Is Big Government the mother of invention?

Where would Ben Franklin be without Uncle Sam?


This is a rush transcript from "The Five," July 26, 2012. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: So according to Gallup -- a dating service for ponies -- business owners' approval of President Obama fell to 35 percent. It's no surprise. This "we didn't build it" thing was like Howard Dean' scream.

It was an epiphany. Like you never really understood the person until now. It's like when your date insults the waiter. The light goes on. Aha, that light says. Ladies and gents, we have a loser.

And it's also silly. I mean, where would we be without Sir Isaac Newton? Do you think the government caused that apple to fall on his head?

Albert Einstein fled Europe to get away from its governments.

Do you think that Pez dispenser was made by a guy with help from the government? He was using a family recipe. Bet you didn't know that, Kimberly.

And what about the father of American invention, Benjamin Franklin. Do you think he had government help? No, there was no government. In fact, the U.S. government was one of Ben's inventions. This guy didn't even need government to help invent government.

Did Eli Wallach have any help inventing the cotton gin? Did Orville Redenbacher have any help at Kitty Hawk?

Look, waiting for the government to assist your creativity kills that creativity. Why invent a better mousetrap when the government hands out ones that are almost OK?

You want to see America's creative genius for invention return? Make sure inventors are at each other's throats. That's competition. That's why capitalists made the Mustang and socialists gave us the Hugo (sic).

Or the Yugo. I meant to say the Yugo. Or is it Hugo?

BOB BECKEL, CO-HOST: Redenbacher, is that what you said? That's good.

GUTFELD: Yes. Are you surprised, Bob, that business owners resoundingly oppose President Barack Obama?

BECKEL: It's shocking. It's kept me up all night long when I heard about it.

Now, first of all, this was -- most of this was taken pre- his comments -- that you all taken out of context about. And he's always been near the bottom with business owners and by definition, was going to vote Republican. So, it doesn't surprise me. I think last time they were second to the bottom. And this time, the bottom was fishermen and lumberjacks or something.


I'm always a little suspicious of breaking these things out by job group but it's not surprising, no.

ANDREA TANTAROS, CO-HOST: I thought his approval was the lowest among Democratic co-hosts --


BECKEL: That's funny.

GUTFELD: Here's the thing, though, it's like when the problem with the American economy is about confidence, this is it. It's the business owners. If they're not happy, we're screwed.

TANTAROS: How are we supposed to hire?

And that was an excellent monologue, because you pointed out, not only has the government not created all those inventions that we benefit from, the government's broke. So, if you're sitting around for them to help you, they have no money. The money has run out.

I think from day one, the president's calculus has been grow the government, give more handouts, and then at the end of the day, cross your fingers and hope that on election day, more people are going to get a check that will come to the polls, more than the small business owners and the horse study, the Gallup, pony study that you said.

GUTFELD: Yes. It's amazing though, Eric, because this is something people were waiting for Mitt Romney to talk about and Obama gave it to them. This is -- when they start having debates in October this is it.

GUILFOYLE: Bob's snoring.


ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: Do me a favor. Take the two shot of me and Beckel, ready?

BECKEL: Oh, I'm sorry. Are we still talking about --

BOLLING: Wake up.


BECKEL: Do that one more time and you're dead.

BOLLING: First things first, Bob, this is a daily -- daily -- tracking poll so you can't say it was taken before Obama --


BOLLING: Daily tracking.

OK, so business owners, 59 percent disprove of the way he's handling his job, President Obama. Farming industry, 57 percent disprove. Transportation workers, 55 percent. It goes on and on. Just about nobody is below 50 percent disapproval of President Obama's handling of --

BECKEL: That's not exactly right.

Let me, first of all, next time you take a shot at me in my ribs, you better say good-bye to your wife and kid, OK?

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Oh my God, you can't make that threat, Bob.


GUTFELD: You're threatening him, not his family.

BECKEL: It's really a surprise. What percentage of the population -- seriously, what percentage are business owners?

BOLLING: Bob, there's probably I don't know, 2 million or 3 million business owners in America.

GUTFELD: Can I -- I want to ask, Kimberly, a question.

BOLLING: But let me point something out.

GUTFELD: Oh, sure. Go ahead.

BOLLING: But small businesses produce 70 percent of the jobs in America. It doesn't matter what the number, how many people are voting, and that is how many jobs --

BECKEL: But I would say of those that are overwhelmingly Republican, wouldn't you?

BOLLING: No idea. I have no way of knowing that.

TANTAROS: Do more people work for the government? Or --

BECKEL: No, no, I'm not -- first of all, I'm not getting into an argument. I'm simply asking questions. That's all.

GUTFELD: Just raising some questions.

BECKEL: That's all.

GUTFELD: Just raising awareness.

All right. Kimberly, I want to ask you, people who are actually fans or who were fans and supporters of President Obama, like Steve Jobs, had warned him of this very problem and he doesn't listen. When is he going to actually say something other than this because he -- it's weird, he has to clarify his clarifications. He needs a whole agenda of clarification.

