have to go to a tease, but it's entertaining.

BECKEL: And bring a knife, punk.



BECKEL: I'll tell you, I can't stand people who pick on people like that.

GUTFELD: I should have gone to a tease earlier. All right. Coming up a lesson for the left on radical Islam -- Well, that will be calmer -- from our very own Bob Beckel, stay tuned.


BECKEL: You've heard me condemn radical Islam time and again on this show. Unfortunately, not everyone on the left has followed the lead. Check out what just took place on MSNBC. Christians were actually accused of terrorizing the world as much as Muslims.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The reality is that there's a lot of antsiness now because of ISIS and what people see on TV. And yet, at the same time, this is a religion that is ancient, that is honorable, that is venerable. Why is it that we get confused between the two? We don't deal with Christianity, because there's a lot of terrorism going on and being promoted in the identity movement and white supremacist roots within Christianity itself.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: True. Well, one, it's harder to be critical of ourselves and of the religion that's most predominantly practiced in the U.S., which is Christianity. But you're right. You're talking about oppressing women. You're talking about being homophobic. We can look right home. We don't have to look across the seas in order to see that.


BECKEL: All right. I have a few things I'd like to say to this, but I'll start over here and go around the table -- Eric.

BOLLING: Well, why don't you go ahead? I'm trying to figure out what he just did. He just -- he just hung white supremacy, hate towards women, all on Christianity?

GUILFOYLE: Yes. Crimes against women and against the world, essentially.

BOLLING: Where'd it come from?

GUILFOYLE: Terrorist organizations.

BOLLING: Why don't we lump in cancer and Ebola, too, and blame Christianity?

PERINO: They did that today earlier, on Ebola.

I think that it's a real disservice to feminists and women's movement that has done a lot for me, for lots of women of our generation, I think that women have a responsibility to help us that get to live in this freedom and the economic opportunity and mobility that we have an obligation to help the women around the world. It does the feminist movement no good to have people like these two equating the lifestyles of the United States to people around the world. Just ask Lena Dunham, who last night in all of her glory, made sure that she was able to -- she can do whatever she wants to do, but she has a responsibility to help others do it as well.


GUTFELD: There's nothing more pathetic than watching individuals emasculated by their Islamophobia. They are literally scared to come out and say something honest. They said that Christianity is against women or whatever, while there is an entire radical Islamic faction that is tormenting women. That is absolute -- that is just incredible.

GUILFOYLE: Stoning women to death, right? And doing genetic -- genital mutilation.

GUTFELD: Pathetic. Pathetic.

GUILFOYLE: ... on women. Give me a break. I mean, what they said is so irresponsible, they're totally neglecting to talk about all the great work that Christians have done throughout the world, whether it is helping people that that misfortunate, helping the poor, helping the religion of tolerance.

BECKEL: Good point. I'm going to just take 30 seconds here to stay I've been a liberal for a long time. I'll put my liberal credentials up against anybody's.

What you're doing is ill-liberal. You're doing a disservice to the progressives movement because you don't know what you're talking about. you don't know what you're talking about, you're saying things that are just absolutely ridiculous.

White supremacists? You equate that with Christians? We have worked awfully hard on the left to try to disassociate those together. So please, I have a tendency to speak about things I don't know about. But this time is like the world is actually not flat. You are being -- it's just sad, is all I can say. You're sad.


BECKEL: All right, actress Jennifer Lawrence addresses her nude photo hacking scandal for the first time. You'll hear what she has to say next.


GUILFOYLE: Actress Jennifer Lawrence was one of a slew of celebrity victims of this summer's new photo hacking scandal. Now she's speaking out for the first time about it.

Lawrence tells "Vanity Fair," quote, "Just because I'm an actress does not mean that I asked for this. It's my body and it should be my choice. I can't believe that we even live in that kind of world."

She also says what happened to her was criminal. Quote, "It is not a scandal. It is a sex crime. It is a sexual violation. It's disgusting. The law needs to be changed. These websites are responsible."

I like a strong statement, a woman speaking with conviction on behalf of the other victims, as well. I can understand how she would feel like this. She did not pose for a magazine, do some kind of revealing celebrity photos stunt to try and get press. This is a credible actress who is entitled to have her private moments and not be violated, Dana.

PERINO: I'm persuaded by her argument, but I'm curious as to whether it would hold up in court because it seems to me that case law has not kept pace with technology. So she might be a pioneer in this regard. I hope she takes it to court, because I think -- I think she's right. But I don't know if the courts will agree, but she might be correct that the laws need to be changed. And if so, that should be something that both parties could get together on and get done quickly.

