THE FIVE

How should the White House, Republicans handle the ObamaCare mess?

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," October 23, 2013. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Delicious.

Hello, everyone. I'm Greg Gutfeld, along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Bob Beckel, Eric Bolling, and she likes to punch kittens -- it's Dana Perino.

It's 5:00 somewhere.

(MUSIC)

GUTFELD: So, a litany of lefties are smacking the ObamaCare website around like a playground tether ball. You've got Pelosi, Stewart, Gibbs. Even Obama took a swing, which makes you wonder, when did he know that his creation sucked?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, CNN)

DR. SANJAY GUPTA: Do you know when he first knew that there was a problem?

KATHLEEN SEBELIUS, HHS SECRETARY: Well, I think it became clear fairly early on, the first couple of days --

GUPTA: So not before that, though? Not before October 1st?

SEBELIUS: No.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

Yes, well, look -- this isn't about glitches. It's about government. As long as the media focuses on the flaws, they don't have to face the bigger failure, the ideology they caught from campus. Liberalism, Bob.

Big government as a rule cannot accommodate the desires of the individual. Only capitalism can satisfy choice and choice rules. Have you seen the cold and flu aisle during the winter? Imagine if the government did that?

The marketplace bows to humans whose choices make for a good life. Big government works in reverse. You're the slave to bureaucracy, a soulless cyborg that spits out one answer -- try again.

ObamaCare would have been the jewel of East Germany, the Trabant of health care. And that's the point. It's like we looked at the policies of the world's losers and said, "I'll have one of those."

So I find no comfort in jokes about the website. It's only so we avoid the biggest joke of all, an ideology that denies universal truths about the human condition in order to control you. Obama knew about that all along.  It's who he is. For ObamaCare is what happens when you look at the 20th century. And instead of seeing communism's bloody rise and joyful death, you see America, the greedy, capitalistic bully.

I think that's the name of an actual course at Columbia.

BOB BECKEL, CO-HOST: Gee, Greg, that was really soft.

GUTFELD: It was a soft one today?

You know when you talk about ObamaCare every day, it's so obsessed about these glitches without actually accepting the greater fact. That it's the product of a larger, pernicious kind of thinking.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Wow. Good word.

BECKEL: It's all those liberal colleges putting these people out, all the communists.

GUILFOYLE: Bob, finally --

(CROSSTALK)

ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: I realize what you've been doing the last couple of days. You don't want to talk about this. You don't want to eat this because it's bad for you. It's bad for Democrats.

But Republicans should stay on it. It is this big, this bad. We're not making a mountain out of a molehill. This is that bad.

This thing is going to handle $2.5 trillion of our economy. This website, this plan, this law, and it's a colossal failure -- failure of leadership, failure of management, failure of confidence all across the board.

So, Republicans, do yourself a favor. Stay on it. You know what's next after the website failure and they fix that?

GUIFOYLE: Immigration?

BOLLING: The next is cost.

No, the cost of this thing. Young people aren't going to sign up because it costs too damn much in premiums, in deductibles, in visits. And so, what are they going to have to do? The next thing they're going to have to do is say if they're not signing up, they're going to have to be taxed.

Now, we know the tax, 95 bucks if you're young and not making a lot of money. So, you're going to say, I'm not doing that, I'll take the tax.

Problem is, the IRS can't enforce it. There's no power to garnish wages.

GUILFOYLE: No money to pay for it.

BOLLING: So then what they're going to have to do is they're going to go, it's not 95 bucks. It's 495 bucks. And guess what, we are going to give the IRS the power to garnish your wages. Next you know, this month's trustee becomes what they wanted to be, a social medicine experiment.

BECKEL: You know, you came out of the box and attacked me right away.

BOLLING: Because, you know what, Bob? Because last night, I sat here and listened to you talk about the guy in the window, talk about in vitro fertilization. Instead, what Republicans need to do is stay on this.

BECKEL: Fine, Eric, fine. I've said this in the beginning, let it go.  Instead of getting yourself so worked up. If it's going to be so bad, let it go and we'll get killed in the polls.

BOLLING: Right, right.

BECKEL: OK, fine, then let's see that happen.

BOLLING: Let's talk about it in the meantime.

BECKEL: Well, if you hadn't shut down the damn government, you could have been talking about it a month ago.

GUTFELD: That's a good point.

I want to -- let's go to the Sebelius interview when she was asked. I think she was asked if she had signed up herself.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, CNN)

GUPTA: Did you try signing on the site yourself?

SEBELIUS: I have created an account on the site. I have not tried signing up because I have insurance.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUTFELD: Isn't that sweet, Kimberly? She doesn't need it.

GUILFOYLE: How charming.

GUTFELD: You know, Gordon Ramsay, when he goes to a restaurant, he says -- he gets ticked off when a chef doesn't try his own food. How do you know if something is good if you don't test it?

GUILFOYLE: It's just awful. I mean, they put her out here to talk and do these talking points. She's an abysmal failure. She really should be marched out, you know, fired. There really is no good excuse to this.  It's just getting worse by the minute, because as soon as people are able to even log on to this, it's not going to work. It's going to be too expensive. It's a big problem.

