Published March 28, 2008
This is a rush transcript from "Hannity & Colmes," March 27, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
ALAN COLMES, CO-HOST: Reverend Jeremiah Wright triggered controversy with his comments from the pulpit and now another fiery pastor is caught on tape causing trouble for Barack Obama. This time, Harlem Minister James David Manning whose youtube broadcast captures him delivering some hate-filled sermons against the Illinois senator.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REV. JAMES DAVID MANNING, ITLAH WORLD MISSIONARY CHURCH: Obama is a Mac Daddy. Obama pimps white women and black women. He got started, you didn't notice him until he brought out those big-chested white women with their tight t-shirts and their short pants. That's what a pimp does. Oh, come on. You don't get your campaign started with a big-chested white woman. She must be a 54D, double D. I haven't trashed him. I haven't trashed Obama.
His African in heat father went a-whoring after a trashy white woman. He was born trash. I said he was born trash. I didn't trash him. I'm speaking the truth about him. Now, once again, I'm a diplomat, but I'm not a compromiser. I've got the word in my mouth. I said I've got the word of God in my mouth, and God's not afraid of Obama or anybody else.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLMES: So, is the pulpit the proper place for such commentary? With us now is the pastor of Harlem's Itlah World Missionary Church James David Manning. That's the person, you, the person we just saw on that type.
MANNING: The same one.
COLMES: Why do you say those things, calling him trash, saying, you know, a long-legged freak. And by the way, the video, he had nothing to do with that video. That was done independently of Obama.
MANNING: He could have put a disclaimer out about that but he hasn't.
COLMES: Yes, he has nothing to do with the video.
MANNING: But why doesn't he say he has nothing to do with it.
COLMES: But why do you preach such language in a Christian church?
MANNING: You know, when you consider who Obama is and what he's trying to do, and the danger that he represents for the African-American people, those words are mild compared to ...
COLMES: Calling him trash?
MANNING: Absolutely. Listen, Obama lied on his mother and his father by saying that they were — met at the Selmer march, which was not true. So, when a man lies on his mother and his father. I mean, what else can you say ...
COLMES: And then you go off on the — go ahead ...
MANNING: He lies about his grandmother and depicts her as a typical white racist. He ...
COLMES: That's not what he said by the way. He said —
MANNING: ... He said that she was a white person in turn...
COLMES: He said that it was generational.
MANNING: And she was also a racist.
COLMES: She said things on occasion that made him cringe.
MANNING: Well, at any rate, listen. A man that lies on his father and his mother, and I suspect there's a reason why he did that because of the things I said that he was born trash, and he was, but when you consider the fact that a man would lie on his mother and father.
COLMES: Isn't that? When you call somebody being born trash, isn't that hate speech?
MANNING: No, it's not hate speech. It's the truth. I mean, the bible calls people liars. When the bible refers to a person as a sinner, is a liar.
COLMES: Aren't you supposed to be preaching love and kindness and God-loving people.
MANNING: I do too.
COLMES: And not calling people names? Calling political opponents trash.
MANNING: You know, Alan, everything I do - I mean I've been a pastor for 27 years and everything I do is Biblically rude. And I mean.
COLMES: Where in the Bible does it say that Barack Obama is trash?
MANNING: Well, look and if you want to know. In the book of Psalms, chapter 51, verse 5.
COLMES: This is Barack Obama's trash.
MANNING: No, David, the great king said I was born in sin and shaped in inequity and sin did my mother conceived me and it was a trashy woman that conceived Barack Obama.
COLMES: And you talk about him having a white mother as if that somehow doesn't make him good enough as a black person? Because he has a white mother?
MANNING: No, I think that — what I'm trying to say with that is if black people are looking for a black president, then why don't they get a black president, get a black person who has a black father and a black mother rather than a mixture.
COLMES: So, he's not good enough. We shouldn't have a president who's half white and half black, that he should be automatically disqualified.
MANNING: But then don't call him a black president, then. And don't call him a black candidate.
SEAN HANNITY, CO-HOST: Pastor, wait a minute, I've got to get in here. I don't support Barack Obama's views. There is no — Barack Obama is a human being. He is a human being. You're a Christian, and you're calling him trash. You're calling his mother - wait a minute, a whore.
