• With: Newt Gingrich

    GINGRICH: It's the stealth aspect getting to China, in particular, to learn how to make stealth equipment. I suspect -- I don't think -- I think the electronics were probably wiped clean.

    VAN SUSTEREN: All right, Pakistan, things are getting bleaker.

    GINGRICH: Yes.

    VAN SUSTEREN: What would you do as president with Pakistan?

    GINGRICH: I think you need a whole new strategy for the whole region. I think that the -- the fact is, things are spinning out of control. And the extremist elements are more and more powerful. One of the things you've got to do is go back and liberate the intelligence community to actually have real spies. Today, we are so crippled by congressional limitation that our intelligence agency relies on people like the Pakistanis to tell us what's going on. I mean, it's truly bizarre. I mean, so...

    VAN SUSTEREN: Well, our...

    (CROSSTALK)

    VAN SUSTEREN: Our intelligence has -- I mean, it's failed us even in recent history with weapons of mass destruction. I mean, the...

    GINGRICH: Right. And the large part of it's because they have been crippled now since 1975 by more and more congressional limitations, so that you have -- you basically have to have a lawyer next to you. You can't leave the embassy. You don't go out and do any real spying anymore.

    VAN SUSTEREN: So what would you have -- what would you have happen, using Pakistan as an example?

    GINGRICH: I would want to have people who penetrate Pakistani society and spend a long time, don't go anywhere near the embassy, are actually in the community, try to understand what's really going on. I'd also try, frankly, to hire a bunch of Pakistanis. I mean, a lot of this is just tradecraft.

    VAN SUSTEREN: But a lot of -- I mean, a lot of Pakistanis, they just -- I mean, I've -- when I've been there, when you read in the newspaper, talking to people, they don't -- not only do they not trust us, but they don't particularly like us. And you've got the problem with the military, the ISI. You've got the civilian government being (INAUDIBLE) And the situation is deteriorating rather quickly. I think what you're suggesting would take quite some time. It seems to have a more urgent element to it.

    GINGRICH: Well, it does have a more urgent element. And I think what you're going to discover is we have very few options that are any good. In fact, we are in a precarious situation in Afghanistan because Pakistan can cut off the supply lines from the south, and it could become a real mess almost overnight.

    VAN SUSTEREN: So what would you do urgently, rather than -- I see long -- I understand your idea for long term with changing the ability...

    GINGRICH: Well, what I -- what I would do...

    VAN SUSTEREN: ... of collecting intelligence, but short term.

    GINGRICH: What I would do urgently is communicate a sense of sincerity to the Pakistanis and remind them that it would not be all that hard for us to become India's ally and for them to be totally isolated.

    VAN SUSTEREN: All right. A Gingrich presidency -- give me an idea -- every president, for instance, at least in recent history, has had a member of the opposing party in the cabinet. Who would you think of in a Gingrich -- who from the Democrats?

    GINGRICH: I haven't thought that far ahead.

    VAN SUSTEREN: I know -- you're an idea guy. You think about everything. I know that you think about that. I mean, what Democrat do you think is someone you could work with in an important cabinet-level job?

    GINGRICH: I mean, I'm not going to jump into that right now. But there are -- I would look for moderate Democrats who are comfortable with the program I'm outlining and who are interested in trying to develop a way to move forward as Americans.

    I mean, my campaign is going to be an American campaign. It's not going to be a Republican campaign. It's going to say everybody in America who'd rather have a paycheck than food stamps, we'd like you to be with us. Everybody who'd like to go back to a balanced budget, we'd like you to be with us. Everybody who wants an American energy program that liberates us from the Middle East, we'd like you to be with us, without regard to party. And we'll try to build a very broad-based approach that attracts a lot of people who aren't just Republicans.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Well, I'm sort of curious. I think, you know, what -- I guess I was trying to identify sort of what you think has been done well in the Obama administration, just for a point of reference. For instance, how has Secretary of State Clinton done?

    GINGRICH: Well, I think she's got a hopeless problem. I mean, this is an administration that does not want to recognize that there are people in Islam that are radicals who want to kill us. They're having a conference where they -- I mean, she attacks Israel because of discrimination against women and is meeting next week with a group based in Saudi Arabia. Now, if you just think about that framework, I mean, it makes no sense at all.

    Leon Panetta attacks Israel for not negotiating at a time when the Palestinian Liberation Authority refuses to recognize Israel's right to exist. The ambassador to Belgium, the American ambassador to Belgium says Muslim anti-Semitism is caused by Israel.

    Now, this -- I mean, I don't know if the Obama administration is waging psychological warfare against Israel or what. They ought to fire the ambassador to Belgium. They ought to look very seriously look at cleaning out the people who are pro-Islamic extremists in the State Department and Justice Department. The Justice Department now takes out all references to Islam in its papers on terrorism. I mean, this'd be like taking out communism in a paper on the Soviet Union.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Isn't it sort of the nature of (INAUDIBLE) government, is that we -- many times that we do get forced into, you know, things that are -- look totally hypocritical or totally inconsistent because there are so many variables and sort of...

    (CROSSTALK)

    GINGRICH: I think this is an ideological world.

    VAN SUSTEREN: I don't mean this particular example, but just anything. I mean, the squawking this week about the Republicans putting up some resistance to extending the payroll tax cut, and then of course, the Democrats say, Well, the Republicans, you know, want to raise your taxes. I mean, no matter -- I mean...

    GINGRICH: A lot of this is politics.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Well, that's what I mean. A lot -- we've got a lot of politics. It's really sort of hard to navigate and find, you know, sort of...

    GINGRICH: It's a complicated business.

    VAN SUSTEREN: It's a very complicated business, isn't it.

    GINGRICH: But part of the reason that Reagan was so good was he understood that you had to be consistent and you had to be repetitive and you had to cheerfully persist in a way that you eventually broke through. It works.

    VAN SUSTEREN: Having fun?

    GINGRICH: Yes, I am. It's a remarkably fascinating experience. And you know, Callista and I have had just an amazing run of meeting people and campaigning and wandering around the country. It's been very, very exciting.

    VAN SUSTEREN: What's the hardest part?

    GINGRICH: Oh, I think -- you know, I think getting attacked. I mean, the fact is, no matter how tough you are and no matter how thick your skin gets, you still flinch a little bit when people go after you, particularly if they go after you personally or they go after your family personally. It still hurts.