That's why Bob is diverting, deflecting, distracting, because he knows it's really bad. That's why Bob doesn't want to eat it. If Bob doesn't want to eat it, it must be a stinker, let me tell you.

BECKEL: OK, I don't want to get Eric mad. So, I won't -- I'll just say I said this, I think we ought to delay it until we get it right. I disagree with you guys on is that I believe insurance exchanges make sense. The medical insurance industry has ripped this country off and doctors charge too much money.

GUTFELD: Dana, what do you say to that?

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: I say the American taxpayers just spent $684 million on a website that doesn't work. I think that is a rip-off of the century.  And they called in the insurers today and the technology people and saying, OK, we're going to work together and push this. The Republicans are actually going to be able to get behind the Democrats on this because now you have at least three Democrats who are saying let's extend the open enrollment period, but if you extend that, you can't penalize people for something they can't buy.

GUILFOYLE: Exactly.

PERINO: So, then, they're going to have to delay it.

President Obama already by executive order delayed the employer mandate, so I think it makes sense to do that for the individuals.

BECKEL: Can I ask you a serious question?

PERINO: Yes, sir.

BECKEL: You two, how do you tax something if they don't have it?

PERINO: That's the point. That's why John Boehner is saying that you can't tax -- you can't penalize somebody if you can't actually buy the product.

BOLLING: Do you realize what a joke this is, though? Let's just say the 26-year-old, he says this is too expensive. I don't want to go from 400 bucks a month to 600 bucks a month. I'll take the $95 penalty.

He fills out his tax form and says, I don't have insurance, but I'm not paying your $95 tax. The IRS says, well, OK. So now what happens?

ObamaCare is going from a $1.8 trillion program to a $3.6 trillion program.  And then what they're going to have to do --

GUILFOYLE: Add to the deficit.

BOLLING: -- is go to the Congress or tax people more.

PERINO: Can I make one more point on that? Which is there's -- I have a philosophy in politics, that you need to be what's going to happen.

This is not -- they are going to have to delay it. So why does President Obama, they should just go ahead and get it over with, because the press, the public, and in particular the Congress, they're not going to let it go.

GUTFELD: That's a great title for a book by Dana Perino. Bee for what's going to happen. You'll be dressed up as a little bee.

PERINO: Yes.

GUTFELD: I think that's neat.

K.G., I want to play for you another thing, Sebelius -- when she was asked, I think -- did we do this yet, about resigning? I can't remember.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GUPTA: Would you consider resigning over this?

SEBELIUS: I think my job is to get this fully implemented and to get the website working right. And that's really what I'm focused on. That's -- I work at the pleasure of the president. He is singularly focused on making sure we deliver on this promise. That's what I'm committed to doing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUILFOYLE: How many weeks has it been? I mean, this is sad. It's embarrassing. I would literally go on a staycation away very far and not show my face.

I'm not trying to be mean. I just think this is a disaster. It's only getting worse by the minute. She should have some dignity.

I don't know why the president doesn't march her off. I think the American people actually say, you know what, thank you for admitting this doesn't go well. He's the one that's the most frustrated. What about everybody --

GUTFELD: They're going to push her aside essentially and have somebody go in without having --

GUILFOYLE: Push aside means promotion.

BECKEL: They're going to fire somebody.

GUILFOYLE: Who, Bob?

BOLLING: It should be her, because ultimately --

GUILFOYLE: She built it.

BOLLING: She built and she also hired out --

GUTFELD: She did build it.

BOLLING: -- the Canadian firm.

Look, you want to do something smart, Republicans? Another little piece of advice. Give them a date. Give them a drop dead date.

If that website isn't working by, I don't know, November 15th, she goes.  Or someone else goes. Or we take it over. And we hand it off to someone that can get this thing done. Because guess what? This thing ain't going to be working --

BECKEL: You ought to become the chairman of the Republican National Committee.

BOLLING: It's not going to be working in December, Bob. There's so much lines of programming that has to be redone.

GUTFELD: Yes.

BOLLING: This thing could be six months down the road --

GUTFELD: Yes, you can't tack -- I've read you can't tack good on the bad.  You've got to start over.

You know, Rubio had a proposed bill which he talked about on this little show called "The O'Reilly Factor"?

GUILFOYLE: I've heard of it.

GUTFELD: Yes.

BECKEL: Where is that?

GUTFELD: I have no --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARCO RUBIO, R-FLA.: So, what the bill would basically say is that the ObamaCare website has to be up and functioning for six consecutive months before they can begin to enforce this individual mandate on people. How can you punish people for not buying something that's impossible to buy, because of the inability of this website to function because of government incompetence?

BILL O'REILLY, FOX NEWS HOST: When are you going to introduce it?

RUBIO: Monday.

O'REILLY: You think Harry Reid's going to block it with no debate, and know this, there was procedural thing?

RUBIO: I hope not.

O'REILLY: Well, tell me, have you talked to Reid? Have you talked to --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUTFELD: Bob, this is a tough bill to turn down, right?

