This is a rush transcript from "The O'Reilly Factor," February 16, 2009. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
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BILL O'REILLY, HOST: In the "Factor Follow-up" segment tonight: There are now estimates the state of California, which is already on the verge of bankruptcy, will have to pay more than $2 million for the births and care of the octuplets.
In her book, "Guilty: Liberal Victims and Their Assault on America," Ann Coulter takes on single mothers who can't support their children, and now she feels somewhat vindicated. Ms. Coulter joins us here in L.A.
Is that correct? Do you feel somewhat vindicated?
Click here to watch the segment!
ANN COULTER, AUTHOR, "GUILTY": Well, it's interesting that everyone, even liberals who would defend a welfare mother who had 14 children by 14 different men, or maybe if the octo-mom had selectively aborted five of these children, I don't think you'd get the anger from the left. But I mean, it's the same thing whether she's having IVF for 14 children, or you have 14 women having IVF for one child. A little bit worse having her have all these children. But you know, what allows anyone to do it. You have a lot more of the welfare moms. It's because the government pays — is paying for everything for the octo-mom.
O'REILLY: They will pay — the government will wind up, unless she get — she was paid by NBC to do the interview with the "Today" show. I don't know how much, and you know, but she was. And she'll get some money from other tabs. But it's not going to be nearly enough...
COULTER: No.
O'REILLY: ...because these kids are going to have a lot of health problems. So the state of California, taxpayers are going to have to pay. But your point in the book is what?
COULTER: What happens to the children? And that's the point. If you didn't have the welfare system subsidizing the narcissistic choices of women like this, these 14 children would have a much better life.
O'REILLY: But what is the alternative if you don't subsidize children of irresponsible parents?
COULTER: Right.
O'REILLY: What do you do? Just let...
COULTER: Well, A, she probably couldn't have had the 14 children. I mean, she's on food stamps. She used...
O'REILLY: No, she used a settlement, a worker's comp...
COULTER: …disability.
O'REILLY: ...to pay for the in vitro.
COULTER: No, and disability payments from the government.
O'REILLY: Yeah, right.
COULTER: Because she's too disabled to sit at a computer terminal, but apparently is not disabled enough to have...
O'REILLY: We know it's a con, but the question for you though...
COULTER: Right, but it's a con that was paid for even up to this point by the government. So you already have the choice being made. Once the — you would have a lot fewer of those choices being made by women if they didn't have the government paying for it. Moreover...
O'REILLY: What — do you really believe that? I think that...
COULTER: Yes.
O'REILLY: ...those women are so troubled, they'd have the babies anyway.
COULTER: Illegitimacy has gone up nearly 400 percent since 1970. That is not an accident. That's not women who can have it anyway.
O'REILLY: No, but it's the permissive society in which we live. It used to be...
COULTER: Well, that's all part of it.
O'REILLY: Right, right.
COULTER: Yeah.
O'REILLY: But I think they would have the kids anyway. And you know, the welfare thing, I don't think that's on their mind.
But here's something interesting. The mail that I've gotten over this, and we were the first ones in the mass media to say this octuplet thing was bad. You remember the first two days, all the doctors were smiling and it was a big touchy feely...
COULTER: Well, at first we didn't know the details.
O'REILLY: …you know, and I said from the jump, this was bad. But you know who I've gotten mail from? I've gotten mail from the pro-life people saying, oh, you're a mean guy, O'Reilly. At least she didn't abort the babies, and then she gave birth.
COULTER: You know, can we have a standard higher than she didn't kill the kids?
O'REILLY: That's what I said.
COULTER: I feel like I'm in a world where people are defending, you know, wife-beaters, and saying well, at least he didn't kill her. Can we have a standard higher than that?
O'REILLY: But I didn't get any mail from lefties sticking up for her. I didn't get any mail from liberals sticking up for this woman.
COULTER: Well, I'd only taken you to the point where I do not believe so many women would be making the choice to irresponsibly have children without fathers. We only got to that point.
If the government were not going to be paying for these children for the rest of their lives, they'd be put up for adoption. They would grow up in wonderful homes. And as the research that I have found in researching Chapter 2 of my book demonstrated, children who are adopted turn out better than non-adopted children.
O'REILLY: It's a very interesting point, and of course, the government can't force anybody to do anything.
COULTER: No, but they're paying.
O'REILLY: What the government has to do...
COULTER: She would be forced to give them up for adoption if the government weren't paying her narcissistic choices.
O'REILLY: She'd be forced economically to do it.
COULTER: Right.
O'REILLY: She couldn't feed the family.
COULTER: Right.
O'REILLY: But see, our society's never going to tolerate that. It's never going to come to that.
COULTER: But now we're at the point where everyone's looking at it thinking I wish the state of California could take those poor innocent children who are being given the worst chances in life. I wish the state of California could step in and take them away. You don't need to take them away. You just don't need to pay for the bad choices.
O'REILLY: Well, you might need to take them away, because I believe this is child abuse and child neglect. And I — we petitioned the state of California to have an agent there on a daily basis to watch that these children aren't abused. How can they not be abused?
COULTER: Right.
O'REILLY: I mean, there's 14 children in a three bedroom place.
COULTER: Right, right.
O'REILLY: How you cannot be neglected when the diapers have to be changed? These kids are going to be up around the clock. Who's going to do that?
COULTER: Right. And as the research shows, even if there aren't 14 of them, without a father...
O'REILLY: So the state...
COULTER: ...they are starting life with the worst possible life chance.
O'REILLY: Right. There's no father and there's bankrupt grandparents. So I wouldn't be surprised somewhere along the line, the state of California does come in and take those kids out of the house.
COULTER: Well, I'd be in favor of that. I'm just saying that that is a more aggressive state action than the state simply withdrawing care, saying we're not going to pay for these narcissistic choices of yours.
O'REILLY: That's never going to happen in America.
COULTER: Well...
O'REILLY: It'll never happen.
COULTER: Well...
O'REILLY: You know?
COULTER: That's why I talk about what ought to be changed. I mean, it wasn't that way for the first 200 years of the country.
O'REILLY: No, it wasn't. We're enlightened now.
COULTER: It's possible to have a society like that.
O'REILLY: We've evolved now. We're enlightened now.
COULTER: And it's even worse under the stimulus bill. They've rolled back a lot of the provisions of the welfare bill. And by the way, when the welfare reform bill went through in 1996, the illegitimacy rate, which had been marching forward every year, suddenly halted.
O'REILLY: Right. Went down. All right.
COULTER: And went down in some segments, yes.
O'REILLY: Well, they're still going to say you're a mean person. You know that, right? You don't really care.
COULTER: They say that as long as I'm breathing.
O'REILLY: All right. Who's meaner, you or me?
COULTER: Ooh.
O'REILLY: That's a pretty good one, huh?
COULTER: That is.
O'REILLY: Next time, you tell me.
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