Have historians re-imagined FDR's presidency?
Glenn Beck with Burton Folsom, Jr., Peter Lillback and Jerry Falwell, Jr.
This is a rush transcript from "Glenn Beck," May 21, 2010. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
GLENN BECK, HOST: Hello, America. And welcome to another founding Friday, or "Founders' Fridays." What do we call these things? "Founders' Fridays."
Have you guys been watching them — we have a new studio audience here tonight — have you guys been watching the "Founders' Fridays"?
BECK: OK. Have you learned a lot?
BECK: How many of you had heard of George Whitefield before, what was it, last week or the week before?
Three. Three people. Four.
It's — it kind of changes your outlook on things, doesn't it? It kind of make — things are starting to make sense. The more you learn.
I used to ask the question, how did we get here? Are you beginning to understand how we got here? And where we need to go again?
So, let me ask you this — because tonight, we want to do revisionist history. We want to correct some of the things that are happening, not just with the founders, but all across the board, and show you some of the examples of where history is just wrong.
You know, one of the things I learned when I first started doing television, it was so spooky. I was over at CNN. And —
BECK: Spooky for many reasons.
But I was over there, and I was one of my first days, I said, hey, do we have that story on such-and-such? And they said, yes, Glenn, it will be in just a second. It's being ingested into the system. I'm like, OK, that's spooky.
Ingested in the system and I think — do we use the same language here? Do you know?
Yes. It's a giant system. What it means is when the story is done, it's put in to the system, and then it can be called up anywhere in the world inside of the FOX system.
But what it made me think of is: what happens if the first person or the second person that's ingesting the story gets it wrong? Because every time you write a story, you bring up all those other stories and you check it against to make sure the facts — if somebody has gotten it wrong, every other story after it is wrong. That's the problem. That's kind of what's happening with our history.
Ask these — ask yourself these questions. Now, you may — because you have been watching — you may know the answers to some of these. But a year ago — a year ago — would you say that Washington was a — just a die-hard Christian? Would you say that? Yes, sir.
Who would say "yes"? A year ago? OK. So, there are four people.
Woodrow Wilson, I didn't know anything about Woodrow Wilson. I mean, a year ago, would you say, I don't know, I guess he was an OK president, OK? If you didn't know who — if you didn't watch the show — he was a horror show, wasn't he? A horror show, possibly the spookiest president we've ever had.
The New Deal — how many of us grew up in households that said the New Deal saved America, OK? All did. Now that you're learning something about the New Deal, did the New Deal save America?
BECK: What was the Great Depression called in the rest of the world? Thank you. Right here. Just "The Depression." Just "The Depression."
It wasn't great. They didn't try to social engineer their way out of it.
FDR, this one I've always — once this light went on in my head, I thought, wait a minute. FDR — did the American people love FDR? Did they?
Let me ask you this. If you have a president that everybody loved, why would you the minute the guy's body is cold rush to the Capitol to write a law that says, "By the way, we got to stop the term limits. We got to put term limits in now."
Why would you do that if he was so great? It doesn't make sense, does it? A good portion of the country, they had to amend the Constitution. That's a big deal.
A good portion of the country was terrified. They knew what kind of power this guy had amassed. Yet, we don't read about that. Nobody even ask that question.
CPI — has anybody heard of CPI? Hmm?
BECK: That would be CIP, CIEP.
BECK: It was actually under Woodrow Wilson. If you spoke out against the government, OK, or any of the policies, you could go to jail for 20 years. We have 30,000 people put in jail during World War I for speaking out.
If you read Cass Sunstein's words, it's these policies. Woodrow Wilson had spies. Woodrow Wilson what he called Four Minute Men where they would step up in the public square and they would give four-minute propaganda speeches.
And they were selected in each city, by — are you a mover or shaker? Are you somebody that people will listen to? It was propaganda.
How many people think the Nazis were the best at propaganda? How many people learned that, right? OK. Goebbels, right? They were great at it.
Do you know if you read the diaries of Goebbels — do you know — I remember I had one of my staff member, I said, look up propaganda, read this stuff. He was reading the diaries of Goebbels. He came in to my office and all the blood was drained out of his face. He said, can I read a passage, do you know where Goebbels said they learned propaganda? Woodrow Wilson's administration.