BECKEL: Oh, yes. I mean, I -- listen, here's the problem with this, which is that bill would fly through the Senate. Reid is going to have to stand up and say no, which he can do as majority leader. But --

PERINO: Make them vote. Make them vote.

BECKEL: Yes. But I'll tell you, there's nobody who is out there who's running for re-election or a tough Senate race or in the House who wouldn't say that's a good idea.

PERINO: And it puts the president in the box of having to -- in the position of having to say whether he would veto it.

I also -- one of the things about Sebelius and calling for her resignation that I think -- even if she does resign and even if this is delayed six months, the fundamental problems are still there.

GUTFELD: Right.

PERINO: I think what they should be most mad about is that the political appointees at the White House were extremely reckless with the president's signature achievements and his legacy items. It's not just bad for President Obama. It's bad for liberalism if this doesn't work.

GUTFELD: Yes. Well, they chose --

GUILFOYLE: Who did they hire? Was it Solyndra people, who put this together?

BECKEL: Oh, God, are you bringing that up again?

PERINO: Why is he always the last to know about everything? He was the last to know about Solyndra. He was the last to know about the IRS. And then nobody's more mad than him.

No, actually, the citizens are really mad. They're more mad than he is.

GUILFOYLE: They don't tell him anything until the mainstream media, which is the last to ever point anything out that he does bad.

BECKEL: The program itself is exactly the right thing.

GUILFOYLE: Bob, you know this is bad.

BECKEL: I think it's bad. The delivery is bad.

GUILFOYLE: It's got no gas. That's the thing. And Americans with no health care, they're careening over --

PERINO: But if the delivery is bad -- so, it's good in theory, but it just doesn't work?

GUTFELD: That's the story of liberalism.

GUILFOYLE: Right.

GUTFELD: It's good in theory, but it doesn't work.

BECKEL: Those big universities --

GUTFELD: That's the case of all socialism, it only works in the utopian mind. You put it to work, people die.

Sorry, Eric, go ahead.

BOLLING: I have to say, you have to understand, if you can't get something so basic as a website right, how in the world are you going to administer something so complicated as people's health care? It's as complicated as anything on the planet, but because what this doctor knows and that doctor knows, getting documents, getting payment back and forth, this is a disaster waiting to happen.

(CROSSTALK)

BOLLING: This is big as it seems.

PERINO: And I think the bigger shoe to drop, like the gigantic Ronald McDonald shoe to drop, people's concern about their personal security and identity theft.

(CROSSTALK)

GUILFOYLE: That's a big deal, what's going to happen with that. Let me tell you that the only person that's secretly psyched about this is Hillary Clinton because she's like thank God, Obama did it. Not me.

BECKEL: In the two and a half years, I've worked with you, I've never seen you so riled up.

PERINO: He cares about the country.

BOLLING: Because what went on last night, and today, what went on, you realize and you see it on TV. Liberals are trying to talk about anything but ObamaCare on the website right now. That's why you need to stay focused on it. You want change, 2014 will bring change if you remind them this was a bad idea.

BECKEL: I think we should talk about the World Series early.

GUTFELD: OK. Next on THE FIVE: a new embarrassment for the White House after it discovers the identity of a serial tweeter who has been sharply critical of the administration. It was an Obama senior staffer.

What -- are these kids? What's going on? It is the White House. Anyway, we're going to tell you who it was and what tweet got him sacked. He tweeted about Dana.

PERINO: And it wasn't nice.

BECKEL: The freakiest tweeters in the world.

GUTFELD: I know. Hold on, you've got to check out our Facebook page at Facebook.com/TheFiveFNC.

GUILFOYLE: Way to sell it, by the way. Your heart was really in that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BOLLING: The White House taking a lot of heat for the ObamaCare web debacle, but that's not the only thing giving the Obama administration headaches.

Check this out. A White House insider has been tweeting derogatory tweets under a pseudonym or a stage name. Jofi Joseph has been trashing friends and enemies of Obama from the Twitter name @natsecwonk since February 2011.  He was fired when the secret Twitter account was discovered.

But a couple of big questions remain. First, what the hell took them two and a half years to discover the leak? Was the NSA too busy with you and me to find the leak?

And second, what does it take to be accountable in the Obama administration? Susan Rice lied to the American people about Benghazi.  Lois Lerner took the Fifth over the IRS scandal. And Kathleen Sebelius is still there with the ObamaCare website an epic failure.

Dana, your thoughts on this. This is pretty outrageous, right?

PERINO: I was imagining last night having to go into the Oval Office to tell the president of the United States, we found a leaker and he actually is your own employee and he has been trashing you.

I think -- yes, President Obama -- yes, where do they get their top secret clearances, out of a crackerjack box? I mean, I had to go through a lot to get -- well --

GUILFOYLE: That's the point. He had one.

BOLLING: Let's stay -- I want to take this guy -- I can't stand this guy.  He's a cheap shot artist.

Take a look what he did about our own co-host, our good friend here, Dana Perino. Look at this tweet, check it out. "Oh, @danaperino. You're such a gleaming hope for dumb blonde airheads everywhere."

