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The Five

Reaction to savage murder of American journalist James Foley

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," August 20, 2014. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: This is a Foc News alert. I'm Kimberly Guilfoyle.

The parents of American journalist James Foley who was viciously murdered at the hands of ISIS savages say he was a hero and that he represented the goodness of America.

Listen to some of their emotional statement earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DIANE FOLEY, MOTHER OF JAMES FOLEY: Jim, you can feel the prayers, he was strong, courageous, loving to the end. We just hardly recognized our little boy. I mean, he just -- he was just a hero, you know?

JOHN FOLEY, FATHER OF JAMES FOLEY: And we know from the videos what his last words were. I wish I had more time to see my family.

DIANE FOLEY: So, Jim had a big heart and just -- I just, you know, that's what we shared with President Obama.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUILFOYLE: U.S. intelligence officials confirm that the video appearing to show an Islamic state militant beheading Foley is authentic.

President Obama addressed the beheading from Martha's Vineyard earlier today, and as usual, he was long on words, but short (ph) on solutions to eliminating the ISIS threat.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Let's be clear about ISIS. They have rampaged across cities and villages killing innocent, unarmed civilians in cowardly acts of violence. They have murdered Muslims, both Sunni and Shia by the thousands. They target Christians and religious minorities. ISIL speaks for no religion. One thing we can all agree is on is that a group like ISIL has no place in the 21st century.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUILFOYLE: The president spoke for about five minutes on the Islamic beheading of an American citizen before immediately heading back to the golf course. A tough day for the families and for the family of the journalist who is still missing and believed to be with ISIS.

Eric, you made a noise at the end there. What bothered you?

ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: Well, let me start this. So, I'm sitting yesterday and saying to my friend Brian with Sky News, he said, do you see this video? And I went to YouTube, and the video was still up. Now, they pulled that video down in about 20 minutes.

I made the mistake of watching it. I watched it and it infuriated me. It's so, so disgusting. I realized that we're dealing with something that we've never dealt with before. I was enraged.

So I was waiting for President Obama to say something, allegedly he was going to say something last night, he chose not to. He came to the podium today and I listened, as you point out, five minutes, he spent five minutes by the way, no tie, notice that as well.

And that was it. There were no questions, and I yelled out, that's it? This is what our commander-in-chief is going to do? He's going to spend five minutes describing ISIS, or ISIL as he points out.

He didn't really say what we're going to do, what our responses going to be. He basically said they're murderous thugs, and blah and blah, and they're terrible and they're awful. And that's them. But he didn't say -- and then, what? I was waiting for an "and then what", no questions.

And then we find out he goes back to the golf course. That was at the point where I just said, you know what? Stick a fork in him. President Obama is done. He doesn't want to be president anymore. He doesn't want to be commander-in-chief anymore. He wants to get back on the golf course and finish what he started, and that was his golf game.

Unfortunately, not finishing what we've started, or they started, which is taking care of these murderous thugs, they need it. They to find out what it's like to be on the business end of the drone.

GUILFOYLE: Dana, take us through some of the communication aspects here, and I know you were sort of engaging in some foreshadowing this morning. Wondering what he was going to do after the statement. How do you feel about it now compared to what you were thinking about before?

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Well, last night, I assumed that there would where no golf today. So, I tweeted, my prediction is that there would be no golf today. That was part prediction, part advice. But I can understand -- I'm going to try to put myself in their shoes.

One thing we do not know --

BOLLING: Golf shoes.

PERINO: Golf.

One thing we don't know is what the intelligence community is suggesting President Obama in terms of his posture and his tone because we do have other Americans in harm's way, that are being held. So, perhaps they are suggesting, Mr. President, it would be better for you to go about your business and pretend like you're not giving them attention, OK? That could be something that they're thinking -- I don't know. I'm being pretty kind there.

I do think that --

GUILFOYLE: Generous.

PERINO: -- that the president, because he has several different audiences that he's speaking to at once, the family, other reporters, our enemies, our allies. That one day would have been -- this would have been a good day to have a somber moment. I just would not have played golf. I just wouldn't have done it.

I do think something is interesting about the president and what he said. He continues to say and he said this before about Putin, that ISIS cannot -- that they will not succeed in the 21st century, that they don't - - that they will not be successful because that's not how people act in the 21st century.

Well, unfortunately, that is how people are acting in the 21st century. And ISIS, they might want to live in the stone age, and maybe we should help them get there. We don't know what the president might be doing in terms of getting our allies, including the E.U., which I think has been very silent on this.

Maybe we're trying -- maybe we're about to make a big move that would try to push back on some of these terrorists, I hope that's true.

GUILFOYLE: Greg, so what do you think? Was the president a little bit tone-deaf today? I mean, there's a lot of different theories, OK? That perhaps he didn't want to come out so strong and then provoke, poke the cage and then further endanger and be criticized if he did anything that, in fact, infuriated them to kill the other journalists.