They learned it from us. They say that's why they lost World War I and they knew if you don't get into propaganda and you're at least as good as the progressives in America, you're going to lose.
How about this one? If I told you that $2 trillion went missing and Donald Rumsfeld stepped to the podium and said, "By the way, we can't find
$2 trillion, we're missing that $2 trillion" — would you believe that story? Ever heard it?
Watch the monitor. Watch the monitor.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD RUMSFELD, FMR. DEFENSE SECRETARY: According to some estimates, we cannot track $2.3 trillion in transactions.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BECK: According to some estimates, we can't find $2.3 trillion. Does anybody notice the date on that?
BECK: The day before 9/11.
So, the point is: history has got it wrong. You don't know about history. A lot of the stuff is revisionist intentionally. A lot of that stuff is happening because progressives need you to believe FDR was loved and the New Deal saved America. When the truth is the thing that they deleted from history, can anybody tell me about the depression of 1920? Nobody.
The depression of — you can, Steven?
AUDIENCE MEMBER: A little bit.
BECK: A little bit. Tell me what you know.
AUDIENCE MEMBER: I remember, (INAUDIBLE) dropped down to 50 percent. Is that what it was? And it was turned around in two years by cutting the government in half.
BECK: OK. Woodrow Wilson, progressives, gigantic government. We went in a depression as bad as 1930, OK? That's staggering.
Harding and Coolidge get in with Melon and they say, we're going to cut taxes I think from 75 percent to 24 percent. And we're going to cut our budget, our spending, in half. The Roaring Twenties. The Roaring Twenties.
History have been deleted and selectively put in. All you know is, oh, the Roaring Twenties were greedy. No, no, no. That's a problem with the people, not the system. That's a problem with the people.
Why did they just focus on the Roaring Twenties and not tell you what got the Roaring Twenties? Because it doesn't help their narrative of giant government.
So you have revisionist history, doing it intentionally. Sometimes, you just get it wrong because it's, like, it's ingested and it goes in the system and then somebody else reads history years later. And they're like, oh, yes, yes. Well, that guy, he's trust-worthy and he got it wrong.
Other times, things just happen. We're missing $2.3 trillion. We can't account for it. September 11th happens and priorities change. We've never gone back to that story.
How many things do you think are true that aren't? And what does it mean for the course of our country?
Tonight, we're going to try to get into that and we have a couple of experts. We have Peter Lillback. He's the author of "George Washington's Sacred Fire." It's a fantastic, fantastic book.
Peter, how are you, sir?
PETER LILLBACK, AUTHOR, "GEORGE WASHINGTON'S SACRED FIRE": Thank you.
BECK: Have a seat.
We also have with us Jerry Falwell, Jr. He's the chancellor of Liberty University.
And via satellite is Burton Folsom, Jr. He is the professor of history at Hillsdale College and author of the book, "New Deal, Raw Deal."
How are you, Burton?
BURTON FOLSOM JR., HILLSDALE COLLEGE HISTORY PROFESSOR: Hey, I'm doing fine, Glenn. Thank you.
BECK: Tell me — tell me the thing you found out about FDR and the New Deal. I mean, did you know all — when you started doing your research on how skewed history was?
FOLSOM: No. I was surprised. I knew we had problem under Roosevelt and the Great Depression after all lasted a whole decade. It was 20 percent unemployment in the United States, only 11 percent in the rest of the world. I didn't really understand why until I began to study Roosevelt's policies.
BECK: Did you — you know, I have up here on the board that people loved Roosevelt. Tell me who Henry Morgenthau was.
FOLSOM: Henry Morgenthau was Roosevelt's secretary of treasury. The two men were great friends.
BECK: And they — and they had, Morgenthau was really kind of one of the architects of the New Deal?
FOLSOM: He was.
FOLSOM: He'd been a friend of Roosevelt's for 20 years. They did socializing together, and they had lunch and dinner together. And they were great friends and cabinet meetings were important to both of them.
BECK: OK. Now take Burton off the screen for a second and I want to show a quote from Morgenthau if we have it. This is what Morgenthau said in, I think it was 1939, 1939. Do you have it up here for the screen?