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: Finally, someone speaks the truth.

BOLLING: No, he's a coward.

PERINO: Most people, well, most of his tweets about women had to do with their weight. At least he just called me dumb.

GUTFELD: Yes, can I just pop in here about --

PERINO: And you're a real blonde, too.

GUTFELD: This guy is a true troll in that he spits bigoted sexist venom anonymously. The stuff he said about Sarah Palin and her family. He said, they're -- the Palin's family is white trash that we should get rid of.  Now, that's racist, but apparently the press really didn't mind it because they followed him. He had a huge influential following on Twitter because they liked him.

GUILFOYLE: They thought it was funny.

GUTFELD: He said stuff about women that is pretty despicable. And it's always about their physical -- their weight, their looks. I mean, the stuff that he said -- like why does this guy marry a woman a decade younger than him? She's as ugly as he is.

So I'm asking, what possesses a grown man --

PERINO: An Obama staffer.

GUTFELD: An Obama staffer to go online and say despicable things about women? He's a lonely guy obsessed with self-gratification.

BOLLING: But isn't that half of Twitter, though? I mean, they're hiding behind these fake names.

GUILFOYLE: That's so true.

PERINO: I own all my dumb tweets.

GUTFELD: So do I.

GUILFOYLE: Well, the problem is, I mean, how said, it's sort of very embarrassing that they couldn't even sniff this guy out? I mean --

BECKEL: There's no way you can find a Twitter?

GUILFOYLE: Well, I mean, Bob, how embarrassing. You think this is good --

BECKEL: I don't know how to tweet.

GUILFOYLE: It's like racist and sexist --

BECKEL: You want to hear something?

GUILFOYLE: What?

BECKEL: You know, a blonde was told both exes are within a mile of her house --

GUILFOYLE: I can't take it, Bob. You're like Groundhog Day. You tell -- this joke now is like 1,500 times.

BOLLING: Fair and balanced point. But one quick tweet -- can I show you the one about Valerie Jarrett. Can you pull that up?

BECKEL: Oh, this is what got him.

BOLLING: Take a peek. There it is. "I'm a fan of Obama. But his continued reliance and dependence upon a vacuous cipher like Valerie Jarrett concerns me."

Now, at least that was fair and balanced, right?

GUILFOYLE: You like that one.

(CROSSTALK)

BECKEL: The rest of it, he got away with. That one, when Valerie picked up on that, I will guarantee you, everybody was called in and be waterboarded.

GUILFOYLE: Valerie Jarrett called in SEAL Team Six on that one.

GUTFELD: You can call Palin white trash and everybody will clap. But you make fun of Valerie Jarrett --

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: If you look at all of his tweets, this guy hates women.

PERINO: And he's married to a Republican staffer.

GUTFELD: Really?

BECKEL: She probably beats him.

BOLLING: All right. We've got to move on very quickly. A story we first brought you Monday. Peter Schweizer made a career out of blowing out D.C. corruption. He sat down with Sean last night and pointed out a very interesting nugget about our president's tactic.

Crooked? We report. You decide.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PETER SCHWEITZER, "EXTORTION" AUTHOR: Huge problem with the Obama administration, particularly at the Department of Justice. Eric Holder is basically the squeegee guy holding the brick.

SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS HOST: Explain.

SCHWEIZER: Well, there are couple of things going on, Sean. First of all, literally, there are companies that are being told they are subject to Department of Justice investigation, criminal and civil, and then, literally, those companies are solicited for donations to the Obama campaign and now to Obama political committees. And there is statistical evidence in the books that literally you cut your chances of going to jail in half if you make a contribution.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLLING: I'll go with you in second, K.G. I just have to ask, Bob.

Really? This is how it comes into. You make a donation to the Obama campaign and you're off the hook?

BECKEL: It doesn't sound nice. Let me tell you. Here's something that happens in Congress all the time. They'll get together. They'll introduce a bill that attacks an industry, right?

And then, they'll go after the industry and it makes contribution. This is by old Washington again. I've been there the long time. The extortion that takes place in Washington, it's the only thing bipartisan they can agree on.

GUILFOYLE: So, basically, Bob is saying it's completely true and it's validated and he's seen it in action.

BECKEL: I have. That's right. I have.

Does that really upset you?

GUILFOYLE: No, I appreciate your honesty and candor.

GUTFELD: It's a fatter, uglier version of "The Sopranos."

GUILFOYLE: The king pin in all of this, the most important person besides Valerie is Eric Holder, the head of the injustice department.

BOLLING: Have you seen any of that stuff?

PERINO: I'm not. But I never was on the political side where I did any campaign fundraising or anything like that. I'm not very good with money.

BOLLING: Did I misread that or mishear that, where he said that the administration would use a DOJ and other vehicles to lean on companies until they made donations to political --

PERINO: If he's got evidence of that -- which I assume he does in his book.

GUILFOYLE: The book got printed! They'd be getting sued if it wasn't true.