I don't know. It's just --

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Yes, I don't --

GUILFOYLE: -- wanting for a little bit more.

GUTFELD: I don't mind this professorial approach, or the golfs, as long as he authorizes of death of all of these ghouls. I don't care what he does.

I do understand the notion of not responding to some British loser in the desert, that you don't want to put your president on the same level of some scum who's up there. You don't want to make them equal.

But the thing that I think, I mean what he could do is that there is - - there is an importance about expressing passion when there's evil in the world. These are -- this is a moment, it's a horrible wakeup call, that is necessary that ushers in the death of innocents.

For a lot of people who weren't around for 911, these things happen to tell us how to think about evil. So why can't we, if evil uses these videos to recruit their people, why don't we do the same? Why can't we use these events to appeal to our own youth, to our young people, for a sense of justice and a sense of purpose? We need people here to see that the threat is here and that it must be destroyed.

This evil grew because we let it. This is the first threat. The radical Islamic threat is the first threat that has been cocooned within the production of tolerance. We do not we've never fought this threat as hard because we fear -- we feared being labeled Islamophobic. And that -- and ISIS sprouted out of that fear, out of our cowardice of being politically incorrect, allow this to happen.

And now, as cold and calculated and tireless as President Obama is, I don't mind that if he evaporates and gets rid of all of them, then all is forgiven.

GUILFOYLE: OK. Bob?

BOB BECKEL, CO-HOST: A couple of things. First of all, I think Obama does good well, he does evil badly, in terms of communication. I don't think he knows how to get that sort of demeanor that you're talking about. It's always hope and, you know, all that stuff. He does that well. The other he doesn't.

The other thing is, Eric said about the business end of the drone. There have been over 100 U.S. airstrikes. ISIS is running like scalded dogs off that dam. There now is a resistance. Maybe it's late, but it's not too late.

And as I suspected, once they're faced with some serious airpower as happened in the Balkans, with other savages, by the way, we eventually won that war through the air. And now, we had drones, we didn't have them.

I think what you're seeing here is the beginning of a very substantial degrading of ISIS.

BOLLING: Let's hope.

And you know what else we can do? We can also continue to help, help the Kurds -- help the Kurds. They're fighting is with antiquated equipment.

BECKEL: Not now.

By the way, I was happy to see that the Iraqi military getting into this fight at the dam and they did a good job. And so, the other thing that happened yesterday, I don't know if we would not survive that. But I have to say the lead religious figure in Saudi Arabia came out and absolutely eviscerated ISIS, and it is about time. It's the first time.

Now, my question is, where are the rest of you Muslim heads of state?

BOLLING: So, can I -- Bob, you love to defend that president. What was that? What was the reason to walk away from the golf course, go to the podium and speak for five minutes and go back --

BECKEL: You may find it --

BOLLING: What was the reason? He didn't fire out, let these thugs, these cockroaches know we're going to eviscerate them, he didn't do that.

BECKEL: You may find it hard to believe, but I don't have a lot of fun defending the president a lot of the times.

BOLLING: OK. Then what was that?

BECKEL: I think that was Barack Obama, the way he does these things, that is him, he doesn't do evil well. So, you've back to the golf course, probably not, in terms of the obvious. Do I think it matters in the long run? I don't.

You say to put the fork in him. I mean, he's already -- he's not going to run again. Then again, you heard what he said he was done over Obamacare. We haven't heard a thing about it in three months.

GUILFOYLE: If I -- Dana, do you have a quick comment on --

PERINO: I was going to mention a couple of things. The video of the beheading is one -- I did not watch it. And some people have and I think that's right, because they have to witness it so then they can explain it to me. But it's not something that I want to see and it's not something also that I want to gave the terrorists the satisfaction of getting my attention.

But I think the most important video of the day is the one of the family's reaction. What courage it took for them, knowing that for the last two years their son was being held hostage and then reportedly for the last week, understanding that the demise was near. And then to know that they have -- this is not just a reporter that they're talking about or a fellow American, this is their baby.

GUILFOYLE: I know.

PERINO: And so I think that the most important video is that one and I applaud them for their courage.

BECKEL: Did he get captured in Syria? Is that where they got him?

BOLLING: Yes.

PERINO: I believe so.

BOLLING: The second time.

(CROSSTALK)

GUILFOYLE: But let's talk about this and Eric brings up the point, let's talk a little bit, you know, Jim Foley. This is someone who's certainly courageous, that was trying to bear witness to what was going on here and to the suffering of the people. This individual, this young man was kidnapped before in Libya in 2011 and he was on O'Reilly talking about it.

Take a listen please.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES FOLEY, JOURNALIST: They interrogated me for six hours initially. And that was kind of felt like a mind game, one guy would be playing kind of good cop, one guy would come in yelling, saying, we think you're a spy. And eventually, you figured out, look, I just got to stick to my story, make sure I tell the absolute truth that I'm a journalist, that's my only chance.

