This is a rush transcript from "The Five," April 15, 2014. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Greg Gutfeld, along with Andrea Tantaros, Bob Beckel, Eric Bolling, and she uses a candy land board as a jogging track -- it's Dana Perino.
This is "The Five."
GUTFELD: Yay, it's Tax Day! Or for 70 million households -- Tuesday. Because for them, they pay no federal income tax so they are left wondering why everyone is at the post office sweating through their shirts.
I don't blame them. I envy them. A tax form to them is like a coupon for Head and Shoulders if you're bald.
This is how dependence works. Big government is grand if you don't feel its hand.
Not that I don't love taxes. Without them, how would people like Harry Reid thrive? Useless and productive society hucksters rely on us as their welfare. Reid and his ilk look at America and see millions of wallets and purses ready to be picked to perpetuate their power.
See, my theory of government is really simple -- it's all about the street. Government should keep things off the street -- thugs, the insane, invading armies -- and keep things on the street like cement and lamp posts. Everything else we can handle.
Which is why I'm bummed that 110 days of my salary goes directly into the mouth of a blob that turns my efforts into useful poop.
So today the IRS chuckles. And they can laugh, because as they target conservative groups while billions of taxes go unpaid by federal employees, it's you who has to worry. The cost of ticking them off? Jail time. That's April 15th for you.
It's not about filing, but force. Not taxes, but axes. And once that ax becomes untethered from reason or fairness, it's you who feels the blade.
That was a shout-out to Wesley Snipes.
Bob, went to jail over taxes and I had to explain it which makes it not worth it. Bob, the president has proposed 442 tax increases. I don't think that's enough.
BOB BECKEL, CO-HOST: Well, I'm sure you don't think it's enough. Let's take -- be honest here about this, if you take Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid, which are three entitlements that I think generally have massive amount of support in the country and you put defense in and you put the interest of the national debt, about 90-some percent of the tax in this country are --
BECKEL: -- necessary. You have to do it.
So, you're arguing a very small percentage of it. And the biggest tax -- the people with the biggest tax deductions in the country are corporations.
GUTFELD: All right. But the thing is you called Social Security an entitlement, which it's not. It's not an entitlement.
BECKEL: Well, that's the way the government lists it.
GUTFELD: Yes, but I don't list it that way, because that's my money that they are taking and flushing down the toilet when it could be invested into some accounts of some kind.
ANDREA TANTAROS, CO-HOST: It probably won't be there for you either, when you're eligible.
GUTFELD: No, it won't. In fact, I would like -- I would give up my Social Security right now even after paying all that, and say that will be my tax, how's that?
ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: Call it even?
BOLLING: Call it even because I know I'm not going to see.
Eric, we talked about this. We talked about it before. Isn't there a better way or a more fair way to deal with taxes?
BOLLING: Yes, the last line in your monologue is a fair way. And the fair tax -- and I've said this before, I love the fair tax, people come out of the woodwork and say, what's wrong with you? But the fair tax for me is the one that's most fair that would make the most sense. You eliminate the IRS completely. There's no federal income tax whatsoever.
It's a 23 percent or so consumption tax. You pay it whether you are a businessman, talk show host or a pimp on the street. Everyone pays.
You pay 22 percent. But you don't have an IRS. And also, you keep your full paycheck.
And the other thing is, it gets government, it takes the power away from government. It takes that force, that axe you are talking about and takes it out of their hands. It untethers from the government.
You don't want a product, don't buy it. You don't pay tax.
GUTFELD: I love that.
BECKEL: Does 23 percent include everybody, including people who are poor?
DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: No, there's a way that you can give a credit if you're low income --
BOLLING: It's a prebate. So, if you are lower income or in poverty, you are actually paid for a reasonable amount of expenses, taxes that you would pay on products to stay alive, you know, food, energy, and those things.
TANTAROS: The problem with that is it takes the blade squarely out of the hands of the government and puts it into lobbyists who then lobby the government for their own special carve-outs, for their own special industries and turns the U.S. tax code which is basically what we have now, which is the Swiss cheese.
They tried this in New York. I'm more of a flat tax person myself.
Simpson-Bowles, they also were in favor of three brackets. I didn't love the brackets. But it was the good area to start.
The problem I don't like is what happened in New York with the fair tax, lobbyists got their way. And then you had taxes on large marshmallows, but not small marshmallows. Certain beverages like Yoo-hoo, but not all chocolate milk.
That's the problem now, is that it's too unfair and it's not simple enough. So, that's why I'm for more for the flat tax.
BOLLING: Can I defend fair tax a little bit? The true -- if you go to fairtax.org, there aren't different levels. You buy a product, you consumer product, you pay 23 percent.
TANTAROS: But that's in a perfect world. We live in a world where government is corrupt and lobbyists get their way. We saw this with ObamaCare bill. Certain lobbyists get to government and they get their own special carve-outs and the people, who deserve it the most, like say the middle class, aren't really getting necessarily a fair tax. It's actually not that fair.