(CROSSTALK)

BECKEL: One of the dirtiest tricks this Washington, two lobbyists will sit down and represent opposite sides of companies and they'll say get your guy to introduce a bill that attacks my side. I'll make a lot of money, you'll make a lot of money because we'll have to get -- I mean, it's --

PERINO: You know who's going to make a lot of money? Lawyers on ObamaCare. They're going to come out and the contractors are going to sue the government. So, basically everybody's going to sue each other and the people that win are the lawyers. All the lawyers.

GUILFOYLE: Too many lawyers.

BOLLING: All right. We're going to leave it there. Directly ahead, Democratic Congressman Alan Grayson sends out a despicable fundraising e- mail --

GUTFELD: He's gorgeous.

BOLLING: -- comparing the Tea Party to the Klan with a flaming cross and all. Where is Sharpton? Where is the NAACP? We contacted them. Did they condemn Grayson's race-baiting? That answer coming up.

PERINO: No.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GUILFOYLE: A well-known Democrat uses the Ku Klux Klan to try to make a few bucks in a fundraising appeal. Alan Grayson of Florida made a plea Monday night that included Klan members burning a cross. The T in that cross helped spell out "Tea Party." The text follows with: now you know what the T stands for.

Well, the black community doesn't need to be reminded of the horrors perpetrated by the KKK, yet their so-called leaders remain silent.

Former Representative Allen West wants answers. Grayson has refused to apologize.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FORMER REP. ALLEN WEST, R-FLA.: Where is the NAACP and Ben Jealous?  Where is the National Urban League and Marc Morial? Where is Representative John Lewis, who is from Georgia, who marched with Dr. King, who as I was growing up, was my representative as a young man in Atlanta, Georgia? Where are the voices of the Congressional Black Caucus, Reverends Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUILFOYLE: Well, Grayson has refused to apologize, remarking simply, if the shoe fits, wear it. I mean, there's so much to say about this.

BECKEL: You the thing that amazed about it -- you know, first of all, Grayson -- believe me, I'm not going to defend Grayson. But beyond that, it seems to be -- remember when bill Clinton did the shoulder moment.  Where he separated himself out? That was smart.

Why Jesse Jackson and Sharpton don't take advantage of these things and stand up. They get a lot of good press out of it. And who's going to be against them?

PERINO: Why doesn't President Obama?

BECKEL: I don't know.

PERINO: Why doesn't President Obama do it?

BECKEL: I don't know the answer to that, Dana.

PERINO: Why didn't he become the leader? Because they decided not to comment.

The New Hampshire state legislature, that said a horrible thing about ObamaCare and slavery, President Obama actually talked about that in a speech and called him out on it, and tried to label the entire Republican Party that way, but they refused to comment on it this way and to tell Grayson to back off.

GUILFOYLE: You make a great point. We made some calls to find out, where do the Democratic black leaders stand on this issue. We want some accountability. We want answers. We want to know your position. Here's what we got.

OK. Congressional Black Caucus, no comment. Charming.

Jay Carney -- I haven't spoken with the president about Alan Grayson's KKK fundraising e-mail.

PERINO: So, why can't you just comment?

GUILFOYLE: Well, there you go. Reverend Jesse Jackson for the Rainbow Push Coalition. Michael will e-mail me or call me back with something.  We're waiting. We're still waiting.

Al Sharpton, National Action Network. E-mailed, no response. We're waiting. We'll just wait. I guess until 6:00 or something like that.

The National Urban League, we e-mailed. Don't have a response back.  NAACP, didn't get back to us. We did leave a voicemail, a very courteous one, in fact.

Representative John Lewis, we called and we e-mailed. I'm beginning to get a conflict like we're unpopular or something.

And then, of course, their usual stuff --

BECKEL: What did Beyonce say about it?

GUILFOYLE: Bob, we're not going to let you distract us from this.

PERINO: It's actually a decent question.

BOLLING: So -- because it's not about race, it's about politics. It's always been about politics. This would be a good opportunity for someone to step up and just tell Grayson, shut up. Alan Grayson could -- honestly, he may be mentally deranged. There is something wrong with that congressman.

BECKEL: Let me tell you something --

BOLLING: He was removed from Congress for a couple years and then he won his seat back. Somehow people in Florida, I don't know what you're thinking about. Reverend Al, Jesse Jackson, take this moment to reprimand him. He is out of line. He is absolutely ridiculous. Tell him. It would be great for them.

GUILFOYLE: It's just sad, though. Because this is real void of leadership. And we're waiting for these responses and they just don't seem to care enough to say anything.

GUTFELD: Well, I'm just curious -- by the way, Alan Grayson is so ugly, his pockmarks have pockmarks. Where did he get the cross?

My theory is he burned that cross. He might actually be a member of the KKK. Usually racists are so smart and devious that they hide behind the smearing of others in other to profligate their own secret racism. Grayson has yet to respond to my question, are you in the KKK, sir? He hasn't responded and I'm asking him now.

PERINO: He's racist.

GUTFELD: He's obviously a racist. But Chris Knox said he would horse whip the Tea Party. Who horse whips? Slave holders. Slave owners.