GUILFOYLE: That's what I love about the law: fluid, bring a test case, see how we can change it, so that we're not always coming from behind -- Bolling.

BOLLING: I agree with her on all -- everything she said with the exception of at the end, these websites are responsible and should be held accountable and liable. Because you -- do you realize how much of your rights you give up when you sign up for services on -- with your iPhone, with your various carriers, you basically give up all your legal rights to fight against this. Unless there's mass negligence on the part of Apple. If they hacked the cloud and there's mass negligence. There's -- they're hacking the Pentagon.

GUILFOYLE: All right, real quick, Bob. I'm going to finish the thread.

BECKEL: If somebody's been subjected to this for two years, virtually all my income came from a blog that actually came from a wrong statement. I have to be very sympathetic. I agree with Dana, though; I don't know what the law does here, whether it's a way to deal with it.

GUTFELD: I think it should be like, this is no different than somebody stealing your credit card information and leaking it. The people should be caught, punished and humiliated. I do think it does have a sex assault kind of feel to it, because it's her body.

As you know, I do have pictures out there that I'm worried about.

GUILFOYLE: No one wants to see them.

GUTFELD: I'm a reverse nudist. I prefer to wear layers of clothing. There are photos of me out there wearing 13 coats. It's pretty arousing stuff, Kimberly.

BECKEL: Why did you do it -- why don't you do it to Kimberly, then? That's what I want to know?


BECKEL: Never mind.

GUILFOYLE: "One More Thing" is up next.


BOLLING: All right. Time for "One More Thing." I'll kick it off.

Reason number one million and one why Utah is awesome. Utah Jazz gave little 5-year-old J.P. Gibson a one-day contract. Watch.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Working through the big men. Novak misses on the steal. He goes by them. The Bear is there. He slides by the Bear. He rises to the rim and hammers. J.P. Gibson with a two-hand plus.


BOLLING: J.P. Gibson has leukemia, guys.

GUILFOYLE: Aw, cute.

BOLLING: All right, Dana. You're up.

PERINO: I hope that he gets well.

Less than four weeks to go till the election, and last week I told you about a couple of governor's races. There's three more on my radar screen.

Looks like Charlie Baker in Massachusetts, he's a Republican, looks like that race ask going to go his way if he can close it in the next three weeks.

Believe it or not, in Maryland, Larry Hogan, the Republican...


PERINO: ... has cut it down to about -- the lead about 1 percent. Can you believe this? I can't believe it. The reason you can't believe it is the media has not covered this story at all. But watch him. I think that O'Malley could be in trouble. I'm sorry, Lieutenant Governor Anthony Brown could be in trouble. O'Malley needs to get back there and campaign for him.

And in Hawaii, David Ige is likely to win. I'm sorry, likely to lose against Duke Iona. So that's three possible Republican governors that are pickups.

BOLLING: Bob, you're up.

BECKEL: Yes. I'd chime in on those, and I think they're pretty good except for Maryland is a dreamer.


BECKEL: The -- tonight, you're going to be -- if you can get -- see this, the moon -- tonight is the second of the...

PERINO: You're going to show us the full moon?

BECKEL: It happened this morning, the red moon. You get to see it twice more this year. It is a wonderful sight to see. It happens a few times a year. If you want a little piece of serenity, go look at it and don't think about it.

BOLLING: Greg, you're up?

GUTFELD: All right, it's time for...


GUTFELD: Greg's Sports Corner.


GUTFELD: First there was gay marriage. Now there are robots playing humans in Ping-Pong. Visit the national robot-human Ping-Pong finals. That's XL-543695 on the left. He is a first full-time Ping-Pong player. He was previously -- worked the line at Chrysler, but he followed his dream as a Ping-Pong player.

BOLLING: Got laid off?

GUTFELD: He got laid off. He's also a Pisces, and he loves long walks in the woods at sundown, where he often devours human beings when he gets angry. So follow him; he's got a big career.

BOLLING: All right. K.G., quick.

GUILFOYLE: All right. So in important news, this is an incredible moment. Dr. Kent Brantly, actually for the second time donated his blood, matched the blood of the -- you see the guy next to him there at Nebraska Medical Center, U.S. journalist Ashoka Mukpo, who also, unfortunately, came down with Ebola. He gave him a transfusion so hopefully he can survive. I think it's an incredible moment.

BOLLING: All right. "Special Report" is next. See you, everybody.

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