(END VIDEO CLIPP)

GUILFOYLE: I mean, what are the odds that just to listen to his words, to think about that after being in harm's way, that he went back out, you know, to serve the good fight again and try and bring up the truth about what's going on around the world and the suffering of the people in Syria and the suffering of the people in Libya. I'm sure very tough break for the parents to see this and hear this and then to listen --

PERINO: Well, I think that they do live with a tremendous amount of pride in their son, and they should. The way that you eradicate evil, first and foremost, you have to expose it. And it's because of people like Jim Foley who are willing to go, put themselves in harm's way.

Now, there's a question about the responsibility of that. He knew is that he was going into a dangerous situation. One of the big problems I think around the world is that there are very few bureaus anymore, there used to be journalists stationed all over the world, and news organizations have had to cut back for costs or for other reasons, maybe also because of concern about safety.

Where he was in Syria, 170,000 civilians have been killed. This is not a story that gets on the front page every day and he was trying to tell that story. But it's been two years that he's been unable to report because he was held hostage himself.

GUILFOYLE: Very difficult and there's comments that he was kind of a leader, and the one that the younger hostages that they are looked to him, that they would hug them in their time of stress and anxiety, and you know --

BOLLING: Take that young man that we saw from that O'Reilly interview.

GUILFOYLE: Yes.

BOLLING: Look -- think about that. And look at that picture of him kneeling in the desert, look at his face and think about what goes through his mind at that moment, think about what it took for him to sit there and do that, knowing exactly what was going to come right after that and the comments he had made before that and it's just disgusting.

By the way, any question about ISIS not being the freaking jayvee team now, I think they're all off the table right now. It might be nice if someone from the --

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: We screwed up. We made the mistake. They ain't the jayvee team.

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: The other part of the video that is important and probably the most important part is the British accent. That tells you, for example, this fact that it happened twice, British Muslims are in ISIS and they are in the armed forces, according to a British member of parliament. There's 1,500 British Muslims in ISIS versus 600 in the military. These are guys with British soccer season tickets in their wallets and gym membership cards.

These are the needles in the haystack that we have been talking about. This is the bridge between the West and the East. And will this cause the libertarians in the world to reconsider their casual dismissal of intel? Is it a coincidence that ISIS has exploded, as our intelligence was compromised by Snowden?

GUILFOYLE: Up next, the disturbing video of ISIS savages murdering James Foley, raises new questions about America's role in the global war on terror. What should the U.S. do now?

Greg breaks down the importance of the battle against evil, when THE FIVE returns.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GUTFELD: So what if ISIS is what we've all been waiting for, the death kneel of radical Islam? ISIS is now uniting factions that before were fractious. Kurds who didn't get along do. Saudi clerics and kings come out vocally against these savages.

It's the "crazy person on the train" theory, forcing all other passengers finally to act as one.

However, we're the only force who can galvanize in an unruly world to expunge the vile toxin. But the more we hedge, the more it spreads. We are the doctor with the antidote, and if we don't give it, there will only be more disease.

And who cares if there's more jayvee? If so, reducing them to dust should be no sweat. And if they're varsity, it just means their response is more urgent.

Either way, the answer is not to say we're tired of war, or that we won't have boots on the ground. We lacked the luxury to decide when and when not to fight evil. Evil has no timetable, which is why even in this age, as I sit in this studio thinking about tonight's dinner, we have the military do what I cannot.

As for campus pacifists also banning the ROTC, your thesis on gender pronouns won't save your ass now. Watch that video. Anyone who loves their freedom but hates our military, watch that video. Anyone who thinks hugs work, watch that video.

And remember why our military is so great. Their volunteers, they asked for this duty. They get it. And given the opportunity, they will show the world why evil is no match for good.

So, K.G., is it time to pick up the pace, militarily speaking?

GUILFOYLE: Yes, I mean, there is no time and no comfort for us to be able to be war-weary. I'm sorry, that's the way it's going to be to have be. There can't be like the timetable, there can't be like, oh, this is when we're going to pull out, telling them, that is not helping or making America safe. And if we don't step and do the job, who will?

GUTFELD: Yes.

Bob, is my theory that ISIS could unite people who normally wouldn't even be in the same room? Is that an actual possibility?

BECKEL: Absolutely. I mean, look what's happened. Since these guys went out -- look, if you're an Islam cleric or an imam, and you're looking at this and these savages are doing this in the name of Islam, you've got to sit back and say to yourself, you know, this is going to be a bad deal for us when recruiting next year.

And so, my guess is, and I go back to this. When these guys -- you don't necessarily get to be the varsity because you're savages. These guys are savages, we understand that. But savages now are beginning to unite various factions around the world. I think you're exactly right. I think you're beginning to see, this crowd will not be around in a year.