GUTFELD: Dana, we talked about the height tax for some time, that the shorter are, you should pay less.
PERINO: It really should be fair. I mean, you really take a plus room.
GUTFELD: Yes. And studies show that taller people make more money.
So, it would only make sense that we get taxed less.
But I'm more interested in the FOX News poll. This is a very interesting poll. Surveys showed that people are most angry about paying taxes. It isn't the amount but the way it's spent.
So, the complainers aren't greedy, they are angry over government's incompetence.
PERINO: Right. And also, and they see reports of fraud. Whether the percentage of fraud is bigger or smaller than people think, they think it's there and they think the government is not doing enough to deal with that.
Interestingly, there is bipartisan consensus that the way to deal with all of these issues on the left and the right is through some sort of tax reform, be it a fair tax or the flat tax. There actually was a big movement in the late `90s to get that done and I think maybe it is time to do it. If you look at all of the numbers that it pays 111 days to pay your taxes before you start earning for yourself, it's not that people don't want to pay taxes. I think if it was more transparent and fair, the other thing I really like about one of those two tax reforms, it takes the cronyism out of Washington, D.C.
But that is only if you do something like what Estonia did, they had a clean slate. They got to design the tax program that they want and they went with 15 percent sales tax and it take something like a three-fifths vote of the parliament to change that, and that was impossible to do. So, their economy thrives.
I know our economy is a lot larger and more complicated than Estonia.
But talking to some people today, you could actually implement this in three to five years, and we wouldn't have to all of the headaches that we deal with every April 15th.
BOLLING: Can I address the flat tax? You still need the IRS. You still need for them to decide which deductions are fair which are going to get approved or which one aren't, and so you are going to have your whole lobbying group doing that as well.
TANTAROS: What do you mean? You can't really lobby. If there's three separate brackets like Simpson-Bowles put in their plan -
BOLLING: So, a tax bracket will have deductions in a flat tax, right?
TANTAROS: Are you saying there's a reality of getting rid of the IRS?
BOLLING: Yes. That's exactly --
TANTAROS: Again, we're talking like -- this is like --
BOLLING: You don't need an IRS.
TANTAROS: It's fantasia land. That would be great in theory. But it's not going to happen.
So, let's see what we can do and Democrats and Republicans get together --
BOLLING: It's like saying ObamaCare is not getting repealed. It could.
TANTAROS: -- and said that there's three brackets. That's what I said before. I didn't love Simpson-Bowles brackets. But, look, if you make $100, flat tax, you pay 10 bucks. Easy, no lobbyist corruption, period, end of story.
BECKEL: Dana said something before the show start I think is exactly right. In order for them to happen, somebody has got to run on it. A presidential candidate has got to run on it and make it the centerpiece of what they're doing. I think the public would be receptive to it.
Now, one of things you can do on either one of these flat tax or on consumption tax is you make it non-amenable without a super majority of the Congress to go along with it.
PERINO: Yes, that's true.
BECKEL: Now, if you do that, you can knockout most of the lobbyists.
I think that would work. If you did that, if you said on the consumption tax, all right, you want to try to get an exception here, get 75 percent of the House and the Senate to agree on it. It would never happen.
TANTAROS: Here's another political reality though and I think this is the bigger problem. This administration is creating a permanent welfare state for the middle class. They're making it more enviable for people to stop working. My sister called me the other day, she goes, some woman just called up she got health benefits, she said, I'm going to go just under 35 hours because I can get the subsidy and only pay 15 bucks a month for health care.
How is the Republican going to get that voter?
TANTAROS: If people are on the dole, they're not going to see the IRS is bad, because they have no skin in the game, which is what you just mentioned in your monologue.
BOLLING: This is may all be water under the bridge, as you pointed out, 70 million households don't pay any tax at all. That's about 45 percent of America. Which meets you hit 50.1 percent, you are never going to get the change that Bob is talking about because you won't get the votes to do.
You won't get the people in Congress because the people who don't pay income tax, love the system. This is a perfect system for them.
BECKEL: Did you notice that poll also said that second biggest complaint was that rich people don't pay enough?
BOLLING: So --
PERINO: Well, I think all these polls, every year, though, they're going to say the same thing. People are going to -- some -- the people who pay taxes are going to say they're too high and the people that don't are going to say that the rich should pay more. There's probably not too surprising.
There is one interesting thing that I think is worth discussion for our government and if I were Republicans I will pick it up. And it's this idea that senior citizens who decide to continue to work after age 65 and don't retire early, or have a part-time job, that they wouldn't have to pay the payroll tax after certain age, like after age 60.
