• With: Pat Buchanan

    This is a rush transcript from "On the Record," June 20, 2013. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

    GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: No, they are not line dancing, but is the Tea Party picking up steam from the IRS bonus outrage? Former senior adviser to President Reagan Pat Buchanan joins us. Nice to see you, Pat.

    PAT BUCHANAN, FORMER REAGAN ADVISER: Good to see you, Greta.

    VAN SUSTEREN: So the IRS is slated to give $70 million in bonuses.

    BUCHANAN: The IRS -- the $70 million in bonuses and the Las Vegas trips and the line dancing and the systemic abuse of the Tea Party and these other conservative folks. What they have done is they have basically proven the indictment of the Tea Party of the Obama administration and big government, that it's too intrusive, it's too big, it's too hostile to the average individual. They've made the case.

    And what they've done also, Barack Obama villainized these folks in 2011 and 2012. And in 2013, it turns out they have been victimized by the Obama regime!

    I think this is -- they're in an ideal position for the Tea Party and the election of 2014 and for the Republicans and the conservatives. The case has been made! We've got a big, intrusive government -- IRS, NSA, you name it.

    VAN SUSTEREN: You know, it's interesting how people have gone after the Tea Party. They're not into the social issues which so often divide us and create such passion, they just don't like big government. They don't like the IRS. And frankly, now they've been proven to have a good reason not like the IRS. They're a little bit suspicious of the NSA spying on them, and they -- and they -- and they question issues about immigration.

    That's all! And for some reason, there's some people that are totally unglued both in the Republican and the Democratic Party about them.

    BUCHANAN: Well, I think one reason they came unglued, the Democrats, is the Tea Party was tremendously instrumental in what, a 60-vote pickup or something like that back in 2010. And so they were demonized, and their approval rating went down from about, I guess, you know, 50 percent or so, went down and down and down, and then they tie them to the Republicans and hope that's going to sink the Republicans.

    But what happened? Hey, these guys were telling the truth when they talked about the IRS, when they talked about big government! The points they made, as I said -- the indictment of the -- by the Tea Party of big government has been validated by the way they've been treated!

    VAN SUSTEREN: And you know, now -- as far as we know, they don't advocate bombing police stations...

    BUCHANAN: No.

    VAN SUSTEREN: ... or -- or, you know, mowing down the state capitol or targeting any politicians.

    BUCHANAN: Remember 2009, where they -- they had one camera after camera going around. They finally found one guy apparently had a holstered gun who showed up at a rally. I mean, with due respect, some of the media went out to demonize them and paint them -- paint them as -- what is that phrase they use on -- on -- in Great Britain, they use on the right wing out there? These guys are all swivel-eyed (ph) loons. That's exactly what they tried to do to the Tea Party. But as I said, The Tea Party's in the catbird seat right now. They were right!

    VAN SUSTEREN: You know what's interesting is that when I talk to them -- you know, I always say to them, when I come here at night, I say, What do you do when you're not, you know, coming here as a Tea Party representative? Well, I'm a lawyer, I'm an accountant, I'm a pilot for American Airlines. So that -- I mean, they -- if you actually dig into their backgrounds, these are people who just, you know, lawful citizens who finally have just had enough!

    BUCHANAN: You know, and this is one of the things that makes what the IRS did so malevolent and vicious. You're right. Here's folks who got very excited in 2009. We'll all going to get into politics. They're forming groups in towns and four and five people. Let's send our documents over to the IRS.

    And then to have them systematically slow-walked, withheld, questioned and harassed as though they were a bunch of Nazis and destroy that enthusiasm and basically deprive them of their right to participate in democratic government is really inherently outrageous, what those Tea Party -- I mean, what that IRS did.

    And it -- and it -- you know, Greta, it makes another point. Barack Obama found out his Cincinnati office of 80 people were hassling and harassing these people three years and three months after it started going on. His whole Washington office -- We didn't know anything.

    What does that tell you? It tells you that the government has gotten so big that it really is out of control. It doesn't know what itself is doing!

    VAN SUSTEREN: You know, it's -- this administration, others, and people don't want to profile. We don't profile by race. We don't profile by religion. And when anyone gets caught profiling, everybody has a stroke about it, as they should, is because of the -- that it's not a good thing. Yet it's OK to profile the Tea Party.

    BUCHANAN: Sure.

    VAN SUSTEREN: It's OK -- it's OK to target -- I mean, when the IRS targets them, they are profiling them! But for some reason, it's open season on them!

    BUCHANAN: Yes, these -- they come to rallies and they bring all these flags. Keep an eye out for those guys.

    (LAUGHTER)

    VAN SUSTEREN: I don't think anyone -- I mean, like -- I mean, it's just stunning (INAUDIBLE) All right, who has -- who has more to fear from the Tea Party, the president, the Republicans or the Democrats?

    BUCHANAN: I think the Republican Party has -- I think the Tea Party is in the catbird seat, as Mr. Nixon used to say, and I think the Republican Party is for 2014 because what is their issue? They say, We're the party of the private sector. Government's gotten too big and intrusive.

    And what have they got? They got the NSA -- whatever you say about it, even those of us who think some things have to be done, they're going to get everybody's e-mails and everybody's phone calls. They get access to that. They got the IRS is out of control. They got the attorney general is going after journalists and he doesn't even tell the president. And you got a commander-in-chief or rather a chief executive who doesn't know what is going on.

    If he were the head of a corporation, he'd be at that same place today where that guy is says, "You're going to like the way you look."

    (LAUGHTER)

    BUCHANAN: Out of a job today. Seriously! A board of directors, would say, you know, Mr. Executive, you didn't know this, this, this, this? I mean, it's like the fellow at Enron. He didn't know anything of what was going on! Out he went!