GUTFELD: You think so, Eric?

BOLLING: No.

BECKEL: ISIS by some other name they will be. But this crowd will be gone.

BOLLING: What's the difference? I mean, if it's --

BECKEL: At some point --

BOLLING: Remember al Qaeda is on the run.

GUILFOYLE: But that's the point.

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: And all that stuff.

Let me provide an idea of thought. I don't know if maybe I'm completely off-base on this, continuing to drone the hell out of them. Just continue the campaign, droning, finding, rooting them out, continue to supply and support the Kurds and anyone else who wants to fight ISIS, anyone who want to take on ISIS, we got your back. We'll help you militarily. We'll help you with money.

And also this, cut off their funding. One of the other things they need that they're doing, they're selling stolen oil. They're pirating oil from Iraq, and they're selling it. Stop doing that. Don't buy -- if you're caught trading with them in any way, shape or form, or housing any of their money, or supplying them, you're done, too. You're finished.

Cut them at the pass -- when you cut the money flow off, that's when you kill ISIS.

BECKEL: The Kurds are getting ever closer to getting these fields back. I would be that they don't have the ability to sell that --

BOLLING: Good enough.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, and ISIS has 6,000 new members. So, there you go.

(CROSSTALK)

GUILFOYLE: Yes, but you can't just dismiss it all, Bob.

BECKEL: I'm not dismissing. I think --

GUILFOYLE: Just look at the images, look at the press, what was going on.

(CROSSTALK)

BECKEL: The constant and persistent air campaign against them and the Kurds and some of the Iraqi military, I think is going to be taking these guys down.

GUTFELD: Hey, Dana. I want --

BECKEL: I mean, yes, don't be scared -- they're horrible people, but we can't make it bigger than they are.

GUTFELD: All right. This is Mike Morell, former director of the CIA, right, and Hayden, talking about the ISIS threat and then I want you to comment.

PERINO: OK.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE MORELL, FORMER CIA DIRECTOR: The definition of terrorism, Norah, is political violence -- violence for political effect. So, we should mark this date down because this is ISIS's first terrorist attack against the United States.

GEN. MICHAEL HAYDEN, FORMER CIA DIRECTOR: This group tied this murder to American policy in their rhetoric. Now, do you think, or does anybody really understand the situation in Iraq thinks that this group is not coming after us, is not coming after the West?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUTFELD: All right. So, your President Perino, what do you do? President Perino.

PERINO: First of all, I would not golf.

Let me -- in all seriousness, this is a quote from Tony Blinken. He's the deputy national security advisor, just two weeks ago on CNN, he said, "ISIS, their focus is not attacking on the U.S. homeland or our interests here in the United States or abroad. It's focused intently trying to create a caliphate in Iraq and a base from which overtime to operate. Right, to operate to do what?

Our interests are very much at play when it comes to all the things when it comes to all the things that have been mentioned here at the table.

I also want to mention a couple of other things. I'm for the drones, I'm for cutting off the money. I liked it when President Bush said, "You're either with us or you're against us." And so, it means if you're harboring any of these people -- the problem is, now I think some of our allies are harboring these people and they might not even realize it.

There are approximately 20,000 foreign fighters that have Western passports that have been trained to do what this British savage did to Jim Foley.

The other problem is the recruitment. ISIS has the most robust digital strategy. They built it along with their physical capability. Al Qaeda tried to build it on the back end and it didn't work as well. ISIS actually has it from the beginning.

So, while we need military tools and I'm all for that, but I do think the United States has to figure out a way to have a digital strategy that can disrupt the recruitment because that's what the video was about.

GUTFELD: What do you think, Kimberly, with the fact about the idea of these boomerang terrorists? They're here, they go, sooner or later, they're going to come back. So, isn't it better that we kill them there?

GUILFOYLE: The point is you've got to do the job all the way. You can't just say, well, we have been there long enough. The American people are weary. We checked a couple of polls. This doesn't sit well with our party or our constituents. I mean, that is so reckless and so irresponsible.

BECKEL: So, you're arguing for putting boots on the ground in Iraq?

GUILFOYLE: You know what, Bob? I'm for leaving all options open. Why do you tell the terrorists that we're not going to go all the way on this? They're not going to be cowering in hiding. They made that perfectly clear. And whether it's ISIL today or another group, where AQAP now that has pledged to ISIS, we can't just dismiss it and say, oh, don't take them so seriously.

Take them seriously. They are intent on doing us harm. They are not sitting there checking polls to determine whether or not they should continue with their jihad against the United States.

BECKEL: It may be late, but we're doing a lot right now. And intelligence is working on it. Allies are coming together. These guys have overstepped their ground and they brought the world together. I think what they're going to about to find out is the real serious end of the drone is like.

GUTFELD: I do think, though, that what Kimberly is getting at, when you talk to people in the military, sooner or later, you have to meet boots with boots. And you have to slaughter them. It's not about nation- building. It's about elimination and sometimes you can't do it from above.