I think that makes a lot of sense, that way you get incentivize people to continue working. You get the benefit of senior citizens expertise and they have more flexibility because they're not going to see -- they're not going to spend their Social Security benefits past age 100, let's say, if they are lucky. So I think there are some things public policy-wise that we could do that would make taxes make a lot more sense for everybody involved.
GUTFELD: Lastly, hasn't the IRS suffered a lot. It's hard for us to take them seriously when they are asking for our money when they're not -- when they are allowing 300,000 federal employees to get out of paying $3.5 billion.
BOLLING: Can I throw one idea out there? Why don't we all pay what President Obama pays? Let's pay his tax rate.
PERINO: The 19.1 percent?
BOLLING: Nineteen-point-one percent, that's right. I'll sign up for that tomorrow.
BECKEL: Let's also keep in mind that under our current tax laws, more money is deducted than is collected. In other words, if you actually collected the tax you were supposed to collect, there's now more deductions
PERINO: Yes, but you have to pay a tax preparer -- it probably comes out as a wash because you have to pay a tax preparer who knows all those rules, so that by the time you save all the money, you've actually paid somebody to figure out all the money you should save.
GUTFELD: President Obama must have the best accountant on the plant because 19 percent.
TANTAROS: And the people at the IRS have the best boss, because they are getting bonuses for all their tax collections.
PERINO: And also, the other huge problem is refund fraud. And now, all these people put in. They pay today and the fraudsters are out, that are actually taking that refund money and the IRS seem unable to get a handle on that situation either.
GUTFELD: All right.
PERINO: So there.
GUTFELD: There you go. That was uplifting.
Coming up, a warning from the senate's majority leader from the nation's most infamous cattle rancher. Harry Reid's message for Mr. Bundy next on "The Five."
BOLLING: The United States government versus the Nevada rancher, Cliven Bundy, and Bundy with the backing of a grassroots swell from freedom fighters and a slew of TV cameras successfully got the feds to back down.
But a U.S. senator from Nevada has a warning for the Bundys and America.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. HARRY REID, D-NEV.: It's not over. We cannot have an American people who violate the law and walk away from it. So, it's not over.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLLING: Cliven and Aman Bundy were on "Hannity" last night and responded to Senator Harry Reid's threat this way.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLIVEN BUNDY, RANCHER: I don't have a response for Harry Reid but I have a response for every sheriff across the United States. Every county sheriff across the United States -- disarm the federal bureaucrat, take the federal bureau -- federal United States bureaucrats guns away.
UNIDENTIFEID MALE: I don't think there's any hope for him. He needs to be kick out of office even if he is a Senate majority leader.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLLING: Yes. So, Bobby, what do you think about that? I mean, there are a lot of issues here. States' rights, you know? Plus, a lot of people showed up and a lot of cameras rolling.
Where do you fall on this?
BECKEL: Well, Reid is right, that it's not over and they're going to have to do something to get this done. Not only are there 16,000 people who use federal land and pay their fees, but the Nevada cattlemen's association which represents cattlemen in that state, refuse to endorse Bundy. He does not have the support he needs to make a change and change has got to be -- he's got to change the law that says that grazing land belongs to the state of Nevada. It's been tried before and wasn't passed.
It won't pass again.
BOLLING: And I keep thinking this. OK. So, they are going after this Bundy guy for a couple hundred thousand of bucks. They are millions of -- millions upon millions of illegals here, we're spending a lot of our tax money in our emergency rooms, coming over day. Greg, should they be going after Bundy?
GUTFELD: Reid should treat him like an undocumented alien and declare amnesty.
No, you know, OK, one of the Bundy fellows actually said something, nailed it on the head, said Reid should be out of office. What he's talking about -- it's not really about cowboys, it's about candidates. You got to -- in order, you don't win these battles, you win elections. And they lose to Harry Reid because they did not have a good candidate.
I can't remember a name, Sharron Angle? Yes, if you guys want to change the landscape, you've got to find candidates who can win and then you don't have to worry about Harry Reid. That's the problem.
We don't want to focus too much on this battle. We should see that the bigger battle is at the ballot box.
BOLLING: And, Dana, shouldn't Harry Reid should be weighing on this especially what we know about -- not only his son, some rumors of his son maybe doing some deals in China. And --
PERINO: I know, but, Eric, those were debunked. I mean, there's really not --
BOLLING: What about his staffer?
PERINO: I don't know. I've read nothing that says definitively from a credible source that there is a connection and I think that people have -
- he works at beyond, but he was confirmed by the United States Senate 71 to like 20. So, I think you got bipartisan support and there are good staffers out there.
I think wishful thinking is one of the conservatives' biggest enemies and in this case, Harry Reid, in particular, just can't help himself. He never -- I don't think he should have used that tone. I think he could have said, I appreciate that the White House and the Interior Department and the governor and the cattlemen are all working together to reach a solution. Good-bye.
