• With: Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano

    He cannot simply wave a magic wand and get a bill through for a -- particularly for such a large complicated issue as immigration. We just, you know, we really need the Congress to take this on and take this on in a serious fashion. Otherwise it is an issue that continues to drive people apart and in a way that is not healthy for our country.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Is it only the Republicans, in your mind, that are in the way of this?

    NAPOLITANO: I think if they indicated a willingness to sit down the Democrats would be willing to sit down as well. There is a reasonable middle ground in the sense of dealing with updating the enforcement of the laws, dealing with the future flows of temporary workers, and then dealing realistically with those illegally in the country by making them pay a fine, requiring them to learn English, requiring them to give us their identification, their biometrics so we know who they are, and be crime- free.

    And then at some point they can get online and apply for citizenship. They will have gotten right with the law.

    And then we can focus our attention where law enforcement wants to focus its attention, which is on those who are endangering our public safety and engaged in the trafficking of drugs and the trafficking of children and human trafficking, all the other transnational crimes that occur.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Republicans want to do it in two stages, so they say -- first secure the border, and then do a comprehensive immigration reform, whatever that might be. The Democrats and the president want to do it at once. Do you have any objection of doing it in the two-part way? At least that may move it forward.

    NAPOLITANO: If I knew what was meant by secure the border that would be one thing. But the Department of Homeland Security has been meeting every congressional mandate in that sense. You know, we are using the monies that are appropriated to us to enforce the laws that we have to enforce border security.

    In my judgment, what is happening is, the goal posts keep moving as a way of not getting out what needs to happen, which is you need to have immigration reform. And that's part and parcel of our national security effort, because we need to know who in our country. And we need to be able to enforce the rules of who is coming in and out.

    The law that is on our books right now does not meet our current needs. We need the Congress to fix it.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Good luck. Fat chance and good luck in terms of getting Congress to do it.

    NAPOLITANO: Hope springs eternal.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Thank you.

    NAPOLITANO: Thank you.