So, you have to --

BECKEL: You may have -- I mean, the Saudis for example, would get into this with their military. They could do a hell of a good job.

GUTFELD: Yes.

All right. They're yelling at me.

Coming up, Missouri Governor Jay Nixon under fire after calling for a, quote, "vigorous prosecution" in the Ferguson shooting. But will a visit from our nation's top prosecutor, Eric Holder, helped bring this controversial case any closer to justice? Details next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BOLLING: Ferguson, Missouri, has been ripped apart with 12 days of protesting and rioting and looting. And now something even more divisive is bubbling up in Ferguson. Can they administer justice in a fair and impartial way?

Eric Holder is there representing the Department of Justice, and the county prosecutor who's in charge of this case is Robert McCullough. Two men, both with a race history. Eric Holder has openly admitted that race has dramatically impacted his life and county prosecutor McCullough's father, a cop, was killed by a black man.

Now add in the governor, surely Jay Nixon will be impartial, right? Right?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. JAY NIXON (D), MISSOURI: Ten days ago, a police officer shot and killed Michael Browning, in broad daylight, we have a responsibility to come together and do everything we can to achieve justice for this family, and a vigorous prosecution must now be pursued.

SHEPARD SMITH, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: "Justice for the deceased family and a vigorous prosecution." Isn't it possible that there might be a need for justice for this police officer, this police officer, Darren Wilson, who has said that he cannot even leave the house? Is it not possible that the justice should be for that police officer, in the -- or has this already been decided?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLLING: K.G....

GUILFOYLE: Yes.

BOLLING: ... has it already been decided?

GUILFOYLE: It's so irresponsible for that governor to make those comments. He is so ignorant he should be thrown out of office. He, in fact, is committing a crime himself, in my opinion, by making these reckless statements. He's essentially calling for vigilante justice.

Catch a clue. It's an investigation that has to go forward here and then a decision as to whether or not to prosecute will happen. Who does he think he is?

BOLLING: Wow. You're fired up today, K.G.

Greg, your thoughts on...

GUTFELD: I don't think I can follow up on that.

BOLLING: I don't know. Bias is everywhere here now.

GUTFELD: Well, one thing is -- I think almost in every single instance, Nixon has done the wrong thing. He's made a lot of mistakes, and if you make mistakes when you're terrified, and I think he's a bad leader because he's panicked, and so he's doing all the wrong things, based on the media coverage, not what's good for the community.

For example, this fact from the local CBS affiliate: 93 percent of those arrested in Ferguson are not Ferguson residents, and 27 percent don't even live in Missouri.

So it's the outsiders who are coming in and making this community unravel. It's not the fact that the cops aren't living there. It's the agitators that don't live there. The community is a victim to this, and he's responding to the outsiders, not to the insiders. He's a panic- stricken...

GUILFOYLE: Because he wants to get reelected, I'm sure. I mean, it's just outrageous. This is a guy who's an attorney for 30 years.

BECKEL: It's not the way to get -- it's not the way to get reelected in Missouri.

GUTFELD: How is security going to feel about him? You know, they He protect him, and he wouldn't protect them.

BOLLING: So -- so Dana, your thoughts on -- on -- you know, there's a lot of calls for Robert McCullough to recuse himself because of his father was a cop. He was shot by a black man. And then you have Eric Holder coming into the area.

How do -- how do you sort this out?

PERINO: I think it's unfair to the prosecutor because that says that he couldn't be impartial. That's like saying that I think that's unfair.

On the comments from Jay -- Governor Nixon, interesting. Think about this. They were drafted, so it's scripted. It was rehearsed. It was edited. And so they -- they knew exactly what they were doing, putting that on the teleprompter, and then he read it.

Then the spokesperson today started to backpedal and, actually, starting last night with Shep Smith when he was live at 11 p.m. They're trying to backpedal it then. They've been trying to clean it up all day. I just don't understand why everybody feels they got to do a video. Just stop talking. Do your work.

BECKEL: You know, one of the things that has happened is that the guilt has been established by blacks and whites.

The Pew Research study is very telling. Seventy percent of blacks believe that this guy -- this kid was murdered. And about 30 percent of whites believed that there was malfeasance on the part of the police. We don't know the answer to that. But one thing is clear to me, and that is that the people who live in that town, the outsiders are the ones that should be strung up.

But these guys, these people...

GUTFELD: Exactly.

BECKEL: ... their immediate reaction -- sorry. Their immediate reaction would be, and it would be mine, too. In fact, it probably is mine. Is that given the issue that they've had, and they're twice as likely to get stopped by cops, frisked, wait a second. And my immediate reaction is I buy it.

BOLLING: Can I ask you this very quickly? They want to wrap us.

PERINO: Bob, you don't know.

BECKEL: But I'm saying...