Instead, he has to be Mr. Tough Guy with black glasses and antagonize people further just as everybody had worked together to kind of back off the situation and allow the courts to do what they are going to do with the situation.
BOLLING: And, Ands, I saw Judge Napolitano on earlier saying, you know, what they could have done. They could just garnish, when Mr. Bundy, when the father passes away, when they do the estate, dropped the estate down to the children, they can take what they are owned.
TANTAROS: Yes, there is a path of less resistance for the government.
I think I said last week, garnish his wages, put a lien on property that he does own. It seems to me like the government wanted to provoke. I know he didn't pay his fees, so they have been patient with him, but seizing the cattle in the most dramatic fashion.
PERINO: During calving season.
TANTAROS: I just don't think it's a winning issue for Harry Reid. Now, I know why he's doing it because he's recently been in the headlines for sketchy campaign money being funneled to family members. And so, he probably want the headline of Nevada off of him. But again, why would he stick his nose in something that just from a PR perspective does not look right.
It looks like the government is bullying this cattle farmer Mr. Bundy, who I'm very sympathetic with. He's just trying to make a living. So many cattle farmers have gone out of business. But again, he's got to change the law. It's not OK to break the law if you don't like it.
BECKEL: I don't feel sorry for the guy at all. He's a tax dodge. He ought to be subpoenaed. He ought to be indicted. The fact of the matter is the people who don't want to see this happen is the 16,000 ranchers who use federal lands and get a cut --
PERINO: Do you feel the same about Sharpton?
GUTFELD: Or the federal employees --
PERINO: Al Sharpton owes $1.9 million and the president went to an event praising him just like Friday.
BECKEL: If that's the case, they ought to take everything --
PERINO: Take his cattle? I mean, what are they going to take on Al Sharpton?
BECKEL: Why should we all here apologize for a guy who's breaking the law?
BOLLING: So, Ands, where are you on amnesty for illegal immigrants?
Where are you?
BECKEL: I'm for a program that --
BECKEL: Why do you keep bringing these things in here? This has nothing to do --
BOLLING: Because they don't pay any tax. Bob, they are tax dodgers also.
BECKEL: You know who uses most illegal aliens? Are ranchers and farmers.
BOLLING: I'm simply saying, if you're OK, if you have a problem with the rancher for not paying his, quote-unquote, "taxes" --
BOLLING: -- don't you have the same problems with illegals who aren't paying any tax whatsoever?
BECKEL: Well, first of all, do pay a lot of sales tax and they pay a lot of other things, and they also work.
TANTAROS: Don't you think this is a little harsh, seizing of the cattle with all the cameras there?
BECKEL: No, no. They have gone on 20 years with this guy. How much long you're going to go?
TANTAROS: Bob, it seems like they are deliberately provoking, being provocative.
BECKEL: Maybe by bringing those trucks out there and those guns.
They shouldn't have done that. But the fact is you can't let this guy running roughshod because he is the guy you feel sympathetic for you. To hell with him, he broke the law.
GUTFELD: You know who is laughing right now? The tortoise. They have a very weird laugh. You can hear it at night.
BOLLING: All right. We leave it right there.
Ahead, President Obama talks to comrade Vlad on the phone about tensions in Ukraine, days after a Russian jet buzzed one of our warships in the Black Sea. But should he stop talking and start taking action, next.
PERINO: Heavy gunfire at an airport today in eastern Ukraine after the government managed to take back control from members of a pro-Russian militia.
Yesterday, President Obama spoke on the phone with Vladimir Putin about his country's support for militia members. The White House says he expressed grave concern. Over the weekend, a Russian fighter made multiple passes at close range near an American warship in the Black Sea, a move that the Pentagon calls provocative.
Jay Carney was asked whether it may be an indication that the foreign policy isn't working.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: Is there a sense in the administration and in the European capitals in which you are collaborating and dealing with, that what is going on is not working? That whatever signals you are sending, they are either not being heeded or misread and this entire approach, which is to not escalate isn't working?
JAY CARNEY, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: No, Major, because the premise of the question is based on the notion that all the United States ever has to do when something happens in the world that we don't like is say "stop it" and they'll stop.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: Bob, by all accounts, tensions are very high and on either side there could be a miscalculation and a provocation that could escalate this into actual warfare, civil war in Ukraine. What do you think?
BECKEL: Well, first of all, I think a couple of things here we should take note of and that is the unrest in the Ukraine itself or these pro- Russian demonstrators that Putin had the gall to ask Obama to please help stop these people from being protesters for doing it to these protests.
Already, they've taken one town in Ukraine.
I think the answer now is very interesting. They sent John Brennan, who is the head of the CIA, over this weekend. I think what you're beginning to see is an idea that we're going to move beyond economic sanctions into more military-oriented, giving Ukraine military capability that they may need, whether it's for anti-helicopter missiles or other kinds of things.
