The Indefinite Hiring Freeze

This is a rush transcript from "On the Record," October 20, 2009. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: Now for our "Government Gone Wild" segment.

Of the $787 billion stimulus package, so far about $116 billion has been spent. As you know, the point of the stimulus bill was to create jobs, and yet the unemployment numbers are bleak.

We are all very disappointed the unemployment rate is 9.8 percent, but tonight we know why. Joining us live is Steve Moore, senior economics writer for "The Wall Street Journal" editorial page.

And Steve, the numbers are still extraordinarily disappointing. I do not know when the stimulus will ever work. But, anyway, what is going on with the jobs?

STEVE MOORE, "WALL STREET JOURNAL": First of all, Greta, it is such a thrill to be able to follow Whoopi Goldberg. That was a great segment. I really enjoyed it.

I think what is going on with this job market is you have got Washington and Congress who are sort of at war was small businesses, with entrepreneurs, and with the free enterprise system.

And it's really clear to me that almost everything this Congress has done in the last year has been hostile and actually adverse to job creation.

And these were mentioned in the "Wall Street Journal" article by businesses, that they are very uncertain about the economic future because of the cap and trade bill that's making its way through Congress, the health care bill that has all these new taxes on businesses. They are worried about the debt and the taxes that come in 2011.

I can't point to a single thing that we've done in Washington that is helping small businesses create jobs. And as the White House said last week, they have only created 30,000 jobs with the stimulus bill through federal contracts.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK, President Obama won the election, and he and the Democratic congress, they got their shots with the $787 billion. The point was to stimulate jobs. We only have 30,000 jobs according to their website. We are now six or seven months into it.

At what point do they cry uncle and say this is not working? We have to try something. We have to liberate small business if that is the solution so that they hire people.

It is not bad if everybody who has a job, but, almost 10 percent of the people in the country are people who want jobs who do not have them.

MOORE: There is a lot of panic going on on Capitol Hill and in the White House because these employment numbers keep getting tragically worse each month. And there is a sense that things are not getting better.

And what our story in "The Journal" pointed out today is, yes, companies are seeing better profits, we are seeing a better stock market, which I'm all in favor of -- I'm an investor as you are and more people who are watching this show are investors.

The problem is the company's are making their profits by downsizing, by cutting staff, by laying off workers. And normally in this stage in the business cycle, Greta, you'd see businesses start to hire again as they feel more optimistic about the future and about the increased demand for their product. That's just not happening right now.

VAN SUSTEREN: Which is even more disturbing and more frightening. If businesses are learning that by doing this downsizing they're making more money, there is no hope for this almost 10 percent of people unemployed.

So what is the recipe to reverse this, because we can't sit and wait much longer?

MOORE: That's a good question, Greta. First of all, I would cancel the rest of the stimulus. The stimulus plan is a complete disaster. It has not worked to create jobs, and the White House should admit that this was a very expensive mistake.

And then we ought to use the money that we are not going to spend on all of these outrageous spending programs, like giving money to ACORN, and use that money to invest in tax cuts for businesses.

Two-thirds of jobs created in this economy -- and we know this from the last 30 or 40 years of evidence -- they come from entrepreneurs, they come from those small businesses that you were talking about, Greta. And right now small businesses are so fearful of what is happening in Washington that they are in no mood to add to their payrolls.

And the other problem to this is that a lot of these businesses, they have a lot of part-time workers. And we have talked about this. Now, what is going to happen is as they start to expand -- I think the economy is getting a little better -- they are not going to hire more workers. They're just going to give more work to these part-time workers.

So people without jobs, they are facing a very bleak situation over the next six months, in my opinion.

VAN SUSTEREN: And even more afterwards, they might be cooked. Anyway, Steve, thank you.

MOORE: It is just terrible.

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