Apparently, racism runs in these guys' blood.

BECKEL: I had a conversation with Greg before the show on this. He's so smart. He is not calling you a racist.

GUILFOYLE: Are you representing Greg?

BECKEL: No, no, just be careful here. That's all I'm saying. This has happened before. Look --

PERINO: What, Greg is going to need security?

BECKEL: No, it's not that. There have been lawsuits against people who --

GUTFELD: No, I'm just using his own reasoning against him.

BECKEL: You know, I think the idea of the cross is an interesting concept.  You took my line. But the fact is Grayson, the head (INAUDIBLE) they should throw the son of a bitch out.

GUILFOYLE: Does anyone else want to ruin my block more? Anyone else want to blow it up like TMZ dynamite? Anybody?

GUTFELD: You know, Bob, my point is this, my point is this. For the longest time, there are people on the left that use racism to disarm their adversaries so the adversary cannot have a debate. All I am doing is turning it back on them.

BECKEL: I know exactly what you're doing.

GUTFELD: OK.

BOLLING: A la Chris Matthews the other day when you destroyed him.

GUTFELD: It's the only way it's going to work now. The only thing you can do is call them racist because they're never going to stop until you do it.

GUILFOYLE: Why couldn't I have just done the royal segment?

GUTFELD: We're not doing the royal segment.

GUILFOYLE: We still can because ahead on "The Five." The little baby prince makes another royal appearance across the pond. It was a big day for baby George.

BECKEL: Is that a boy? I thought it was a boy.

GUILFOYLE: The 3-month-old was christened today. That's traditional. You wear a little christening dress. Great grandma, the queen, of course, was there. It was fabulous.

Details on the big event coming your way.

BECKEL: Oh, I cannot wait.

GUILFOYLE: Little baby --

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PERINO: Welcome back to "The Five."

So, there's been a lot of talk about whether women can really have it all regarding work life balance. One male commentator is stirring things up again with some provocative comments on women in the workplace.

Here's Gavin McInnis.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GAVIN MCINNIS: We've trivialized childbirth and being domestic so much, the women are forced to pretend to be men. They're feigning toughness.  They're miserable.

Study after study has shown feminism has made women less happy. They're not happy in the workforce, for the most part. I'm sure 7 percent like not having kids. They want to be CEOs. They like staying at the office all night working on a proposal and all power to them.

But by enforcing that as the norm, you're pulling all these women away from what they naturally want to do, and it's making them miserable. OK?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PERINO: All right. So, that's Gavin, good friends of ours. You've actually spent some time with him, last night.

GUTFELD: Yes, he's on "Red Eye".

PERINO: And then you talked to him about all of the reaction to this interview that he did.

GUTFELD: Basically, there is a mob after him for basically saying an opinion that they believe that somehow he's imposing his belief on the rest of the world, when, in fact, they just asked him his opinion. He is criticizing how the role of motherhood is being downgraded in society.

This is a guy who started Vice magazine. He's incredible successful.  He's millionaire, ran magazines, runs an ad agency.

What he's saying is the job of his wife -- the job -- who's a wife and mother, is more valuable than anything he has ever done. And that freaks the modern beta male wusses and the feminist minds, they freak out and they form a mob and they go crazy. Like how dare he say it?

Well, it's an opinion. And he's not imposing his opinion. He was asked to be on that show. And what I think was he gave an honest opinion.

By the way, I think he went on to Twitter to apologize, right? I think we have his tweet. Let's see it. "I deeply regret my Huff Post live comments. Fashion PR is way more fulfilling than creating, nurturing, and shaping a human life."

PERINO: So he's not really apologizing.

BECKEL: Is he married?

PERINO: Yes.

BECKEL: Everybody didn't get what he got at home after that one.

PERINO: I doubt that.

(CROSSTALK)

BECKEL: That's not exactly the way to say it.

PERINO: But to be attacked for your opinion, Eric? Is that right?

BECKEL: He ought to be attacked every day.

BOLLING: Here's my problem. I don't know Gavin. I hear he's a great guy.  But he did that same thing that I can't stand when anyone does. Studies have shown -- well, that's not his opinion anymore.

Now, he's hanging on the studies. I'm not sure the studies do show that.

GUTFELD: There's a well-established study --

BOLLING: Even better. When Chuck Berry comes to us and says let's talk about feminism or it empowers women or not, I go, I get that glazed over look, like, really, is it -- am I going to shut my mouth for another block?

(CROSSTALK)

PERINO: I'm not a mom, though. Kimberly is a mom. And you do have it all. But it is hard to balance.

GUILFOYLE: It is hard to balance, but it's worth it.

BECKEL: You have it all.

GUILFOYLE: Thank you, Bobby. I love doing this.

I think focusing on my job and doing something that I feel proud of, that I'm interested and passionate about makes me a better mother and a great role model for Ronan. But that's my choice. Maybe it's not the choice -- I don't see myself in those terms. I see myself as an individual who's making positive choices that I feel good about. And I would want the same if I had a daughter and I want the same for my son.