It's time I think now to escalate in terms of military action within the Ukraine itself, and let the Ukraine army take care of it.
PERINO: But do you think, Greg, it's too little too late at this point?
GUTFELD: Yes, I don't think there ever was an approach. I think it was more like a retreat. America is a global power that decided that, you know, we want to concentrate on ourselves. I want to work on myself instead. That's what Obama said.
But burying your head in the sand doesn't make the ocean go away.
Putin saw that opportunity. He saw the president as a beta-male, more obsessed with Sandra Fluke than actual security, and he took advantage of it.
And, by the way, old beliefs die hard. If you think that America was a bad guy in the `70s and the `80s, you think you are going to change your mind -- I'm not talking about Putin.
PERINO: Ah-ha. I get it. Give me a minute, though.
Eric, let me ask you about an info surge. So, the CIA's John Brennan goes -- one of the concerns was United States wasn't sharing information intel, and that you have pro-Russian forces there. It was actually Vladimir Putin who made the request to Obama to have a phone call last night.
I feel like from communications strategy, that they are outfoxing us.
BOLLING: They are. I think maybe they have their ear on the ground.
I think America is divided on this. I think, you know, it's one of those issues -- there are a couple float around where really, it's not right left divided. It's divided how you see where our foreign policy should be.
I -- believe it or not, I think Obama is playing this the right way.
I think he's keeping his distance. You know, what's going on --
PERINO: But they argue that they're not.
BOLLING: Who is?
PERINO: The White House argues that their policy is working. That's what Jay Carney is saying.
BOLLING: And I'm agreeing with them.
PERINO: You agree that their policy is working. But do you disagree what the policy is from their perspective?
BOLLING: I don't even disagree what they are doing. If Europe -- if the rest of Europe -- if Western Europe is not involved and Germany isn't involved --
PERINO: But my point is White House says they are involved, and that they're heavily involved, and we're doing all of the right things.
BOLLING: And I'm -- but that's my point. I think we're OK, and my point is -- maybe you are surprised to hear me say that, but even with the unrest that's going on within Ukraine, that's not Russian forces. Russian forces are on the border. They are not entering Ukraine doing this. This is happening from within.
BECKEL: These are Russian agents doing the work in the Ukraine. I mean, come on.
TANTAROS: Sent there by Vladimir Putin himself.
PERINO: I think we have to be very clear eyed about that, Andrea.
Let me ask you if you think that on the intel side of things, was that enough or should we maybe unleash Google and Twitter to go on and like be the voice where Vladimir Putin has shut down access to free information?
TANTAROS: You know, I'm not sure he cares about that. I mean, ultimately, yes, he's winning the PR battle, but he wants to take over these former Soviet countries. So, I don't think Twitter would scare him.
I do not think Obama should be involved with this Russian issue, but I do disagree what they have done up to this point. If you look at the Reagan handled it, he put intermediate nukes right in Western Europe. He did it so that they wouldn't have to have this debate in the country that we're having now which is, should we send troops in.
They shame here too is that we are following the lead of the E.U. They tossed aside their defense budgets in favor of a welfare state. We're doing that.
Greg mentioned the president is like, yes, we're going to stay here and work on ourselves, while we're, quote, "more flexible with you guys and we're going to downsize our army".
So, I actually think by saying we're cutting our defense budget, focusing more on the welfare state -- I think up until now the president has failed. And it's a shame because the Ukraine is a fairly Western country unlike Turkey. It should be in NATO. But now, because of a feckless E.U. and a feckless President Obama, it won't be and that's why we're in not --
BECKEL: In fairness to that, it was the Ukrainians when they have this new president who pulled out their request for NATO. Poland has said we should put NATO troops there, they can't get the rest of the NATO to agree.
But I've got to correct you on just one thing -- I hate to do it -- but those intermediate missiles go there in `79 and `80, they did not go there because of President Ronald Reagan.
GUTFELD: But I mean, the point is --
BECKEL: They didn't.
TANTAROS: Yes, they did.
BECKEL: They did not. Harold Brown did that. He was the secretary of defense.
GUTFELD: But I think the point is this feud was supposed to be behind us because of peace through strength. We put out a visage that was intimidating. But it turns the reset button actually reset the Cold War.
Obama is a like doctor who brings back the measles. I mean, this is stuff we shouldn't be worrying about.
PERINO: I also don't think that we need to have a policy of war or ignore. I think there is a middle ground. And last November when -- in the United States when we were working on ourselves and we were working -- the president was working on the fact that the Web site for his health care bill had completely crash, that was when the Ukrainians actually voted for Yanukovych who ran on closer economic ties with the European Union. We didn't do enough to help them at that point and now, I think, this is why we've come to this point.
MATTHEWS: And I also, I would not worry about the Cold War. I hate to say this, but I will more than happy to say it -- Russian is a feckless ineffective country.