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: The same people who are saying it's a great idea for President Obama to send Eric Holder to the area, Eric Holder has a pass with race. He's very openly talked about how -- how it affected his life, you know, being looked at and being followed around in stores. Why are those same people saying, this guy McCullough should recuse himself because he has a past with race?

BECKEL: There's plenty of ways to recuse yourself. But I assume he doesn't believe he needs to be...

BOLLING: But it's the same people, Bob.

GUILFOYLE: Where's the basic fact (ph) for him to recuse himself? How offensive. So now the prosecutor is going to be labeled automatically a racist? I mean, it's so offensive.

BECKEL: All right. What they do...

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: ... have to wrap this up. But we have more on this directly ahead. Race relations take center stage in Ferguson, by why are some members of the black community fanning the flames of the firestorm? Our good friend Juan Williams is here to break down the causes of racial mistrust, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PERINO: Race has played a major role in Ferguson, but are outspoken members of the black community using credible facts to back up their rhetoric?

Director Spike Lee claims there's a war on black males, while journalist Jason Riley disagrees.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SPIKE LEE, FILM DIRECTOR: All this country did not trust what has happened. Something smells bad in Ferguson. It's not just tear gas.

It's a war on the black male, and it's tearing the country apart.

JASON RILEY, "WALL STREET JOURNAL": This whole idea that the police don't respect the value of black lives or America doesn't value black lives. What about these black thugs and the value they place on black lives? Where's the condemnation value they place on black lives in this community.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PERINO: Our colleague, Juan Williams, wrote a piece about this in "The Wall Street Journal" this morning, and he joins us from Washington.

Juan, can you tell us what you were arguing today in your op-ed that I read before the sun came up.

JUAN WILLIAMS, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Well, thanks for reading it, Dana. You know, the key point to me is that there are so many fears on either side of this, but there's a reality that we need to confront, which is that, if you look at the high level of violent crime, especially among young black men, that the interaction between police trying to control that and the young black men then becomes a window into all of our racial fears and paranoias.

I mean, on one side, I don't care if you're white, black, Hispanic whatever. Who would want to be around people, you know, 15 to 35, I think that, you know, they -- 90 percent of them are, you know, a high rate of murder. I think it's half of all black people in the country -- half of all the murders in the country are of black people, and 90 percent, I should say, of them are committed by other black people.

So you see, especially with murder as the No. 1 cause of death is what I was trying to say earlier, No. 1 cause of death among black men 15 to 35. I think a lot of people see that, especially among poor black males, there's a lot of violence. The police then become the thin blue line, and it causes anxiety. And it's not just in the white community; it's also in the black community.

BOLLING: So Juan -- it's Bolling. So I guess you're going to agree with Spike Lee, who says there's a war on black men, and I think you guys are pointing a finger at, among other things, the cops.

Meanwhile, the real war on black men is in the job market. It's in the economy. Forty-seven percent of young black men and women are out of work. The unemployment rate among blacks is almost triple that of whites.

I mean, why not point the finger at President Obama or the economic geniuses in D.C. who are keeping young black men out of the workforce, instead of the cops and the other things you're pointing out, which I'm not sure why you're doing that.

WILLIAMS: You know, Eric, I don't think you heard me so clearly. I'm not saying that there's any war on young black men. I think we made tremendous progress...

BOLLING: But you did. Spike Lee did, and you also just said that cops are arresting -- that the thin blue line aren't doing their jobs. Or you know...

WILLIAMS: No, I didn't.

BECKEL: That's not what he said.

WILLIAMS: No, that's not what I said. What I said was that I think for lots of people, especially, I think you know middle-class white America, they see themselves as wanting to support the police, because they see the police as the line between them and people who are involved in lots of violence and crime and don't want to be involved with it. Don't want to be threatened by it, feel scared of it. So no, that's what I was talking about.

BECKEL: Juan, let me ask you a question. The Pew Research study that came out today showing 70 percent of blacks believe that this kid was murdered by a cop, the reverse number for whites, don't you think that in Ferguson, that given the history with the police and the fact that they stop-- 90 percent of the stops are made on 67 percent of the people. And you're more likely to get your car searched, three times more likely if you're black than if you're white. That they probably have reached a determination when they heard this, said, "Yes, that makes sense. They probably did it."

WILLIAMS: Yes, I think that's exactly right. You know, it's a circling the wagons phenomenon in the black community. I think you see it after every time there's a major case like this Rodney King, or Trayvon Martin, anything.

Because people are just like, you know what? They're afraid. They're going to -- you know, they're going to make judgments about all of us, that we're all going to be now subject to the stops that you're talking about, the stop in your car, driving while black, stop and frisk. You know, and they shoot somebody and they say, "Oh, well he was a black guy."

Well, you know, I mean, like I'm pals with all of you. You know me as a human being. But you know, to a cop, especially if I, like I'm walking out the gym and I'm looking kind of raggedy, they might like, "Hey, who's that black guy? Was he involved with something?" That's unsettling.