BOLLING: So the study is wrong with you --

GUILFOYLE: I don't know if it's wrong or right. I'm just going to speak for myself.

BOLLING: Do you see yourself as a feminist?

PERINO: Well, I supposed -- look, I don't have to define myself that way because a lot of women fought ahead of me. They plowed the ground. There were women who were first in a lot of different things.

In my lifetime, I believe if not this next time, in my life there will be a woman president. Women have proven that they can do anything. Can you do it all at once? Probably not. But I don't mind that he had an opinion.

GUTFELD: Nobody can have it all. No one has it all. The essence of life is never having it all.

PERINO: You have to choose.

GUTFELD: So, it's all B.S. profligated by magazines.

PERINO: But I don't mind him having an opinion.

BECKEL: I just want to say one thing, because Greg didn't do it, so let me do it for him.

GUILFOYLE: What?

BECKEL: It's those faculty lounges, those liberal arts schools where they put this crap out there. Everybody's jumping feminism. That's where we get the problem.

PERINO: All the feminists. Good job, Bob.

GUILFOYLE: Gavin is very provocative. Remember the time when I was on your show and he shaved himself?

GUTFELD: He did that for I believe prostate cancer. He shaved himself for prostate cancer.

GUILFOYLE: Just to make a point.

PERINO: Don't move. We're going live to Fenway Park. Shep is in Boston to preview tonight's game World Series. Something like that, the Red Sox.

GUILFOYLE: Oh my gosh.

PERINO: Greg's predicting that the Cardinals, I guess Cards -- let me call them the Cards --

(CROSSTALK)

PERINO: The first half or something like that.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BECKEL: Kimberly wanted me to say something nasty to open.

Grab your peanuts and cracker jacks because tonight is game one of the World Series. A little after 7:00 p.m. Eastern, the Boston Red Sox and the St. Louis Cardinals will kick off the 109th World Series -- I was at the first one -- at Fenway park in Boston.

Shep is there and -- for the festivities. He joins us now.

Shep, I bet these questions really were provocative for you.

SHEPARD SMITH, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: I'm sure they were, but the game is actually a little after 8:00 Eastern.

BECKEL: Oh, sorry. I'm sorry.

SMITH: That's all right.

BECKEL: I have a question for you on this. The Red Sox for years were terrible. They seemed to have built themselves an unbelievable team. Why?  How?

SMITH: They did it overnight. Last year, they were the worst team in the division. They were at the bottom of the barrel. Bobby Valentine was being run out of here on rails. And they said the front office did a really great job and they brought in some young players. They've cobbled together a pretty good rotation. They haven't announced the game three starter yet.

But the Red Sox are tied with the Cardinals for the best record in baseball and everybody on lands down tonight believes that they've got a mighty good shot. They're favored in game one and Boston is electric, I'll tell you that, even though it's a little chilly.

BOLLING: Shep, not so much a question, but a little bit of an observation.  I've spent a lot of time here in New York and we don't like the Boston Red Sox too much here.

SMITH: Nope.

BOLLING: I understand the whole Boston strong thing and the Boston bombing. America's heart is going to Boston. But I'm a Midwesterner, I love the St. Louis Cardinals, Shep.

SMITH: Hey, man, I hear you. I'm from the part of the world where everybody seems to be a Cardinals or Reds fan, or those who watched Ted Turner, Braves fan.

But the Cardinals have that enormous radio network. I don't know about you. But when I was a kid, that's how you listened to baseball. That Cardinals radio network spreads across ten or 12 states, and they've got fans in every city that I know anything about.

So, as much as your heart goes out to Bostonians, as he put it, go Red Sox tonight, they are Boston strong for sure.

BECKEL: From where are you, Shep, where you grew up, they wouldn't have a professional baseball team.

GUTFELD: Hey, Shep. I have an important question to ask you. We've been watching over the last few weeks this brouhaha over the Washington Redskins. Native Americans upset about the name.

With the St. Louis Cardinals, has the religious clergy come out and voiced anything, outrage over the fact that they are not changing the Cardinal name?

SMITH: The Arbor Society -- the bird fans are furious. Except the good thing about the Cardinals is they don't shoot the birds. They just fly around.

All the fans here tonight are in Red, so fans of blue are up in arms.  Those of us who are fans of blue are very unhappy.

PERINO: I have a question. Does the fact that the Red Sox are in the World Series have any bearing on the 2014 election?

SMITH: I'm sure the five of you can figure out a way that it would. In all seriousness, what it has bearing on really is kind of the soul of this place. I know you guys remember after the attacks of 9/11, the Yankees went through a sort of improbable run to make it all the way to the World Series. And in games four and five of that series, just set New York on fire. And there was something to cheer for.

And then, of course, at the end of that series, there was a little bloop over shortstop off Mariano that ended it. And it was sad. But the Yankees got us through that year. I think to some degree, these Red Sox have shown a lot about how strong and resilient this city is. And they're mighty proud of them and proud of their resilience and they're bouncing back.

BECKEL: I bet you're glad you pulled the assignment. Let me ask you the five questions.