TANTAROS: But the spread of the E.U. and NATO was huge Putin goal was to get them to back off --
BECKEL: And they didn't.
TANTAROS: -- and he got his way. So, on a global stage, Putin is winning and we're not.
BECKEL: Well, he lost -- Poland became part of NATO, Estonia. I mean, everything except the Ukraine.
TANTAROS: That's what really scares him, Bob. That's what really frightens him and we waved our hand and said, oh, we don't know.
BECKEL: Why are you worried about the Russians? What in the world could they possibly do except cut off oil to Eastern Europe?
TANTAROS: Well, you're right. It's a terribly country except for its nukes masked the realities.
BECKEL: That's what they've got.
TANTAROS: It sends a message to every other scary world leader like Iran that we have a very wimpy administration.
PERINO: All right. Still to come on "The Five," Boston and the nation remembers the victims of last year's marathon bombing, one year to the day, next.
(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)
TANTAROS: A day of remembrance in Boston today, where exactly one year ago, two bombs tore through the city's marathon, killing three and injuring more than 260.
(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)
TANTAROS: Vice President Biden attended the service to mark the anniversary earlier. President Obama held a moment of silence behind closed doors at the White House.
The 2014 marathon will take place in Boston on Monday.
So, are we any safer from these kinds of attacks one year later?
Dana, I'm going to go to you first on this. There was a recent report in The Washington Times that cited that the chances of terrorists getting into this country aren't as great as they used to. President Bush did a great job bolstering our national security. However, now with the Internet, the real threats are terrorists like the Tsarnaev brothers, this radicalization that anybody can do.
Are we more susceptible to that kind of terrorist attack with people living inside the United States of America?
PERINO: I think it's hard to say and we have to put our trust in the government and the men and women in uniform and also in civilian or intel operations to try to keep us safe.
But the lone wolf is the terrorist is the one that is -- could be most dangerous. They might not be able to pull off huge attacks where you have thousands of casualties like you did on 9/11, but it is pretty remarkable that a domestic terror attack involving an Islamic extremist happened in the United States during a major American event, and aside from the initial coverage, it's something that people have sort of forgotten about.
That's why it's important for us to think about this anniversary and to continue to press our government officials to find out, OK. So, what are we doing? If the lone wolf is the biggest threat, what are we doing to track down people like the Tsarnaev brothers before they can act?
TANTAROS: Eric, one of the reasons we didn't get one of the -- or the brothers, I should say, is because someone working in intelligence did not spell their name correctly and there's reports that the Russians didn't share the right details with us. Well, we can't really rely them, we're realizing that.
You've been pretty vocal about how the administration has approached capturing terrorists by spying on Americans.
Do you think that's the right way to go?
BOLLING: Look, here's what I think. I think we need to beef up the way we find these homegrown cells. We have to go on the Internet. We need the smartest people working, doing exactly what they need to be doing.
As long as they're -- you are looking for the right people. Like we've talk about before, I don't want to get into this whole discussion tonight, but I don't believe there should be a dragnet over all of America.
Here's the scary part though. It doesn't matter how much money or resources you put at this, when a guy puts together a bomb in a pressure cooker and walks to the Boston marathon and leaves it in his dorm door, and it leaves it and blows off and kills -- you're never -- it's just never not going to happen.
The sad part is we live in an open society which is perfect. But we're going to have now go -- Bob and I went to the Super Bowl, it took an hour and a half to get through security. And we had passes. It probably took three hours just to get through security if you were just showing up for the game.
That's the sad reality we have going forward.
TANTAROS: Greg, the conversation since Boston has not been an honest one about radical Islam. Even in the days and weeks after, even as recently as today.
Ronan Farrow, who's over on MSNBC, decided to highlight some of the hobbies of the terrorists instead of warning Americans about the dangers of radical Islam.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RONAN FARROW, MSNBC: We're going to take a look at the people behind this Tsarnaev.
In America, kids play football, basketball, baseball. In Chechnya and Dagestan, where Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, the part of their childhood, they wrestle and do martial arts. Fighting is a way of life.
For a few people here, so is extremism.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TANTAROS: They do karate.
GUTFELD: So, OK, it's not radical Islam. It's wrestling. See, we're not susceptible to terrorism, we're susceptible to idiots. And no wonder we got to remember, over time, we have to remember the victims.
Take a movie like "Bonnie and Clyde". We don't remember the 12 victims. We know the names Bonnie and Clyde. We don't know the names of the victims. So, you have to remember the victims and you have to be steadfast against the pop culture that flips the scripts.
That's why cop killers are cool and you don't know the name of the actual cop victim, Daniel Faulkner. But you know Mumia.
That's why Rolling Stone puts a terrorist on the cover because he looks like a member of One Direction.
So, my feeling is we're not feeling susceptible to danger. We're susceptible to D-bags.