He said, "We are spending more money than we have ever spent before and it does not work." This is the secretary of the treasury in 1939. "It does not work. I want to see the country prosperous. I want to see people get a job. We have never made good on our promises. I say, after eight years of this administration, we have had just as much unemployment as when we started, an enormous debt to boot."
Can you imagine the treasury secretary saying that and he's one of the designers? He's one of the designers.
FOLSOM: One of the architects.
BECK: So, Burton, how and why is that just erased from history?
FOLSOM: Well, I had to pull it out of the archives from in the Roosevelt Library in Hyde Park, New York. But it's an important quotation and it shows that even New Dealers themselves, Glenn, recognized after two terms of all of the spending, doubling the national debt, it had not worked. And unemployment was still higher than almost anywhere else in the world.
BECK: OK. So, now, Burton, give me the 1920s — the untold story of the 1920s. Give me some of the facts. We talked about the roughly —
BECK: — the depression of the 1920s that no one knows. Give them to me.
FOLSOM: Well, the 1920s, they're a decade in between Woodrow Wilson on one hand and Franklin Roosevelt on the other. It was a decade where the progressives were not in power. Wilson was out, Roosevelt, Franklin, was not yet in.
And so, what we have are Harding and Coolidge in the presidency. And what we see is that depression starting in 1920, 1921. We have unemployment at 12 percent. We have a lot of people arguing what we need is a stimulus package, government programs to build roads so that cars can drive on, that sort of thing, with government expense.
Harding and Coolidge say, no. We're going to trust our entrepreneurs to do the job. We're not going to try to micro-manage the economy.
They end up cutting the tax rate from 73 percent eventually to 25 percent at the top levels. And what we begin to see is a tremendous outpouring of entrepreneurship.
We get — I mean, radios are invented and expanded. We get air conditioning developed in the 1920s and the implications of that for the American South are tremendous. We get talking movies invented in the 1920s. Even the zipper and scotch tape are all inventions of 1920s.
We cut taxes. We turned the entrepreneurs loose, and that decade was tremendously prosperous. We ended that depression. We went from 12 percent unemployment in 1921 to 2 percent unemployment in 1923.
BECK: Burton, would you say that — I mean, I was thinking this the other day that, you know, Ronald Reagan said, that if freedom fails here, where will the rest of the world run?
BECK: And I was thinking about that phrase the other day and I thought, you know, we are the place that John Galt ran to in "Atlas Shrugged." That's America. But it required everybody there to not look for a handout.
And what the progressives try to do is make sure there are no peaks and valleys, that there's no good times and then a crash. A good time — that's not possible to create. There will be crashes. And there was crash after crash after crash, but they were short-lived crashes. We didn't go through long periods. They were just short-lived.
FOLSOM: That's right.
BECK: But those highs, that — nobody concentrates — everybody tries to concentrate on the Roaring Twenties as being the age of greed, but it wasn't for the average person. The average person, the life changed for most Americans in the 1920s, probably more dramatically than maybe any other time period up to then?
FOLSOM: I think you may be right. We had doubling or more than doubling in college enrollments. We had a higher rate of literacy in the 1920s than we have today in American society.
BECK: Holy cow.
FOLSOM: You get in the 1920s, Glenn, unemployment drops — in the Coolidge years, the unemployment is 3.3 percent average. Inflation, 1 percent. That's the lowest misery index of any president in the 20th century.
BECK: Real quick, and I have to take a break. I just want to finish up this segment here with Roosevelt. Roosevelt — am I wrong by saying there was a good portion of people that thought, holy cow, I'm glad he's dead, he was turning into a dictator?
FOLSOM: Well, that — there are a lot of people who thought that. And as you pointed out, we immediately had a constitutional amendment to prevent any other president serving longer than two terms. It's part of Roosevelt's success.
BECK: Just so people don't — because constitutional amendment doesn't happen anymore. Explain that that's not a one-part thing. You can't get a constitutional amendment through with one party.
FOLSOM: No. You had more than one party involved in this. Some of the Democrats went along with it as well. Many of the southern Democrats were upset with Roosevelt and the Republicans as well. And we just decided that two term limits was the best idea, that it had not worked well with four terms of Franklin Roosevelt.