MANNING: I never called her a whore. I never did that.
HANNITY: Wait a minute, you said whoring father. You called his father, you called his mother a trashy white woman. Pastor, this is unacceptable. You cannot — this is — We will never have people run
MANNING: Sean ...
HANNITY: ... for office if they're going to be treated like this ...
MANNING: I think. Listen Sean ...
HANNITY: ... This is not fair to Barack Obama.
MANNING: Sean, if people are going to run for office, we need to have the things that they do that are noble, that are good, that are virtuous and decent. We need to put those on the table.
HANNITY: Pastor, do you believe God make trashy children?
MANNING: Can I finish? Wouldn't you agree that if you put the noble things on the table, we also need to know about the non-noble things, the awful things that people do as well?
HANNITY: Pastor, do you believe God created all human beings?
MANNING: I absolutely do.
HANNITY: Do you believe that Jesus is your personal lord and savior.
MANNING: Oh, he is. No doubt about that.
HANNITY: OK. So then, if God created all human beings, how can you say any one human being is trash? How do you say that about a man and attack him and attack his family and attack his mother and attack his father and his children?
MANNING: He attacked his mother and father long before I did.
HANNITY: No. You did.
MANNING: He did. He lied when he said his father and his mother met in Selma. That's an attack upon his mother. He attacked his grandmother by saying that she's a typical white racist.
HANNITY: But pastor, pastor this is unacceptable.
MANNING: I mean, he has done far worse that I've done. I'm mild as to what Barack himself had done with his own family.
HANNITY: But how could you say this, if you believe God created all human beings, how could you, he's not responsible. I don't know anything about his mother and father.
MANNING: Listen, Sean. I mean.
HANNITY: Wait, wait but he's running for president, it's not his parents running for president. You're attacking his mother. You're attacking his father and you're saying he was born trash. I disagree with Barack Obama, but I think he's a good man who has — he's wrong on his views, but he has good intentions.
MANNING: I disagree with you on that. I disagree with you that he's a good man.
HANNITY: Oh, come on.
MANNING: I mean, I'm entitled to my opinion.
HANNITY: This is terrible.
MANNING: Have you ever known — is it possible for you to ever know a person who is a bad person that has been born in this world that's an evil person?
HANNITY: You said he was born trash. He's a human being, Pastor.
MANNING: Let's talk general now. Because you are speaking as if no one can possibly be born evil or trash.
HANNITY: You know, I don't think Barack Obama is evil. And I don't think he was born trash. He's a human being.
MANNING: Let's just let go of Barack for just a moment. Is it possible that any person can be born such?
HANNITY: You know something, I don't know the mind of - I don't know the mind of God, but I think.
MANNING: And neither do I.
HANNITY: And I'm in political disagreement with Barack Obama, he was not born trash, he's a human being, and he deserves to be treated better.
MANNING: Sean, if we're going to talk about Barack's policies, we also have to talk about his character. Character matters.
HANNITY: We're never going to have good people run for office.
MANNING: Yes, we will, oh yes we will. Yes we will. Because there will be people who do not have the kind of baggage that Barack has.
HANNITY: There is no ...
MANNING: You have people who have integrity and people who also have those things in their background like Governor Patterson, for instance, who once appointed —
HANNITY: But you're saying he was born trash.
MANNING: Like Governor Paterson for instance who was appointed governor and then confessed all of his bad stuff.
COLMES: All right.
HANNITY: Welcome back to "Hannity and Colmes." We continue now with the Reverend James David Manning. I guess I can't convince you that I find the rhetoric — it's just funny because I'm sitting here talking to you off the air, we talked in the green room, and there's a lot we agree on politically, we don't believe Barack Obama's story about Jeremiah Wright, would you say?
HANNITY: What - I guess I'm having a hard time understanding is when you attack his — African in heat father who went after his whoring trashy white mother. And he was born trashy. I, for the life of me, find that language destructive. Can you explain to our audience, and I won't interrupt you. Explain why you used that.