TANTAROS: Bob, some of your best moments or my favorite moments of you on THE FIVE is when you commented on how we glorified these terrorists and sort of brush under the rug their radical Islamic ties and highlighting, you know, maybe their high kicks or their roundhouse right.
You've taken Rolling Stone to task. You've taken other networks to task.
BECKEL: Look, I think what we're hearing here and it's exactly right. By the way, I think you should probably give President Obama and his administration pretty good marks for keeping terrorism out. There's not been a major terrorist attack on the United States. There've been home grown terrorist attacks. That's wrong here.
These various Muslim groups like CAIR and others, it is not difficult to identify somebody who is, you know, isolated, who is mad with the United States. That's where the future is. The future is finding people like these brothers to do these kinds of acts because al Qaeda is no longer in a position to attack the United States.
BOLLING: Before you take the victory lap for President Obama, what he has done is using the same infrastructure that was put in place by the Bush administration.
BECKEL: I'm not taking away from Bush.
BOLLING: You said you have to give President Obama credit for it --
BECKEL: You do --
BOLLING: Well, first, he said he was going to dismantle it and they realize how dangerous the world is.
PERINO: It would be nice if the president could give President Bush some credit.
PERINO: Ahead on "The Five" -- do Americans work too hard? The answer is yes. But is that a bad thing? Bob thinks so and he wants us to get on board with Europe. He'll tell us all about it, up next.
BECKEL: Here in America, we work too hard. I'm a case in point. Many of us are glued to our BlackBerries like my colleagues around the table here long after we leave the office. Did you know in France there's a new law that allows citizens to ignore emails after 6 p.m.? That's my kind of law. And a town in Sweden is testing out a 30-hour work week. I think Europe has got the right idea. But the folk over at Cadillac might disagree.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why do we work so hard? For what? For this? For stuff? Other countries, they work, they stroll home, they stop by the cafe, they take August off, off. Why aren't you like that? Why aren't we like that? Because we're crazy, driven, hard-working believers. That's why.
As for all the stuff, that's the upside for only taking two weeks off in August.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BECKEL: I can't get that guy out of my head, the guy on "Justified" got his arm chopped off.
I do think there's something to be said. It was tried here once in the Depression. The Kellogg company that makes cereal decided to go to four six-hour shifts. Profitability went up, profits went up. More people got jobs. Why not give it a try?
BOLLING: Was that, like, in the 1880s?
BECKEL: No, it was in the 1940s.
BOLLING: What about the hard-working society? We built the strongest powerhouse economy on the planet, working hard, working more. I agree with the guy in the Cadillac. By the way, what's two weeks off like?
BECKEL: What do you mean? I don't know.
PERINO: Yes, no kidding.
BOLLING: Around here, we work. Greg takes some time off. He's working when he takes a day off.
BECKEL: He is?
GUTFELD: I agree. I agree. Why -- why does America always want to adopt the policies of the people we beat? That's all we do. By the way, the Sweden thing, those are politicians. Those are government guys that are actually getting their hours cut back, which I agree with. I would pay all government workers not to work.
BECKEL: Dana, what if they took six hours, and it turns out that they were working, getting more productivity and they were doing a better job?
PERINO: It would be nice if we had that luxury. But the Baby Boomers have made sure that we are going to be tied to our jobs for the rest of our lives and not benefit from Social Security and Medicare like they did.
BECKEL: There you go.
PERINO: That will have to be changed. This is what -- we are watching the decline of a former great empire in France.
BECKEL: Well, Sweden is ranked No. 1 in virtual every category of life, quality of life. So I'm not so sure it's so bad.
You worked, what, from 6 to 6 in the morning, doing restaurant work and look at you.
TANTAROS: If I didn't work. That's true. If I didn't work now, I think I'd go crazy. But every time I hear these stories about European countries cutting back on work, I think we should rejoice. They're basically announcing, "Guess what? We're making it even harder for us to compete with you."
And I look at France, I mean, they have that new disconnect law for certain self-employed people that you can...
BECKEL: What's wrong with that?
TANTAROS: ... cut down. Who would hire somebody that can shut off and -- whenever they want at 6 o'clock?
BECKEL: Wouldn't you want to stop listening to these nincompoops who email you after 6 p.m.?
TANTAROS: I would -- I would love it, but I will never be successful if I did it.
GUTFELD: You're talking about our bosses? They're the ones that are e-mailing.
PERINO: No, I'm the one e-mailing.
GUTFELD: Yes, that's true.
BOLLING: Rather than emulating a European 40- -- 30-hour workweek, we should look at the Chinese, some of the economies that are starting to kick our butt. Those people work hard. There aren't labor laws. There aren't minimum wages. They're working harder than we...
BECKEL: That's what we should have: no labor unions and no minimum wage?
BECKEL: They work for a dollar a day.