But I think that what you're seeing there is a circling the wagons phenomenon. I don't think that, if you stop and talk to people, as I said earlier, I think people in the black community know it, maybe more so than the people in the white community, that those young men who are still involved with crime are a threat to us all.

GUTFELD: Juan, it's Greg, your good friend. Could it be that the reason why more blacks are stopped in this community is because there are more blacks in the community?

WILLIAMS: Yes, that's -- I think that's not -- I think if you look at the statistics, I think that's way out of proportion.

BECKEL: Way out of proportion.

WILLIAMS: Yes. But I think you're right. I mean, obviously now the community is, I think, three-quarters black. Is it?

BECKEL: Ninety-three, 67.

GUILFOYLE: But aren't we doing -- real quick, aren't we doing people a disservice here, especially the police officers who serve, by assuming that they're all prejudiced, they're racist, they're only out there...

BECKEL: Those are assumptions.

GUILFOYLE: No, I'm not saying...

BECKEL: Why do you -- where do you come up with this sweeping crack about what liberals say?

BOLLING: Because Bob, Juan just...

GUILFOYLE: I didn't say liberal, and one, I'm following up on this conversation.

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: ... backtracked on it, but then he went back and followed it with, yes, they're being stopped in disproportion...

BECKEL: And they are. They are.

BOLLING: Isn't that a bias right there? Aren't you accusing...

BECKEL: A bias, yes. The answer is yes.

GUILFOYLE: But that's the point. That's an ignorant statement.

BECKEL: In Ferguson, black people...

(CROSSTALK)

GUILFOYLE: You're assuming that all police officers wake up in the morning, they get up and say, how can I screw over somebody in the African- American community? I think that is not fair.

(CROSSTALK)

GUILFOYLE: It is same prejudice that they have fought so hard to be free from.

BECKEL: ... works 50 feet -- a woman who works 50 feet from here got -- her husband was playing basketball, got out in his own car, and he got thrown up against the car by two white cops, because he was black and he was sweaty. But he had his keys in his hand. Now what does that tell you?

GUILFOYLE: Juan, do you want to have one last quick word?

WILLIAMS: Well, I just think that it's important to remember, you know, so given the high rate of violence and the high rate of crimes connected to black people, the cops then, you know, will say, "Oh, well, it's a black guy."

And I think people have to fight those stereotypes, and I think the cops have to fight them too. Nobody's saying it's a matter of racism. It's a matter of easy snap judgments that really hurt black people.

But I think the key point is, everybody's on edge, paranoid about racial anger and racial fears, and we need to be straight with each other if we want to actually get something out of this experience.

PERINO: OK, Juan. Thank you so much for joining us.

WILLIAMS: My pleasure.

PERINO: Just in time for back to school, we may have found the worst commercial of all time. We're going to show you that ad when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BECKEL: I just love this job. Here it is, we talk about horrible beheadings, we talk about race relations, we talk about Ferguson, and now my block gets to be some ridiculous ad about going back to school in Missouri. That's what's good about it.

Take a look at this ad and see if you think it's as bad as our producers do. Take a look, it's bad. Go ahead. Go.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Go back to school.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Denim, haircuts.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Backpacks, backpacks, come get your backpacks.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Boots and pants and boots and pants.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Get yourself an outfit.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Denim.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Boots and pants and boots and pants.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Haircuts.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): New shoes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Go get yourself back to school,

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): East Hills.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (singing): Haircut.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BECKEL: OK, Dana. You said you're going to defend those singers?

PERINO: Here's the thing. I love local news. I love local commercials. I think that they are just -- the show the fabric of America. And you know what? We're all going to be singing that song all night long, so it worked. I don't think they deserve worst commercial. I think they deserve. ... Look at that, haircuts.

BECKEL: It's a very important topic and I think the idea that south hills mall here, East Hills, whatever it is.

GUILFOYLE: I mean, Bob, it's on the screen.

BECKEL: Yes, who cares.

But listen, look, apparently it's doing well because they're doing a lot of people coming -- you can say a lot about the people who are in there, but nonetheless, a lot of them are going in to shop.

GUILFOYLE: Worst commercial ever, worst block ever. Perfect.

BECKEL: What?

GUILFOYLE: What?

BECKEL: When I want to watch someone else talk, the first thing I do is ask Dana what she thought. Greg, you want to talk?

GUTFELD: I think this is amazing. Because it makes our show look less like a train wreck.

GUILFOYLE: Less. Less like a train wreck.

BECKEL: Eric, you want to talk? Come on, let's talk.

BOLLING: The best part of that whole ad is -- and Dana will watch this -- boots and pants, and boots and pants, and boots and pants. Is that inside baseball?

PERINO: The only thing about that is that I think you're going to stop saying it now.