BECK: Burton, thank you very much.
And I want to — I want to leave it there on Roosevelt. And now, I want to go to George Washington and "Sacred Fire" because two terms — two terms, there was a reason it was two terms. A reason. I'll explain in just a second.
BECK: All right. We're back with Peter Lillback and Jerry Falwell, Jr. from Liberty University.
And, Jerry, I don't mean to make you sit here quietly for a second. But I want to talk to you in the next break because you're a chancellor at a university. And you are trying to set things straight in your university. And I want to talk to you in a minute about how difficult it is in that position and finding professors that won't buy into revisionist history.
This is just a tremendous book. And I want to talk to you a little bit about, because what you do in this book is you say, OK, here's — here's the theory that you read about in the history bocks. And they say this. And then you just — it's an avalanche of information. I mean, it's just — it's startling there is so much proof that they're wrong. And it's all footnoted.
When you were writing this about George Washington, when you first saw this stuff, did you — did you have any idea on how wrong they have gotten George Washington?
LILLBACK: The only way I knew Washington was through his writers, through his historians. And everyone said he was a deist. He mocked the Scriptures. He only used it for humor if he ever did.
BECK: Hang on just a second. In case if you don't know what a deist is because it's not really popular and they weren't back then either, right?
BECK: A deist is somebody who believes in God as a watchmaker. That he just — he started things rolling and then — OK, have a good time, guys, I'm going to go over here and play pool. And so, it's just a machine that's running now. He doesn't believe — doesn't believe in Jesus or anything else, right?
LILLBACK: If you are a deist, why bother to pray, why do you need a clergymen, why do you need religion?
LILLBACK: Because God that started it, he's gone.
I was convinced because I read scholars that that was the case, and my heart was really kind of despairing and I started reading the quotes that those very authors had and I said, wait a second. That text they're using to support Washington as unbeliever, that he wrote has a Bible verse in it. But, apparently, the scholars who are reading it didn't know what the Bible was. Well, if you don't read the Bible, how are you going to recognize a Bible verse?
BECK: It's like the Declaration of Independence. It's riddled with Bible verses.
LILLBACK: That's right.
BECK: It's riddled with them.
LILLBACK: So, I started going through, and lo and behold, in the very books that were advertising the unbelief of Washington and his text, there they were filled with references that these guys don't see what they're seeing. They can't be right.
And so, I was astounded by the time, 15 years later working on it, just how much material there is to show that he had a vibrant personal Anglican or Episcopalian Christian faith.
BECK: Right. So, you believe it was an error of history, that they just didn't know — or this was a purposeful change in him?
LILLBACK: I think there's an element of both. We can really see a shift that occurred at the bicentennial celebration of Washington's birth. That's in the early 1900s, 1930.
BECK: Wait a minute, the progressive era?
LILLBACK: The progressive era.
BECK: Who would have guessed that?
BECK: That's weird! OK.
LILLBACK: In other words, a devout evangelical Christian Founding Father didn't play well for those that wanted to move beyond Christian influence and government —
LILLBACK: — and western civilization. So they needed a more secular Washington, and scholars found a way to prevent him in that form.
BECK: I have to tell you, I know what is on top of the Washington Memorial and I know the stairs. But the way you describe it, I'm going to see if I can take the cameras into the Washington Memorial because it needs to be seen. And I think there's a reason it's not seen anymore.
Explain what's on the top of the Washington Memorial in Washington. Nothing can be built higher than this for this reason and the stairs.
LILLBACK: So, here's this obelisk that towers over the great city of Washington, D.C. And every morning, as the sun comes up, it gets to see only the words that God and the sun can see. And it's in Latin "Praise to God." In other words, here was a life who said his whole goal was bring praise and glory to God. That's Washington's own words, said that's the passion of my heart is to bring honor to God who made me.
BECK: The stairs?
LILLBACK: The stairs, as you walk up, you can't walk up them today. They won't let — they'll make you take the elevator. Of course, they think your heart can't handle it.
LILLBACK: I think it's a form of historical revisionism. They don't want you to see as you go up the stairs that there are Bible verses from the Proverbs all the way up to the top that were supplied by American people as they built that building —
BECK: Each state and different organizations built it, right?