MANNING: OK. I think what needs to happen in order to be able to understand the statements that I've made and the adjectives that I've used to described him, we need to look at this matter in the larger context. I see him as being a threat not only to America, that we should put the sovereign power of this nation into the hands of a man who I do not believe is a patriot. That's the first thing. But the other thing is that black people — for him he represents the worst possible person as a choice that they have made. Listen, would you agree that when black people en masse roll up and declare that William Jefferson Clinton was the first black president, and that there could no better black president better than him, that was an error, that that was an error in judgment? It was a wrong thing to do, it was a transference psychologically of black people.
HANNITY: We're short on time.
MANNING: Do you believe when Louis Farrakhan, when black folk run down to Washington?
HANNITY: I thought that was wrong, but there were people of all races there.
MANNING: Black people have consistently made the wrong choice in terms of their leader and Barack Hussein is the wrong choice.
HANNITY: Alright. Let me say this. Pastor, I agree. I don't, I have all fundamental political differences with Barack Obama, I think he would be bad for the country on national health care, on raising taxes, on the war in Iraq, and the battle on the war on terrorism, I think he's a bad choice, I think Hillary is a bad choice. My only disagreement with you is on the incendiary language that you're using, and by that I mean, you're attacking his mother, his father. You are saying that he was born trash. That's what I don't understand. You know something, fight him on the political issues, battle him, have a passionate debate, make your case but don't go personal to the point where I thinks his children hear this, his wife hears this. You know, I don't think this is good for the country to be debating.
MANNING: Do you know Prince Edward and Prince Harry, and we know who they are, and we also know who their parents are, and we extolled and exalt their parents, and then we make a relationship and a connection between their parents and them. Is that right.
COLMES: Pastor, let me — We're very short on time here.
MANNING: What you're saying and that it can only be done if it's good.
COLMES: But this is very important pastor. Let me pick up on this. We have a very short period of time here. You're calling — you're saying he's born evil. I want to pick up on that. You're a Christian man, you accept Jesus Christ as your savior.
Do you believe that God has babies who are born evil?
MANNING: David said in the Bible that I was born in sin and shaped in inequity and the next verse, 6 of Psalms 51, he says it was in sin that my mother conceived me. So, oh Lord, please forgive me and have mercy upon me.
COLMES: So, we're all born evil?
MANNING: Oh, absolutely. We're all born in sin.
COLMES: Is he more evil?
MANNING: Well, I suppose that's what he represents right now.
COLMES: Do you know the man?
MANNING: He has the opportunity to inflict more evil than I do at present.
COLMES: Have you ever met him?
MANNING: No, I haven't met hi.. But he does have the opportunity to inflict more evil.
COLMES: Whatever happened to judge not lest you be judged?
MANNING: What have happened to that is it has been grossly misinterpreted. There's no way that you can go through life without judging. It simply says whatever judgment you make there will be consequences, and as the consequences are, the judgments I'm making. You can't stop mading judgments. You made judgments about me. You make judgments all day long.
COLMES: I don't even know you, sir. All I know is what I've seen. I'm trying to talk to you now to understand you a little more. And you know, you're all over youtube so people get to see you there, but these are incendiary comments. It's not a rational conversation about as Sean would say political differences in the campaign, it's calling someone evil, saying they were born in trash, saying their father is ...
MANNING: We're not restricted — we're not restricted to policy when we're talking about electing a president. We have the right to discuss character.
COLMES: Why is he bad for the black community?
MANNING: What you, both you and Sean need to do is that you need to consider - well, I don't approve of the way in which you talk about his character, but you ought to give me the right to discuss it.
COLMES: You have the right. That's why you're here. But if you actually — You've said that he would actually be destructive to African-American people?
COLMES: Based on what?
MANNING: Because African-American people, they don't like hearing this but they have made wrong choices over the last 150 years, and over the last 50 years in particular, choosing Louis Farrakhan, choosing Bill Clinton, praising O.J. Simpson, and now they're choosing Barack Obama. These are wrong choices. And it's hurting and destroying people.
COLMES: Are you suggesting — are you saying blacks should choose conservatives? Is that what you're pointing?
MANNING: No, I'm not saying that but I think that you're misunderstanding the fact if you look at, if a man, the end results of a man's life of how he prospers in what he does, it can be a sign of the decisions that he makes. And then you look at the black people, African-American people here in America, we're at the bottom of the world social register.
COLMES: We have to run. We thank you for coming to talk to us. I think the language is way out of line.
MANNING: Thank you for having me.
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