This is a partial transcript from "The O'Reilly Factor," December 13, 2005, that has been edited for clarity.
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BILL O'REILLY, HOST: Now for the top story, two other views on this. Joining us from Washington, Jackson Bain, former NBC News correspondent, now chairman of his own communications company. Here in the studio, David Andelman, former CBS News correspondent, current executor editor of forbes.com. All right, am I completely crazy here, David, or what? What's going on?
DAVID ANDELMAN, EXECUTIVE EDITOR AT FORBES.COM: Not completely.
O'REILLY: Well, no, I'm going to go to David first and Jackson. I know you want to get that crazy thing in there, Jackson. Go ahead.
ANDELMAN: Not completely crazy. I would echo that sentiment. No, what's interesting here what we're talking about the print media, the print media is desperately scared. They are losing readers like crazy. And above all, they have lost touch with their audience. And that's the principal concern right here. Do they still have touch with their audience?
O'REILLY: Well, they obviously don't on this issue.
ANDELMAN: Well, exactly. And that is clearly evident because most of the people who go out and shop in their stores that are advertising in their newspapers, they want Christmas. In fact.
O'REILLY: But even polls, David, show that 95 percent of Americans celebrate Christmas. And about 45 percent are really teed off that certain stores won't say `Merry Christmas'. Why don't the newspapers — can't they read?
ANDELMAN: Well, that's the problem. People aren't reading as many newspapers as they ever used to. And that's their problem.
O'REILLY: No, but the papers themselves should understand the underlying anger.
ANDELMAN: They need to know their readers. And they don't. That's why their circulation is dropping.
O'REILLY: I see.
ANDELMAN: No, I'd like to...
O'REILLY: Go ahead.
JACKSON BAIN, FORMER NBC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: ...contribute to this thing, because I got to tell you, sitting in an editorial board meeting of a newspaper sometimes, sitting around the table with those guys, and what they're doing basically is not just thinking about, you know, what their circulation is and how many pages of advertisement — couple inches of advertising they have, although that's part of their jobs, they're also thinking about what's our community like? You know, how do we define our community?
And I think that somewhere around after Thanksgiving, everybody, you know, who's a newspaper editor reaches some kind of saturation point on angst and negative stories and polarization stories and things like that. And I think they frankly are looking for ways to diminish stories that pull people apart and try to.
O'REILLY: Oh, so you think they have a noble goal there in this?
BAIN: I think a lot of newspapers, listen to this, try this, Bill.
O'REILLY: All right, I'm trying, Jackson.
BAIN: I think a lot of people — a lot of newspapers are trying to make their communities better.
O'REILLY: Ah, yes.
ADELMAN: There's no nobility left in the American newspaper.
O'REILLY: Yes. Oh, I think that's a bunch of hooey. Now listen.
BAIN: I disagree.
O'REILLY: All right, well, listen, Jackson, we respect your opinion, but you're dead wrong on this one. Now.
BAIN: Well, maybe.
O'REILLY: In the South, Richmond Times, for example.
O'REILLY: Now this is a conservative city, Richmond. I mean, this is not Madison, Wisconsin, where you expect those people to be communing with Satan up there in the Madison, Wisconsin media.
O'REILLY: All right, but not in Richmond. Richmond. "Bill O'Reilly: Christmas lies Under Siege. Unless defended, it could even disappear." That's a lie and they know it's a lie.
BAIN: You know.
O'REILLY: And then they go, "Christmas vacation as winter break is in no way demeaning to Christmas." Come on.
BAIN: Bill, try this. The Richmond Times Dispatch is a great newspaper, but it also is one of those that is, in fact, I mean has a great editorial board. They're people who really are trying to define their community.
I look at places like The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, where Ralph McGill was a great editor.
O'REILLY: Crazy left wing paper.
BAIN: Yes, it sure was. Well.
O'REILLY: Well, it is now.
BAIN: Ralph McGill changed the South for the better.
O'REILLY: All right, but that was a long time ago.
O'REILLY: Now they have a woman running that paper.
BAIN: Let's go back 100 years ago and find out.
O'REILLY: All right, Jackson, look, I don't time to go back 100 years ago.
BAIN: All right.
O'REILLY: I got to stay right here in the present. Now.
BAIN: But what about.
O'REILLY: Wait a minute, Jackson. Let's go ahead.
Mr. Andelman, I think I have made a pretty persuasive case when only one newspaper in the country has weighed in on a positive realm on this. They're all other — are demonizing me or denying it exists.
I believe it's because most of these editorial boards do want a secular society. That's what it's about. Do you believe that?
ANDELMAN: Well, I don't know if they actively will go out and ask for a secular society.
ANDELMAN: I think they're looking for a society that will go along with their particular view of the world. And their particular view of the world.
O'REILLY: Which is?
ANDELMAN: Which is that, you know, a secular society.
BAIN: Could it possibly be a view of the world in which there's less fighting and more peace? We were talking about the present polarization.
O'REILLY: I mean, Jackson, you must be in a different country than I am. I've never — the print press in this country is as vicious as it comes. And for you to sit there in Washington and say.
O'REILLY: They're a bunch of benign little elves, trying to make things nice.
BAIN: There are.
O'REILLY: They are a bunch of vicious SOBs.
BAIN: I disagree. I disagree. They're very good guys.
O'REILLY: All right. I don't know how many more examples that I have to say. I mean, I've been called every name under the sun.
O'REILLY: Every name under the sun for trying to get a little respect for Christmas.
ANDELMAN: Bill, Bill, I've worked...
ANDELMAN: I've worked in three of the four major newspapers in the city. OK, and I can tell you.
O'REILLY: In New York City.
ANDELMAN: In New York City.
ANDELMAN: New York. The Post, not The Post, The Daily News, Newsday, and The New York Times. All right? There are some very good, solid professional journalists there...
ANDELMAN: ...who believe in reflecting the world around them, but now perhaps they've lost touch of the world around them.
O'REILLY: Well, there's no question they've lost touch about that.
BAIN: Well, I disagree.
O'REILLY: All right, gentleman, thanks very much.
BAIN: Thanks, Bill.
O'REILLY: Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, happy holidays. If I left anybody out, I'm very, very sorry.
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