LILLBACK: So, it's filled with different regions with scriptural messages, filled to the glory of God, reflecting the kind of faith that America had believing consistent with their Founding Father. I hope you can get the cameras in there and show them someday.
LILLBACK: You need to show the nation.
BECK: We will.
LILLBACK: Because it's extraordinary.
BECK: We will.
LILLBACK: Apparently, I can't prove this, but I've heard that there is a copy of the top on the Washington Monument that's on display in a museum in Washington, but it has been carefully turned so you can't see the Latin words. So, you won't have the ability to test —
BECK: Tiffany? Tiffany?
TIFFANY, BECK PRODUCER: Yes?
BECK: Our executive producer, will you find out if that's true or not?
TIFFANY: We will find out if that's true.
BECK: All right. Watchdogs. E-mail us.
LILLBACK: I heard that said so many times, it must be true. So, what I would love to have happened is to say, all right, you keep hiding the text that's on the top. But let's send the camera over and see what you're not letting anybody else see.
BECK: OK. Back in just a second.
BECK: We're back with Peter Lillback, Jerry Falwell Jr. and Burton Folsom Jr. Let me go to the first junior, Jerry Falwell Jr. You're at Liberty University. Do you have a hard time finding teachers that will — professors that will teach?
JERRY FALWELL, JR., LIBERTY UNIVERSITY: No, because we don't have much competition for the professors who have the values that are important to Liberty, the ones who are willing to teach true history about our founding principles. We have a unique mission in that regards so, no, we have not had trouble finding teachers, but we do screen them very, very closely.
BECK: What is your name there? Shoshana. You were saying in the break. How old are you?
SHOSHANA OCCHIPINTI, STUDENT: I'm 17.
BECK: You are 17 and do you learn any of this in school?
OCCHIPINTI: I have learned none of this. I mean, I would have loved to, but I've learned absolutely none of it.
FALWELL: We see that a lot with students from public schools who are taught that the founding fathers were anti-God, anti-religion that they didn't want any mention of God in the public square.
So we really have to have a special course that is required of all students called Foundations of Government, government do something that sort of does what the public schools no longer do that brings them up to where the 16-year-olds were a generation ago.
BECK: Can I ask you a question? Because there are people watching and they will say well, see, now, this is a bunch of religious people that just want religion taught and crammed down for instance. I have no problem if you want to teach evolution as a theory.
FALWELL: We do. We use the same textbooks as any other university. We teach it as a theory. We also teach some of the flaws of the theory. We have many students who transfer to Liberty because of the lack of academic freedom at secular university.
FALWELL: They're ridiculed because they are conservatives. The professors use the "f" word to describe them in class in front of their students. So they come to Liberty because we have — you can discuss all the views and all thoughts. But conservative views are just an Athema at many universities.
BECK: So, but what I want to ask is, you know, if you are looking to the history of our country. And you know, George Washington, any doubt that this man was an amazing God-fearing Christian. Didn't he try to build it — wasn't our army a Christian army? His words, not mine.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right. He called them Christian soldiers defending the dearest liberties of their nation.
BECK: OK. So, you have that going on. People will say, well, you're just trying to build a big Christian army here. The truth about the found — Peter, I'm sure you know this. I don't know if you know this. I don't mean to put you on the spot, but they were the biggest defenders of other religions.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's correct.
BECK: Were they not?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe they were.
BECK: Yes. I mean, they were the Father Abraham story from George Whitefield, and Sam Adams when they got together in the First Continental Congress. Do you know this, Peter?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
BECK: Yes, so they got together and they defended, they would go around and testify in court for other religions. You don't, I mean here you are an evangelical university and you ask me, a Mormon, to speak, a lot of people have a problem with that.
FALWELL: Well, but my father in the last generation he formed (moral) majority is coalition between Mormons, Catholics, Protestants. People who have no faith, Jewish people who just believe three core issues.
They believe in the support for state of Israel, strong national defense and pro-life. Those were the three issues that united all those groups and that's all it was.