Go ahead, Kimberly.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, of course, Shep Smith has been subjected to this. But I have to tell you, I'm looking for it to go seven games. I'm super excited for Boston. I think they need a feel-good moment. I'm rooting for them.  My heart is with them, especially everything they've been through. Is that wrong?

(CROSSTALK)

SMITH: Cardinals fans are going, what's wrong with everybody?

GUILFOYLE: I know.

PERINO: I have a serious question.

BECKEL: Dana has a serious question.

PERINO: I wonder, what is security like at a game like this, after an event like this after what happened in Boston in April, at the marathon?

GUILFOYLE: Good question.

SMITH: Security is always crazy. One thing that they've done this year is they've asked people not to bring backpacks. And we've kind of been looking around for that.

This guy coming right here seems to have one. But I don't think they're going to let him in because the guy walking by right there has one. Of course, the bombings happened with bombs that were in backpacks. So they're asking people not to bring them.

Security is tight. It's always tight at these events. But it didn't seem over the top to me.

Lansdowne Street and Yawkey Way are teeming with people tonight. Looks like the rain is going to hold off and it's going to be a great time down the dial on big Fox. About O'Reilly's time, but you can DVR it.

BECKEL: Yes.

GUILFOYLE: Fox News is where the news is baby. There's Shepard. I love it.

BECKEL: It was good for Dana to ask that question. And the couple of rules, she knows about baseball. We let that go.

"One More Thing" is up next!

GUILFOYLE: Oh my God! You actually, look --

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GUTFELD: It's time for "One More Thing," Eric.

BOLLING: OK. So, this YouTube video has gone viral. If this doesn't get you right here, then you have coal for a heart. Watch this.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

PERINO: That's my friend's daughter.

BOLLING: That's nurses and kids and administrators -- kids with cancer, kids at children's hospital at Dartmouth. It's a great video. Check it out.

PERINO: I think that's my friend's daughter's video.

BOLLING: Is it?

PERINO: I believe so, yes. I didn't have a chance to watch it earlier, but they sent it to me.

GUTFELD: K.G., I hope this is royalty because you know I love it.

GUILFOYLE: Well, I certainly do. And I love the royal family, particular fan of Camilla and Prince Charles, who are friends. I think this is a very special day because the 3-month-old baby was christened today and welcomed into the Church of England.

Prince George Alexander Louis of Cambridge was christened today. You see him. The baby was very happy, wasn't crying, which is unusual for christening.

You see the happy couple there. And Kate looks lovely. The queen was in attendance. A number of godparents.

It was a very nice family, special occasion. In fact, the last royal baby to be christened in the chapel was Princess Beatrice, who is William's cousin. And that was way back in 1988. It was a special moment for the family.

BECKEL: It was a beautiful service.

GUTFELD: Touching. Dana?

PERINO: OK. My favorite part of the newspaper sometimes, the correction section. It's so great.

This has been The Washington Post this morning, I love this.

On October 14th style article about access to the prison camp Gitmo incorrectly referred to Navy Captain Robert Durand as, quote, "thickset" and he should have been described as muscular. Who calls to complain that they were I mean, if they call me thickset, I'd be complaining too, but I wouldn't ask for a correction.

But who calls and gets a correction like that? You're an editor.

GUTFELD: It was his wife. He probably was mad because he works out. He's like, I am muscular.

PERINO: It was actually muscle.

GUTFELD: Exactly. I'm not thickset. I've had this problem a lot.

BECKEL: Uh-huh.

GUILFOYLE: What?

GUTFELD: Who's next?

BECKEL: Thanks a lot, Greg.

GUTFELD: I'm still thinking about --

BECKEL: I know.

I want you all to look at a chart because this is very, very interesting.  This is what the ratings were of congress -- if you'll notice when the Republicans took the Congress back over in '96, these people -- the number of people who were against an incumbent member of Congress going back in was pretty high. And it went over to the Republicans.

Then it happened again in 2006 -- 2010, rather, the Democrats lost, because there was a negative feeling about Congress. And then in 2006, the Republicans got it back because there was a negative feeling about Congress.

The highest ever recorded is now this year. If this is an indication, I'm a firm believer in the history of politics, Republicans are in a real bad trouble.

GUTFELD: Can you bring that chart up one more time? Point something else out on this chart, please. Could you put it up there?

If you look here, the tall yellow things are tall. And little brown things are small. Just wanted to point that out for everybody.

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: All right --

BECKEL: How do you dispel an accurate fact --

GUTFELD: Banned phrase: don't take my word for it.

Whenever anybody says that, that means they're lying and you shouldn't take their word for it.

PERINO: No, as if they don't have enough confidence, and them being trusted and credible. Don't look at me. CNN said it. That's what it really is about.

So, next time, you can consult me on your word ban. I can help.

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: Crazy lady.

Bob, did you have anything you wanted to add?

BECKEL: No. We have to get out of here and throw it over to Bret Baier.

GUTFELD: No, no, we're doing a whole another hour.

BECKEL: Oh, we are? OK, fine, let's get Shep back.

GUTFELD: "Special Report" next.

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