GUILFOYLE: Well, it's getting worse and he has that whole institutional mindset. I mean, they don't -- they want the government to be in charge, they want the government to pick the winners. They abhor creativity any kind of change or innovation or creativity, entrepreneurship, because then they lost control of their matrix for what they get to decide, who gets to win, who gets to lose, payback to donors. That's what we've seen in his administration.

BECKEL: Steve Jobs says Apple would not have existed without the government.

GUTFELD: He also was very worried about the reelection because he felt Obama was anti-business.

You want to talk about these voter enthusiasm polls?


GUTFELD: We were talking about this in this meeting, how exciting they are.

BOLLING: It's going to be amazing. Can't wait.

GUTFELD: I know, I know. We'll dwell on it the whole show, how about that? Dems more enthusiastic, 39 percent down from 61 percent. So they're not enthusiastic. Republicans, it's like reverse. They're more enthusiastic, 51 percent to 35 percent.

Andrea, is this something that happens because you've got an incumbent who is likeable so people aren't like thinking about it?

TANTAROS: Also because it's a Democrat in the White House so Republicans are going to be more galvanized this time around, like we saw in 2010, hopefully. And Obama has serious issues with turnout. And among them, Greg, I'd say that the biggest block is Hispanics and youth, and those were two demographics that squarely placed him in the White House.

But, you know, going back to this whole "you didn't build that."

BECKEL: Do we have to keep going back to that?


GUTFELD: Because it's working.

TANTAROS: Before he made those comments, Bob, he said the private sector was fine and he was more concerned with the government workers. Well, a lot of those workers in northern Virginia -- and I'm not telling you something you don't know -- that professional class, he needs Virginia. Virginia is a state that he won in 2008.

BECKEL: He's got more favorable --

TANTAROS: There's a lot of young professionals out there that aren't like the old manufacturing job --

BECKEL: I guess I'll to keep saying this all the time. He said you didn't build roads and bridges, OK? You guys continue to selectively edit that --


TANTAROS: OK, he also said the private sector is doing fine.


GUTFELD: I happily agree with that.

BECKEL: The point about enthusiasm I think is important. I mean, that is low even for an incumbent, to be down at 39 percent.

But on the other side, when you've got somebody dislike among Republicans as Obama is, that 51 percent is terrible. That shows what Mitt Romney's problem is.

GUILFOYLE: You're saying it should be higher.

BECKEL: Much higher.

BOLLING: Can I point something out? This is the first time -- this is probably first presidential election where, I don't know, so far $200 million has been spent on negative advertising. I mean, that's going to put a damper on enthusiasm and maybe turnout.

BECKEL: Thirty-five percent of Republicans with Barack Obama in the White House are not enthusiastic? That tells you more about Mitt Romney than anything else. This guy is not a very attractive candidate. You have to own up to that.

GUILFOYLE: But the incumbent is unattractive.

BECKEL: I understand that, but Mitt Romney is about the worst candidate you could put against Barack Obama in every dimension.

GUILFOYLE: Then why are you guys spending so much money and sweating it and --


BECKEL: They spend a lot more than that. How much is Karl Rove spending, 250 million bucks, right?

GUILFOYLE: I mean, it's record spending.

GUTFELD: I think they have the money. I think Obama doesn't have the money.

GUILFOYLE: He doesn't have to worry about.

TANTAROS: Half the country is red, half the country is blue and then there's voters in the middle.

The NBC/Wall Street Journal poll clearly came out and said, undecided are not unlikely to break for President Obama. Do they like President Obama? No. The only thing in your favor, Bob, they don't like Mitt Romney that much either.

BECKEL: Here's the other thing I found striking about these polls, is that only 5 percent of the people are undecided. Normally at this stage in the game, you should have 5 percent to 15 percent undecided. But 5 percent undecided and 5 percent are voting for somebody else.

BOLLING: The presidential debates are those -- they're the ones that will swing the enthusiasm. This is all just conjecture right now.

GUTFELD: But the thing is, right now, it's almost like Romney and Obama are in marriage counseling. They're not talking to each other, so they have to go to the therapist. He said this about building businesses. I did not say that!

The debate is when they have to talk to each other and it's still going to be about this point, Bob. It's still going to be about a philosophical difference. You know it is.


GUTFELD: You can't get away from it.

BECKEL: It's very simple. I mean, I think what you say is if Mitt Romney believes he wants to do George Bush policy, which was a disaster. If he wants to play that game, then that's fine.


TANTAROS: I don't think that's the choice, Bob. And that's not the one Obama's putting forth either.

BECKEL: What else is Romney putting forth? Tax cuts for the wealthy and what else?

TANTAROS: The opposite of the president, which is doing pretty well for him because he's leaving.

BECKEL: You go ahead and run on tax cuts for rich people and I think it's fairly small universe.

GUTFELD: Yes, it's called building the economy.

Content and Programming Copyright 2012 Fox News Network, LLC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Copyright 2012 CQ-Roll Call, Inc. All materials herein are protected by United States copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, displayed, published or broadcast without the prior written permission of CQ-Roll Call. You may not alter or remove any trademark, copyright or other notice from copies of the content.