BECK: But isn't that, Peter, what the founders were trying to get to? Your father was just really repeating and that's what we need to get to again is people — as Thomas Jefferson said if it neither breaks my leg nor picks my pocket, what difference does it make? It doesn't affect me.
We need to get back to where we're tolerant of other people's views. It doesn't mean that we don't vigorously defend our point of view, but we are tolerant of other's faith, et cetera, et cetera.
But it seems to me that we are entering a bigoted — the people who are called bigoted, people who are called bigoted are the ones who are saying no, no, no. Wait a minute. No, wait a minute. I don't have a problem with teaching that. You do.
FALWELL: That's why we have so many students transfer to Liberty because they're faced with religious bigotry at other universities and we believe in diversity of ideas and we don't put a cap on what can be discussed. There is more freedom at Liberty. I'm told by students who have been there for two or three years than secular universities.
BECK: I have interns that go to school at several universities here in New York. They don't feel comfortable saying they work for me or for Fox. They don't feel comfortable — I've had one of them say to me, no, no, I mean, we joke. It's the Glenn Beck witness protection program. I mean, it's amazing. OK, we'll be right back in just a second.
BECK: We're back now with Peter Lillback, Jerry Falwell Jr. and Burton Folsom Jr, and I want to make a correction here. In the monologue, and Burton, you can correct me here on this. In the opening monologue of the program, I said that Woodrow Wilson had 30,000 people in jail. We think the number was, how many, 2,000, 3,000 people?
BURTON FOLSOM JR., HISTORY PROFESSOR, HILLSDALE COLLEGE: I don't have the number, Glenn, but a lot of people were jailed. I mean, Eugene V. Debs. The head of the Socialist party was in jailed. A lot of newspapers were shut down, especially German American newspaper, absolutely, shutdown. A lot of civil liberty problems under Wilson.
BECK: And real quick. I have been concerned about the about the new Supreme Court justice saying if you are caught off the battlefield and you have to written a check to al Qaeda or a terrorist organization is what they say, we can hold you without a trial or due process indefinitely.
And you know, with all those stuff talking about Miranda right and suspending your rights as a citizen, et cetera, et cetera, people say it can't happen here in America. Burton, would you like to tell me about the citizens under FDR that lost their rights?
FOLSOM: Yes, of course, we had under President Roosevelt, we had Moses Hannenberg went to prison for an income tax violation, but Lyndon Johnson who also violated — had income tax violations had IRS called off because Johnson was critical to helping Roosevelt in the state of Texas.
BECK: I'm sorry. I was actually thinking about the Japanese Americans and the German Americans that were here. We rounded them up!
FOLSOM: We rounded up over a hundred thousand Japanese Americans and we put them into — what they called relocation camps and Roosevelt signed the order for that. We had evidence that we could have let them out very easily in 1944, but Roosevelt would not do so because he thought it might hurt him in carrying the western states when he was running for his fourth term for re-election.
BECK: Never forget my grandparents were big supporters of FDR, but that was the one thing they kept saying because they lived right down the street from Japanese family that lost their form. They thought it was criminal. Just thought it was absolutely criminal, and it was.
So let me go here, the university system before — you know, during the revolution, et cetera, et cetera, totally different than it is now.
FALWELL: Before you spoke at the commencement the other day, we had baccalaureate service the night before and I reminded the students that the baccalaureate service was started at Oxford University in 1432.
Every batch there had to give sermon in Latin to graduate. The tradition continued into American history because most of the universities here were founded to train ministers of the gospel, but now because of the revisionist history and the separation of church and state, it's no longer allowed at public universities.
So I reminded them that's one of the privileges that they have of attending Liberty University. We continue that tradition, but there is so much revisionist history. They are not taught about how FDR tightened the money supply, increased taxes and linked them to depression for 15 years. They're not taught that John F. Kennedy had lowered taxes and had years of prosperity or that Ronald Reagan —
BECK: No way that JFK would even be welcome in the Democratic —
FALWELL: No way. No way. Ronald Reagan lowered taxes and we had years of prosperity. They are not taught any of that, but that is the purpose of Liberty University. That's what we are.
BECK: I hate reading history books now without a ton of original sources all through it because they are guessing. They're not really going back to the original.
