• With: Gov. Rick Perry, R-Texas

    CAVUTO: All right. So you do not think there will be any conservatives dragging their feet or doing as they did in 1976, not voting for Jimmy Carter after their candidate, Ronald Reagan, narrowly lost the nomination to Gerald Ford, but just not voting at all?

    You think they'll still vote, still come out...

    (CROSSTALK)

    PERRY: I never thought -- I never thought there would be anybody that would make Jimmy Carter look good. Barack Obama is doing it.

    CAVUTO: All right.

    On Barack Obama and on this economy, the White House has been arguing things are looking better. Some of these slowing economic numbers notwithstanding, the trend is their friend.

    You disagree. You see things reversing here? What?

    PERRY: Well, I don't know whether they will reverse or not.

    We just found ourselves in such a deep hole that quit digging. That's the first thing you do when that occurs and start putting policies into place. If this president cares about this country, he'll work on the tax structure. He'll quit spending money that we don't have.

    Look, this is a spending problem that we have got in Washington, D.C. And the idea that you can continue to spend and spend and it's not going to have an impact -- Tom Coburn had some very startling remarks just yesterday, when he talked about the precipice that this country's on.

    I agree with him. I think we have to make changes, and we have to make changes in a hurry. And Mitt Romney understands that. Barack Obama has clearly showed us what direction he wants to take America, both economically and internationally. And I’m not sure that the bulk of the Americans really want that when we look at the out-years.

    CAVUTO: If we, God forbid, are looking at another meltdown in the fall, Governor, or even sooner -- some have said that a lot of these banks are still in precarious positions. Certainly, the world doesn't look much better at this moment.

    Would you advise Governor Romney, as the likely Republican nominee, to advocate not helping banks, not bailing out any banks? He was for those bailouts. You were critical of that during the nominating process. Would you still feel the same way?

    PERRY: I think Mitt today understands that too big to fail -- and I have heard him say that on numerous occasions -- is not appropriate, and that the economic models of supply and demand, they work. The simplicity of that is truly important for to us get back to.

    And bailing out, whether it's Wall Street or whether it's motor companies, is bad public policy. We have bankruptcy laws in place to sort through those types of bad decision-makings and people that have -- maybe by no fault of their own, but they went bankrupt. And you restructure and go through it.

    (CROSSTALK)

    CAVUTO: I apologize, sir.

    But you do you think that this is what is helping the president, these bailouts; say what you will of them? In key swing states, where they've been the big beneficiaries, the numbers are swinging the president's way.

    Karl Rove, in fact, has the president at a distinct electoral vote advantage because of that, not exclusively because of that. But what do you make of that? Do you think Karl's electoral math is right? The president has a clear edge?

    PERRY: I have no idea whether his map's right. And I don't think anyone else has an idea whether that's right or not.

    The issue is we've got to do what is right for the long-term country’s benefit. And bailing out corporate entities that are -- quote -- "too big to fail," bailing out car companies are not in this country's best interests.

    I'll guarantee you, had GM gone through the type of restructuring, people would have still had their jobs, they would still had their pensions, and the company would have been more stable. And I will suggest to you, Michigan’s economy would be in better shape...

    CAVUTO: All right.

    PERRY: ... both short-term and long-term, with that type of thoughtful approach, rather than government coming in, putting untold amounts of money into it, a few people making out like bandits on Wall Street, but the American people really taking a bath.

    CAVUTO: Governor Perry, good seeing you again. Thank you very much.

    PERRY: Neil, it's good to see you. God bless you.

    CAVUTO: Same here, Governor Perry.

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