BOLLING: No, because this allows me to say, "Boots and pants and boots and pants and boots." Dana...

GUTFELD: Shouldn't school be year round, really? Shouldn't it be year round? Enough of this back to school.

BECKEL: Oh, don't talk about the substance of education. We're talking about the fall. Come on!

GUTFELD: Should school be year round? Summer's over.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, you know what? You know why?

BECKEL: They'll probably raise your rate 10 percent, but the mall's doing damn well.

GUILFOYLE: School should be year round.

BECKEL: Yes, that should have happened. All should close down and those people ought to go sing in ones (ph).

GUILFOYLE: The South Hills Mall.

BECKEL: I knew you were probably up for that one segment there. It's usual for me, so let's go to "One More Thing."

GUILFOYLE: You butchered that segment. That was -- woo! -- bad.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GUILFOYLE: You want some more, don't you? Time now for "One More Thing" -- E.B.

BOLLING (singing): Haircuts

(speaking): Just kidding.

GUILFOYLE (singing): Outfits.

BOLLING: So at the end of the day, K.G. brought Chris Christie dancing onstage with Jamie Foxx. Here was also from that evening. John McCain dancing. Do we have a little of that? Do we have that? We have that?

Doing the robot.

GUILFOYLE: OK.

BOLLING: Busting a move there.

GUILFOYLE: Amazing.

BOLLING: So I thought we'd put them both together. Can we get McCain on one side and Christie on the other side? And we report, you decide. And who do you like better? Which one do you -- which one do you like?

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God. It's like a karate move.

PERINO: You know who's laughing so hard right now? President Obama.

GUILFOYLE: The robot?

BECKEL: You don't think they hit the bar before they hit the dance floor, do you?

BOLLING: That's all. Let us know. Go to our Facebook page. Let us know who won.

GUILFOYLE: Feel yo-self. Dana.

PERINO: OK. There's a big American debate happening right now. It's happening in music. Taylor Swift, huge country music star, amazing young woman. She officially went from country to pop. She's got a new video called "Shake It Off." It's from her "1989" album, 1989 being the year she was born, not the year before I graduated high school. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TAYLOR SWIFT, MUSICIAN (SINGING): My ex- man brought his new girlfriend. She's like, "Oh, my God." I'm just going to shake it. Through the phone over there (ph) with the hella good hair, why don't you come on over baby? We can shake, shake, shake. Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PERINO: America, you have to let me know. Tweet me, Dana -- @DanaPerino. Let me know, do you think this is a good idea? We're losing Taylor Swift to pop. I don't know.

GUILFOYLE: Her fans...

PERINO: Big deal.

GUILFOYLE: ... are going to buy it regardless.

OK, oh, it's my turn. I was going to go to you, Greg. OK, so, speaking of music, the NFL is now asking musicians to pay to be part of the Super Bowl.

PERINO: Wow.

GUILFOYLE: And guess what? The musicians said, "No thank you." So take a look here. Rihanna, Katy Perry, Coldplay, said, "Will you contribute part of the proceeds, you know, and give it back to the NFL?" Who's going to want to do that? Since when is the NFL a charity, I ask you? Yes, it's a little bizarre.

BOLLING: It's a big stage, though. I think it's a mistake.

GUILFOYLE: But they're big stars.

BOLLING: I know, and they're -- you're correct. But trust me: you perform at halftime, and you are an immediate big star.

GUILFOYLE: The point is you're supposed to be, like, psyched to be able to go there to begin with. Go ahead.

BECKEL: Well, mine is about a fellow named Herman Goldman, who is 101 years old. This is his birthday. Herman, congratulations. And this is the big story here. He's still working. He's in the -- been in the same plant factory in New Jersey, wonderful New Jersey, for 73 years, and the only person I know who will do it that long is Bill O'Reilly.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my gosh. You've now done it. Yes, cool, great job, Bob.

Greg, are you going to eat those?

GUTFELD: Now it's time for...

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GUTFELD: "Greg's Secret to Happiness."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUTFELD: So look what I found in the vending machine at FOX News. Chuckles.

GUILFOYLE: Or did you make one?

GUTFELD: Know why it's the secret to happiness? If there are Chuckles in the vending machine, that means there are people who like Chuckles, which means there's a person for everybody.

GUILFOYLE: OK, but hole on. One of those is missing. Did you eat it?

GUTFELD: No, it just.

PERINO: I have to say, that's not my favorite candy.

BECKEL: Can I have them?

GUTFELD: Sure. You can have them, Bob.

PERINO: OH, that's a great idea.

GUTFELD: They go in your mouth, Bob.

GUILFOYLE: Don't touch them: I want the red ones.

BECKEL: Oh, it's too hard.

GUILFOYLE: Set your DVR so you never miss an episode of "The Five." "Special Report" is next.

BECKEL: Of course she takes it. Yes, OK.

GUILFOYLE: We'll see you right back here tomorrow.

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