BOLLING: Certainly no maximum hours per week, for sure.
PERINO: There's nothing more satisfying than putting in a hard day's work. And for example, with your book.
BECKEL: Speak for yourself.
PERINO: You work really hard. You go on the book tour. People come out and they want to buy your product. And that feels good.
GUTFELD: This is why I only drink after I work. Because you have to have -- you have to be rewarded for the hard work you do. You can't just sit around and drink. You've got to work.
BECKEL: That is not true. You want to be...
TANTAROS: You drink relative to how much you work?
GUTFELD: Exactly. The more I work, the more I drink.
PERINO: Don't you write like four paragraphs and then you can have a drink?
GUTFELD: Yes. I do an hour a drink.
BECKEL: There's nothing wrong with getting up at 11 a.m. in the morning, coming in to work for two hours. Absolutely nothing. "One More Thing"...
PERINO: No, it works perfectly for you.
BECKEL: ... is up next. It's a long day.
GUTFELD: It will take about a week for the ointment to work.
It's time for "One More Thing" -- Eric.
BOLLING: By the way, Dana's "One More Thing," amazing. Can't way to see that one.
OK. So last Friday, I did a speech for the National Ocean Industries Association. Great American offshore drillers. Love those guys. But so I'm getting on the plane. Show the picture of the plane. I take an airplane selfie. They put you in first class, they send it out.
As I'm sitting there, a girl gets on the plane. She's sitting right behind me, directly behind me. She's about 28 years old, pretty attractive girl. She says, "I love 'The Five'. I love you on 'The Five.' You guys are great. Did I tell you how much I love 'The Five'? I love 'The Five.'"
Twice she said it during the flight.
I think getting off the flight I'm getting my bag. She puts something in my hand. I put it in my pocket, because people are pushing me to get off. And what do you know? I forget about it. I get all the way back to FOX. I reach in my pocket to find out what she put in my -- in my hand. It was this. Show a picture of it please. A picture. Guys.
U.S. Federal air marshal, sitting behind me. Twenty-eight years old. Pretty girl. I'm telling you, it made me feel so much safer. You have no idea who the air marshals are.
TANTAROS: Just like "Bridesmaids," right?
BECKEL: Why was she sitting right behind you?
BOLLING: That I don't know.
GUTFELD; She might not have been a marshal. She might been a real fun gal.
PERINO: But then has handcuffs.
GUTFELD: I travel with handcuffs everywhere. You never know when you're going to need them -- Dana.
PERINO: Wow, that introduction.
OK. You'll want to see this video from the Fine Brothers entertainment. This is from the hit online series called "React." This is a bunch of kid for the first time in their lives see a Walkman. Do you remember these?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What is this thing?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have no idea what it is.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What is this?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't get what it is.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What do I do? Press play?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't know what it does.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So do you know what that is used for?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Walkie-talkie.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You speak into it?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Use it, a boom box.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Wait, wait, wait. It's a cassette player, right.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: OK. That was funny.
PERINO: I had a Walkman.
GUTFELD: I guess those kids are just really stupid, is that what they're saying? These kids are stupid? That's terrible, Dana. Oh, let's make fun of dumb kids -- Bob.
BECKEL: Yes. Well, last night one of the rare moon events occurred, and that is what they call the blood moon. And it was seen over North and South America predominantly. I happened to see it at 3 o'clock in the morning, which is about the time I go to bed.
GUTFELD: You were walking home.
BECKEL: I was walking home, right. And it is when the earth's shadow moves in front of the moon and you have a full moon, and it turns red. And people all over the country saw it, except for these people, because they're all asleep. And Dana was asleep about 8:30.
TANTAROS: Very different from the other full moons you see.
BECKEL: Yes. I howl at those.
TANTAROS: All right. For those of you who are getting excited about a 40-year AC/DC anniversary, there have been reports that one of their original founding member, guitarist Malcolm Young, is sick. The band has reserved studio time in May. Brian Johnson came out and told a Florida radio station "one of our guys" was pretty ill earlier this year. But one source close to the band says these are just rumors. But we hope that Malcolm is doing well. So...
GUTFELD: One of the greatest bands ever.
TANTAROS: That is so true.
PERINO: They scared me.
TANTAROS: But I miss Bon Scott.
GUTFELD: I could see you being scared by AC/DC.
BOLLING: "Hell's Bells." How scary?
GUTFELD: "Highway to Hell."
PERINO: I didn't listen to that.
GUTFELD: "Dirty Deeds."
All right. DVR it so you don't miss an episode. See you tomorrow.
Content and Programming Copyright 2014 Fox News Network, LLC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Copyright 2014 CQ-Roll Call, Inc. All materials herein are protected by United States copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, displayed, published or broadcast without the prior written permission of CQ-Roll Call. You may not alter or remove any trademark, copyright or other notice from copies of the content.