There are two lies, I think that are so powerful. One that you are not qualified to teach your children. You got to have to have some expert do it. Two, you need a historian to tell you. Didn't George Whit — is it Whit or Whiff? He taught George Washington and it was all original sources.
That was the idea, wasn't it? Go back to the original source, not somebody's interpretation of it.
LILLBACK: That was the beginning of western civilizations. We know it going to Erasmus at the beginning of Protestant reformation. The phrase was "ad fontase." Go to the fountains. Don't listen to what some scholar tells you, because he may be lying to you. Look at the text. That was in the biblical sense. What does the bible say? What did Augustine say? What did Calvin say? What did George Washington? What did the constitution say?
BECK: Isn't it amazing when you get away, when somebody says don't read the bible. You come to me for that and I'll tell you what it says. When you create that system, you create a system of corruption. That's what we have created on everything. A hundred years ago, people used to argue the constitutionality of things.
When the Dread Scott law was passed in the Supreme Court, people stood up and said — no, that's not right. It was the court that did it and the people said not — over my dead body are we going to do that. They knew that now we just look to experts. They just said. They just said. Who the heck are "they"? They just said.
LILLBACK: There's a famous victim that historians use and that is the living can make the dead do any tricks that they find necessary.
BECK: Back in just a minute.
BECK: We're back with Peter Lillback and Jerry Falwell Jr. and also Burton Folsom Jr. is with us and the studio audience here in New York. Start in the back, what was your question or your thought?
CRAIG KAY, STUDENT: I was going to say, in middle school, I only learned one year of American history and now in high school, I'm only learning one year of American history, which is this year. Every other class, freshman, junior and senior, we learn European, world. You don't learn American history. So, you know, we have to have more years of American history.
BECK: Is it true? I don't know if it actually passed. There's one state that is now trying to push that there will be no American history, it will be only global history prior to I think it's 1880.
FALWELL: I hadn't heard that.
BECK: I'm pretty sure that's true. It's — coincidentally about the time that the progressives started to come around.
BARBARA SUMMERS, RETIRED REAL ESTATE AGENT: But my question is why is this not being taught in our schools? Our tradition notice here — it is scary, what I'm learning today, what is happening right now in our present.
If you don't know your history, you are designed to do the same thing in the present and the future. Our kids should know this. This is very, very spooky. I'm very afraid learning what I'm learning how because it's still going on now.
BECK: Burton, let me ask you that question. Can you answer that? Because you're the guy who studied the new deal and you also know Woodrow Wilson. Can you not look at Woodrow Wilson and almost see what is coming next with this administration?
FOLSOM: Well, you can, because Wilson did not like the constitution. The constitution was too limiting.
FOLSOM: Wilson wanted to redistribute wealth and take from some and give to others. That's not equality of opportunity.
BECK: Would you say — because I never got the impression that FDR had contempt for America, but I think Woodrow Wilson did. I think —
FOLSOM: I think you are right.
BECK: And a lot of people would speculate that maybe Barack Obama has a little contempt for history of America or America or western civilization. Do you see a pattern or a similarity between the two of them in that?
FOLSOM: I think in that instance you're right. Franklin Roosevelt, his ancestry went way back and he did in his own way had a love for America that Wilson and Obama simply do not quite share. At least they don't share any kind of respect, deep respect for the constitution. Wilson thought it was out-moded and so does Barack Obama.
BECK: Right. It's that — they don't necessarily hate it, but it's just that it was a nice thing in the past. Let's move on from that.
FOLSOM: It worked in 1776, but today we can trust leaders with more power.
BECK: Right, and didn't — who was it? I think it was Wilson who said don't read the declaration of independence. Life, liberty and pursuit of happiness was for then only and the constitution also, we're only supposed to read parts of it. We're not supposed to read the preamble, right? Isn't that what he said?
FOLSOM: Yes and he just didn't like the idea of equal rights for all. He liked the idea of no checks and balances. He wasn't liking that centralized power.
BECK: OK, back in just a second.
BECK: I want to thank our guests and leave Jerry Falwell Jr. with the last word.
FALWELL: Liberty University will continue to teach economic justice, what the founders meant. If you earn the money and if work hard you keep it.
BECK: God bless you. From New York, good night, America.
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