• With: Dr. Michael Baden

    VAN SUSTEREN: Well, that's not...

    BADEN: ... positions of the two people.

    VAN SUSTEREN: But that's not what they're trying to establish.

    BADEN: Right. Right.

    VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Well, I'll ask you later, but that's not what they're really trying to establish. They're trying to establish the gap. But let me ask you about something else...

    BADEN: You can't tell the gap from...

    VAN SUSTEREN: ... I don't want to run out of time, but -- can you tell the fact of a gap? Maybe you can't measure the precise gap, but the fact of a gap?

    BADEN: Yes, you could tell that. The clothing -- the spread on the clothing is different than the spread on the skin. So you can say there was a gap, but you can't tell how much of a gap.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Great. OK. Now, here's the Florida medical examiner testifying today in court about Zimmerman's injuries.


    UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are the injuries to the back of the defendant's head consistent with having been repeatedly slammed into a concrete surface?



    RAO: Because if you look at the injuries, they're so minor that to me, the word "slam" implies great force. And this -- the resultant injuries are not great force.


    VAN SUSTEREN: Dr. Baden, your thoughts? And I should say -- I should mention the fact that this doctor looked at photographs, didn't actually examine George Zimmerman right after the incident. But tell me whether -- what do you think about her testimony?

    BADEN: I think that her testimony was very reasonable because she did look at medical records and the EMS records and doctor records that we received.

    And what it is, he has multiple injuries on the back of the head and the nose. But nothing was serious enough, as thought by the EMS people, by the doctors who -- doctors who examined him to require stitches, to require an X-ray, to require further evaluation, that he was not disoriented, he was walking, talking immediately after this. His blood pressure was fine. He wasn't breathing hard. All of this would indicate that the injuries themselves were minor.

    However, we can't tell how many injuries. We can tell at least one or two injuries, or three to the head. But many injuries don't leave any marks on the body, so we can never tell the total number of injuries.

    VAN SUSTEREN: All right, in terms of those injuries, could they be sustained by someone punching someone in the face and the person falling, or do you have to be -- do you have to sort of at least multiple times have to hit that head, and maybe even be on that person?

    BADEN: Well, I think that a fall, a punch in the face and a fall down and hitting the head against the concrete would create -- could create all the injuries, actually, because of the shape of the head.

    But there could be many impacts that don't leave an injury, so we can't identify those. We know they weren't serious. And there was a discussion about the shape of the head. Everybody's head is different. They're not perfectly round. So we have lumps and bumps. And there was a fellow, Lombroso, who thought they could tell criminality from the bumps on the head, the natural bumps on the head. And that's what appeared to be...

    VAN SUSTEREN: Would those bumps hurt?

    BADEN: ... what was pointed out. They can hurt. Sure, they can hurt.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Do those injuries look like they hurt? They can hurt?

    BADEN: Yes.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Dr. Baden, thank you, sir.